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As The World Turns Discussion Thread


edgeofnik

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I think there were some references to Margo's past and how she had been the other woman, as Barbara could throw this around as a reason to have no remorse for her actions. 

 

Barbara was stuck in a rut as a character, and the show already had enough heroines in that age range, so having her decide she'd had her fill and move toward scheming and selfishness could work. 

 

Marland seemed content to make various character changes when he took over - Kim and Betsy began sharing far fewer scenes, Steve's uglier qualities were magnified, Margo and Tom lost a lot of their humor and quirkiness (which I think was a real mistake - presumably Marland agreed, as he brought that back 2 recasts and about half a decade later...). Certain longtime characters like Maggie were casually written out and their loved ones all but forgot their existence. 

 

I suppose in Barbara's case, it didn't matter as much because she was not in a good place when her heel turn began. The turn is one-note, but does have some entertaining moments, helped by Colleen's ice-cold portrayal. 

 

Something does start to get lost as 1986 progresses - she feels more and more like a plot device, especially in her affair with Tonio (a role that always felt somewhat miscast to me). Fortunately her relationship with Hal turns things around and makes her feel more rounded, connecting the old Barbara to the new. 

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Posted (edited)

Barbara was never and could never stay a vixen, just like she could never remain a heroine/ingenue perpetually. It is par for the course that the character would have a reset. All I'm saying is why not embrace the journey while you're at it?

Technically, JR Ewing was one note but that didn't stop him from embracing the role and all that came with it.

Which is likely why Larry Hagman landed on the covers of magazine and decades after Dallas went off the air, people still remember the character.

Edited by DramatistDreamer
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10 minutes ago, DramatistDreamer said:

Barbara was never and could never stay a vixen, just like she could never remain a heroine/ingenue perpetually. It is par for the course that the character would have a reset. All I'm saying is why not embrace the journey while you're at it?

Technically, JR Ewing was one note but that didn't stop him from embracing the role and all that came with it.

Which is likely why Larry Hagman landed on the covers of magazine and decades after Dallas went off the air, people still remember the character.

 

I have to admit I have no real idea what parts of Barbara's time as a vixen that Colleen has complained about. I was just speaking generally about the character rather than her feelings.

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1 hour ago, Soapsuds said:

@DRW50 Who would you have cast as Tonio? Since you thought Peter Boynton  was a miscast.

 

Probably someone like James Horan, who was able to play a complicated, brooding lothario/quasi-heel on Loving several years later. 

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Posted (edited)

I wonder whether an actual Latino actor would have thought the character bordered stereotypes too closely. I didn't have a problem with Boynton, although, on a few occasions, I did sometimes find myself unintentionally laughing at things in his performance that weren't meant to be funny. 

 

Most of the Montegan characters were played by Latinos (except for Finn), it might been more effective if Tonio had been portrayed by a Latino actor.

Edited by DramatistDreamer
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I don't think it would've mattered who played Tonio---I think Marland purposely kept the character one-dimensional to facilitate story. He's really like a short-term character (like Philip Lombard, say) who just kept weaseling his way around town.

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8 hours ago, P.J. said:

I don't think it would've mattered who played Tonio---I think Marland purposely kept the character one-dimensional to facilitate story. He's really like a short-term character (like Philip Lombard, say) who just kept weaseling his way around town.

 

I would tend to agree, it's just when we get to the point where the character keeps sleeping with so many beautiful, sexy women, nothing against Peter Boynton, who was fine in other moments, but I don't think he had the charisma to pull that off.

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From a 1995 SOD interview with La Hubbard

'Another time they wrote something that offended me and I checked it with Tamara (Tunie ex Jessica). Lucinda was supposed to say, 'I know what it is to be a black woman. I know because I had a hard childhood.' I said, 'What? This is insulting'. I don't know how I changed it, but I changed it, she recalls.

On the other hand, concedes Hubbard, People who are writing soaps, they write so fast ,they don't always have time for the finer points.

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10 minutes ago, Paul Raven said:

From a 1995 SOD interview with La Hubbard

'Another time they wrote something that offended me and I checked it with Tamara (Tunie ex Jessica). Lucinda was supposed to say, 'I know what it is to be a black woman. I know because I had a hard childhood.' I said, 'What? This is insulting'. I don't know how I changed it, but I changed it, she recalls.

On the other hand, concedes Hubbard, People who are writing soaps, they write so fast ,they don't always have time for the finer points.

 

That sounds like something Lucinda might have said, but I can see why she changed it.

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3 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

That sounds like something Lucinda might have said, but I can see why she changed it.

Yes, if the line was there to point out Lucinda's ignorance and Jessica put her on blast, that's one thing, but it appears the script left Lucinda unchallenged so Liz nixed it.

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Lucinda was known for making off the wall statements.

Remember when she was in the midst of a rant about Montega and randomly blurted out "I liked him...he had beautiful eyelashes!" Someone said it was ad-libbed, not written in the script, but zany nonetheless and nobody said "what now??"

 

That reminds me of what I have read about how strongly Caroll O'Connor reacted to dialogue written for Archie Bunker.

 

I'd would like to read that script.

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Something I noticed over the years I watched ATWT (after Marland’s death unfortunately), was just how lost people sometimes looked during her adlibs, especially the newer actors.  I also saw both Martha and Jon Hensley breaking character reacting to her spinning out trying to get back to what she was supposed to be saying.  She’s a brilliant actress, but doesn’t come across as always a good scene partner.

 

People like Nancy Lee Grahn, Tony Geary, and Tristan Rogers also ad lib a lot.  But their scene partners rarely look as lost or just plain annoyed as hers sometimes did.  Not that Nancy and Tony didn’t sometimes derail things and noticeably try to get back on track.  It just happened less that when I was watching Lucinda.

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, titan1978 said:

Something I noticed over the years I watched ATWT (after Marland’s death unfortunately), was just how lost people sometimes looked during her adlibs, especially the newer actors.  I also saw both Martha and Jon Hensley breaking character reacting to her spinning out trying to get back to what she was supposed to be saying.  She’s a brilliant actress, but doesn’t come across as always a good scene partner.

 

Sadly, that nay be one of the key reasons why Lucinda had no serious, and long-term other pairings, other than John Dixon (although you can see attempts with characters, here and there).

 

Something came to mind in reading your post-- silence doesn't always equal consent. Scene partners (and the director) who allow another actor to go off on an ad-libbing tangent may not agree with it yet will let it go because in the fast-paced environment of daytime soaps, it might be easier and cost effective to just move on with the scene, rather than stopping to reshoot, particularly if the tangent is not too disruptive to the central drama.

This is not to slight Hubbard at all, who did some memorable, wonderful work but from the perspective of a writer who has also done some acting (onstage), it can be taxing for everyone--scene partners, director and writers to consistently have to deal that one actor who is always going off script.

Edited by DramatistDreamer
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