Members Sylph Posted July 23, 2008 Author Members Share Posted July 23, 2008 I mean, Cat, who does this sort of pure geniality today? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Cat Posted July 23, 2008 Members Share Posted July 23, 2008 Nobody I know. Although the number of soap writers -- heck the writers here on this board -- who look up to the legacy left behind by Irma Philips and her spiritual children William J Bell, Douglas Marland and Agnes Nixon... who pour over every episode they ever wrote, every script and bible they ever penned... who look to Paul Avila Mayer, the Dobsons, Claire Labine and Nancy Curlee and other 70s and 80s trail-blazers for further inspiration... who practice, rewrite, create new characters with backstories and psychological dimension, with one eye on Douglas Marland's famous rules pinned above their computer monitor... Well, that's why I have hope in the Daytime soap genre. Because everything comes in cycles and one day, eventually, a spark of talent initially inspired by these greats will burst into flame. Perhaps not WJB genius per se, but writing with respect and and eye for characters and romance and suspense and making every scene count. In the meantime, I'm not averse to some soap history and nostalgia -- and learning something new about those who set the standard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members koos Posted July 24, 2008 Members Share Posted July 24, 2008 Is there ANY footage of the Bell Days saved anywhere? Between the first two episode, and some ep from 1977 or something, there seems to be nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Paul Raven Posted July 25, 2008 Members Share Posted July 25, 2008 Here's another perspective of that era,taken from "The Soap Opera Book" Days of Our Lives is an NBC California show which premiered in 1965 and went to an hour in 1975.It is the show which begins with a rather lengthy and distraught prologue,followed by a logo which consists of an hourglass,under which the voice of MacDonald Carey is heard to say,”As sands through the hourglass so are the days of our lives. The shows head writer is Pat Falken Smith. The twelve month outline or “bible” is provided by Bill Bell.,who also writes The Young and the Restless. Days of Our Lives is known as the most daring of soaps-given to racy love scenes,interracial romances,artificial insemination,and discussions of frigidity and impotence. It has even shown a young man who believed he was homosexual(he was soon set right)When bona fide homosexuality finally appears in daytime,it is expected to appear first on Days of Our Lives. The show is not,for all this,racy. Very little is going on here that isn't going on elsewhere. The characters simply appear more frustrated about it. The show is not licentious:it is horny. Many of the characters suffer from unrequited or unconsummated love. Much of the sexuality is conveyed by conversation,erotic facial posing. and suggestive music.. The content is surprisingly staid. There is emphasis on formal,sacred arrangements. Marriage,engagement-even living together-continually merit the attention of Grandmother Alice Horton,a warm and tolerant matriach who is known to be religious. Conventional values are espoused(though not always honored)by the entire Horton family. Run-around women remember romantic tunes from the past and long for settled family life. This is not altogether a racy soap. It is,however,a sensuous,darkly romantic soap. It does not seem to be set in the same apple-pie normal towns as,.say.,All My Children or As the World Turns. There is little overt optimism. The message seems to be that we are all very deep and driven people;that we can get by only if we learn to accept help(therapy or love)from others.”we all have problems,but if we tackle those problems together,they van be overcome...”says a typical character at a group meeting. The vocabulary of the show is heavily psychiatric. Character”space out”,have”hang ups”,attempt to get their”heads straight on”.They tell each other”stop playing therapist”,or “stop analyzing me”.One character is told rather bluntly that “they goes through therapists,like a kid goes through a box of crackerjacks”.It seems a justifiable complaint. This is a show on which the psychiatrist has a breakdown,and even the wise Grandmother Horton is heard to say that she hopes “to get her head together”. Thematic material is consistent with this psychiatric style. Characters endure much stress as a result of secrets from the past(which is thematically equivalent to the unconscious).An unusual number of children do not know who mommy or daddy is. and there is a lot of sexual rivalry and interest between generations.(Julie's is endlessly in love with,and now married to,her mother's ex-husband:Trish was pursued by her stepfather,while Mary is attracted to,yet repulsed by hers). Love is also a heavy matter. Whereas most soaps have enough trouble simply throwing lovers together,this one must tackle the problems of impotence and frigidity. “Making love is psychological as well as physical,”remarks one of the show's amateur therapists. And so it is. Despite the rational overlay of psychiatric concept,Days of Our Lives,does seem to believe in what we might call sexual determinism:various characters are inexplicably and fatally drawn to each other(and just as inexplicably and fatally attached to someone else). On Days we don't find”true love”so much as grand passion. When Robert LeClare of”Doug's Place” sings “The Girl I Love Belongs to Somebody Else”he is singing everybody's theme song,including his own. Because characters seem to be ruled by inexplicable passions and attachments,motivation is not always obvious. It is not clear why characters do the things they do.(“All you can say about these people is that they're awfully mixed up”,is one viewer's comment) The on and off romances of Doug and Julie and Amanda and Neil are historical cases in point. It's not clear why the women change their minds-why Amanda would adamantly refuse to marry Neil one moment,then,on his wedding night,leave a message on his answering service reversing her decision(too late,of course)Nor is it clear why Neil would rush into another marriage on a mere refusal from this changeable woman. Over the years Julie's manouvers(with every man in town)have been no better motivated,thigh surely as interesting. Stylistically,the show is ultra romantic West-coast elegance. There is intensity,but not much action. Much is conveyed by position of characters vis-a-vis each other-by romantic tableau,in other words. Lighting is suggestive and moody. Faces are made up(even when a character comes out of brain surgery,she wears eye-shadow). Music tends to be hypnotic,repetitive,though there are occasional bursts of old romantic songs,either in the soundtrack or in the nightclub setting of “Doug's Place”. The sound is well controlled for romantic effect. Thunderclaps come at the end of sentences:and when two characters are talking in “Doug's Place”,that Place,though packed,will be quiet as a tomb. The pace of drama is,according to reviewer Jon-Michael Reed,a”deadly,snail's pace”.The stories are “interminably prolonged to incredible proportions.” In many scenes,there is a sensuous,sleepwalky tone that is neither unattractive nor inconsistent with the heavy theme of the drama. And virtually everyone has noticed that this soap has some of the genre's most accomplished handwringers. Susan Seaforth Hayes(Julie) and Bill Hayes(Doug) are perhaps the most popular couple in daytime TV. They even made the cover of Time magazine,. Other stars with vocal fan followings are Patty Weaver(Trish Clayton),Jed Allan(Don Craig),Wesley Eure(Mike Horton),Deidre Hall (Marlena Evans) and Tina Andres (Valerie Grant).The show receives more than a little publicity,and attracts a particularly devoted fan following. It falls in the middle range of soap popularity,with between five and six million households tuning in each day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members sungrey Posted July 25, 2008 Members Share Posted July 25, 2008 I don't know what the battles with Pat and NBC were all about -- be it money, creative control, etc., but Pat was a gifted and extremely talented headwriter who could really pen some spectacular stuff. You could do this back then on a half-hour show, but I still marvel that Pat wrote every Friday show herself. Every line of dialogue. She didn't use anyone on her staff for the Friday shows, it was almost like she wanted to shape the content and the cliffhanger on her own without someone messing it up. For that, I say I'm not worthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Cat Posted July 26, 2008 Members Share Posted July 26, 2008 I feel like this puts into words everything I have been looking for in a soap over the past decade -- and have so far failed to find. ^^ Sungrey, your post underscores the importance of - a good HW and their almost complete autonomy in writing a show, and - smaller writing teams where the HW has a hand in crafting the breakdown/dialogue his or herself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Sylph Posted July 26, 2008 Author Members Share Posted July 26, 2008 I wonder where LoyaltoAMC is... He should know a thing or two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Sedrick Posted July 30, 2008 Members Share Posted July 30, 2008 Thank you so much for your kinds words! I'll start a new thread tomorrow on this subject as soon as I pull a few books off the shelf that reference the tale... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Paul Raven Posted July 30, 2008 Members Share Posted July 30, 2008 Here's a SOD synopsis from April 76 when Pat Falken Smith was writing under Bell's direction. I wonder how this was worked out how mich imput did Pat have? What were the circumstances of the lawsuit that saw her depart Days the first and second times? April 76 Mickey's vigil at Mike's bedside is rewarded when Mike regains consciousness to find his father at his side, holding his hand. Dr. Powell is eager to return Mickey to the sanitarium. Once there, he gives Mickey a new room and new freedoms. Mickey can go and come when he likes in the hospital, itself, and can even take walks outside, with an attendant. As part of his freedom, Mickey visits the day room where he meets other patients with various conditions. He is especially attracted to Barbara Randolph, a woman who thinks her son is dead. Mickey tells Barbara that he, too, has lost a son. Bill has reinjured his wounded arm when he lifted Mike off the floor, but refuses to let his father know. He does admit to Tommy that numbness has increased in his arm. Tommy is disturbed to find the lesion in Amanda's head has grown. It is essential that an angiography be performed to determine if the lesion is a tumor or an aneurysm. Greg has been elected has been elected to tell Amanda she must decide whether to have the exploratory surgery or not. Amanda is well aware that the angiography could prove fatal, but it is her only change for survival, as well. She tells Greg she needs to be alone, and, after Greg leaves, she reads part of her mother's diary again as well as the twenty-third Psalm from the Bible. When Neil arrives to comfort and advise her, Amanda again states her need for solitude. Mary had been instrumental in Neil being with Amanda. Mary has had Neil call Phyllis to tell her he's detained at the hospital. However, the duplicity comes to light when Phyllis and Mary arrive at Doug's Place and find Neil sitting at a table with Maggie. Maggie, in order to compete with all the beautiful women in Mickey's life, has completely revamped herself. With Julie's help and clothes, Maggie is now a knockout. Doug has invited Julie and the new Maggie to his club, has sung "The Most Beautiful Girl in the World" to them, and has provided champagne and flowers for Maggie's "debut." Neil agrees that perhaps Julie should see Amanda and offers to keep Maggie company while Julie's gone. Phyllis misinterprets Neil's motives, and with Mary and Maggie out of earshot in the powder room, Phyllis accused Neil of trying to seduce Maggie. He startles Phyllis and the other diners by yelling: "The hell with it. I don't give a damn what you think!" and rushed back to Amanda's. Neil leaving the elevator, finds Julie in tears outside Amanda's door. Julie tells him that she feels she's failed to help Amanda and that all Amanda needs right now is the man who loves her. Phyllis continues to put her worst foot forward. Her jealousy has driven her to go to Amanda's in search of Neil. Once there, however, she hasn't the courage to ring the bell. Convinced that Neil has spent the night with Amanda, Phyllis asks Don to start a divorce action for her. Don advises her to give it a few days thought before making a decision. Julie had berated Phyllis about Phyllis' jealousy of Maggie. Now as Phyllis leaves Don's office, she asks Julie to please take Amanda's portrait out of Phyllis' shop. She intimates that the painting is no good and won't possibly sell. Julie arrives at the shop in time to hear a customer asking Mary about the painting. The customer, after meeting Julie, agrees to pay $1500 for the painting, introduces herself as Sharon Duval and invites Julie to have tea with her, to discuss the possibility of Julie painting Sharon's portrait. Mary tells Phyllis about the transaction and adds that she's glad Julie held out for the high price on Amanda's portrait because Amanda is not a cut-rate lady. Phyllis Learns the Truth Mary also explains Amanda's condition to Phyllis in response to Phyllis' mentioning her desire to divorce Neil. Neil refuses to discuss anything with Phyllis. His only concern is Amanda. Phyllis decides to go away to allow Neil the freedom to be with Amanda until she has recovered. Phyllis realizes how foolish she's been, and in a note to Neil, compares herself to a woman who has dug her own grave, yet doesn't understand why. Amanda has alarmed everyone by not showing up at the hospital as planned. She finally appears and explains her need to visit her mother's grave and to take one long look at life all about her -- especially the children -- before submitting to the operation. Greg assures her that she will be fine and that he and Amanda will have children of their own. Rebecca still has not told Johnny that the child she's carrying is not his. She also refuses to have sex with him before their wedding, though she does admit that playing the blushing bride is a bit ludicrous in her pregnant condition. Greg and Neil amaze Amanda by being nice to each other at her apartment, just as Don and Doug amaze Julie by chummily singing together after ruining her evening with their jealousy. Mickey doesn't care if Mike is told the truth. He feels nothing for the boy. Tom has elicited this response after Bill has urged Tom that Mike must be told, for fear Mike will learn the truth from other sources. Brooke is furious when Adele loses the rent money and the super demands they vacate by the end of the month. Bob and Julie's divorce is final at last. Love Between David and Val David and Valerie are feeling a lot more for each other than friendship, but fail to realize it. All they seem able to do is bicker constantly. Adele's concern over Brooke has driven her deeper into the bottle. The Grants have taken Adele in and put her to bed, but not before Adele has begged them to keep Bob and Brooke apart. Brooke has threatened to find Bob and tell him she's his daughter and demand financial assistance. After all, if Bob can take care of two ex-wives, then Brooke and Adele should have their share, as well. Bob finds Brooke at Phyllis' shop and offers to give her a check when she asks for it, but demands that Brooke stop belittling him to his face. Bob and Mary then take Brooke to the Grants' to see Adele. Trish is reunited with her long-lost mother at Doug's Place. As Trish is singing, Jeri suddenly joins her on stage and sings with her. Jeri gives Trish an expensive brooch and explains her year away from Trish as one of great success professionally. Privately, Jeri admits to Doug that it's been a rotten year of failure; that she spent her last cent on the brooch and is now broke. Greg is hurt by Amanda's turning to Neil for comfort and assurance, prior to her entering the hospital for her test. Neil has spent the night at her bedside, soothing and reassuring her. Greg feels Amanda will hate herself when she regains her health and realizes she's come between Neil and Phyllis. Julie is all set to resume her love making with Doug, but ends up angry and frustrated, instead. As Doug and Julie begin to rediscover each other, Rebecca phones Doug to say that Hope has had a nightmare and is calling for her daddy. As Doug prepares to run home to Hope, Julie accuses him of letting his child run his life and tells him not to bother coming back. Doug arrives home to find Hope asleep in lullabying Robert's arms, tucks her into bed and then tries to reach Julie by phone. Julie's too mad to answer, but does accept Doug's apology the next morning when he shows up with a wilted rose in his hand. Doug has come to drive Julie to the hospital to be with Amanda. Amanda's plight makes Doug face the briefness of life and he vows to never again let his child interfere with his own happiness. Mickey's Love for Mike Bill and Laura have had to change their minds about telling Mike. Bill has found crumpled letters written by Mickey to Mike. Bill gives one letter to Mike. Mike is deeply touched to reach of his father's loving and needing him. Amanda Lives!! The exploratory surgery was a "success". Amanda does, however, have a brain tumor and should be operated on at once. Neil attempts to convince Amanda to have the surgery immediately, but fails. Amanda is so insistent in her pleas for "just a few days", that Neil, against his better judgment agrees. Amanda's fight and lust for life continues to have sobering effects on everyone. Julie realizes that life is too short to waste. "I want to be with you", Julie confesses to Doug. They agree to take things one day at a time and enjoy each other fully. Maggie and Mickey Divorce? Mickey asks Maggie for a divorce. Maggie pleads with him not to ask this of her. She tells him that she loves him and that she wants to be his wife -- always. Her pleas fall on deaf ears -- Mickey seems determined. As he later tells Dr. Powell, he feels that all he can offer her is her freedom. Linda has been getting it from all sides. After being pressured by Laura and Maggie to tell Mickey the truth about Melissa; she does so. Mickey is not surprised and vows that he has love only for his "son" Mike. Doug's Other Woman While Doug and Julie are enjoying a romantic dinner; an unexpected visitor arrives at his home. He and Julie stop off at his place before continuing their loving evening together. He quickly sees the error of his ways when the beautiful Kim walks out of his guest room! Julie is needless to say flabbergasted! Julie's surprise quickly turns to anger when Kim makes it clear that she intends to stay and stay and stay. Doug handles the situation very poorly and Julie leaves in a huff. It's the end of another beautiful beginning for Doug and Julie. Wait 'til she finds out that Kim is Doug's heretofore secret ex-wife!!! At Rebecca and Johnny's wedding shower, Phyllis runs into Amanda. She apologizes profusely for her past behavior and says "if Neil can give you the courage and strength you need, then I want him to be with you." Phyllis later tells Bob that she wants to make a go of her marriage with Neil, if he will have her. Greg stops by Susan's to bring her to Rebecca and Johnny's shower. He is dismayed when he learns that she and Eric have not been to the sex therapy clinic yet. When he tries to talk to her about it further, she declines. When Kim arrives at the shower, Don sees her and is aghast. He has obviously been smitten. Julie and Doug talk about Kim. Julie wonders if Doug is in love with her. Although Doug assures her he isn't, he does admit that he's letting Kim stay on as she's "broke." Rebecca knows that she must tell Johnny the truth about the baby. How? When? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Sedrick Posted July 30, 2008 Members Share Posted July 30, 2008 FYI... From what I understand, and I maybe wrong on this, but the entire run of DAYS, from Day One (as well as Y&R) still exists in the Sony (via Columbia Pictures, the shows' original packager) vaults. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Sylph Posted July 30, 2008 Author Members Share Posted July 30, 2008 Which, sadly, cannot be said about Harding Lemay's AW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members JAS0N47 Posted July 31, 2008 Members Share Posted July 31, 2008 Yes, you are correct, Sedrick. Every episode of "Days" is still in existence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members detroitpiston Posted July 31, 2008 Members Share Posted July 31, 2008 I wish SoapNet would air some of these older eps from Bells run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members KMan101 Posted August 2, 2008 Members Share Posted August 2, 2008 I wish SoapNet would air BOTH Days and Y&R from the start. We REALLY need a classic soap channel! Ugh! Why is this not happening? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MarkH Posted August 2, 2008 Members Share Posted August 2, 2008 It will NEVER happen. All nostalgia channels are transforming and leaving that behind: AMC, GSN, TVLand. It will NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER happen. Nostalgia channels don't rate well, and what they get is OLD people (over 39 years of age). There is hope for you, but it is ONLY on the internet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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