EastEnders: Discussion Thread

[BadBoy93]

Yes Julias Theme was heard. Watching tonights episode right now and Phil is now got the club with Roxy. A lot of Phil's enemies had that club and now Phil has it. Hope he gives Billy some share as Billy owned that Club for a few years too.

[Y&RWorldTurner]

Next Tuesday's episode only features Bianca, Carol, Connor, Whitney, Max, and Tiffany. It's written by Simon Ashdown.

I guess this was supposed to be the Carol/Bianca two-hander and they had to expand it due to Patsy giving birth earlier than expected. It's also Bianca's last episode until Patsy comes back from maternity leaves too, I believe.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00xwtm7

Edited January 14, 2011 by Y&RWorldTurner

[Bright Eyes]

Do you know where I could listen to Kathy's Theme? Is it better than Peggy's?

[Y&RWorldTurner]

There isn't any available full version of Kathy's theme that I know of.

Peggy's theme is much more in tune with the original version of Julia's Theme, while Kathy's is more rock/guitar driven. They aren't really comparable outside of the standard melody.

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Edited January 15, 2011 by Y&RWorldTurner

[Y&RWorldTurner]

Someone made this great video comparing Grant/Sharon/Phil to Angie/Den/Jan.

Ignore the crap song behind the video.

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[Y&RWorldTurner]

So, I'm reliving vital parts of Sharongate on YouTube. I started watching EastEnders on PBS during the time of the reveal and leading up to Sharon's exit early in 1995. It's amazing how delicately plotted the whole thing was and what a slow burner it was that had ramifications for YEARS. I can definitely see what it's considered the peak era of the show in the 90's.

I think first watching the show from this era is why I have such a great affinity for Sharon as a character. I think it might be the best plotted and compelling affair storyline in British soap history.

To me, the 91-95 era is the show's best era in the 90's. Yes, it was heavy on the Mitchell's, but they were actually a dynamic shot in the arm at the time and contributed a great deal of good. The ensemble feel of the show during this time was also great. I think it was a smart idea of pairing the Mitchell brothers with Sharon and Kathy, two women the audience loved and two women who were very likeable and could balance them out.

It's amazing how sympathetic Sharon was throughout the whole thing. Unlike say Stacey in the Stax affair, never once did I think what a whore she is and how stupid she is. This story didn't feel trashy, it felt strangely very human. I could see why she loved Grant, but also why she and Phil were drawn to each other. I believe she once told Michelle that Phil was like the gentler side of Grant or something and that's why she couldn't stay away from him. Her marriage to Grant was very fiery and borderline abusive, but yet, I always felt he did love her, he loved her so much at times that it felt like it drove him crazy. I do believe Sharon was also perhaps the only woman Phil ever genuinely loved. I guess I could count Kathy in there too.

I love how there's a whole Wikipedia article devoted to this storyline

I loved the story development part with quotes from Tony Jordan:

I also really loved Sharon's first exit in 1995 after the reveal and after she had faked a reconciliation with Grant. I loved how she wanted to humiliate Grant in public at the Vic, the same way he humiliated her with the reveal, but she couldn't do it at the last minute. She had too much class and dignity to do it. She left saying she'd always love Grant, but needed to go because too much damage had been done. I love how she left with her dignity in tact, unlike the crappy 2006 exit Kate Harwood gave her (though, I think they thought Letitia would return soon).

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Sharon is by far the best heroine this show has ever produced.

Sorry, I rambled on way too much. :lol:

Edited January 15, 2011 by Y&RWorldTurner

[DRW50]

I wish I could get past the abusive way Grant treated Sharon.

It's a shame that story couldn't be aired today, as the viewers would probably complain about the length of the material and they wouldn't have the talented writers to plot it.

That video, was it done by the person who used to put up all the videos with the Watts family? I loved those so much. I hated it when all those were taken down, they were so wonderfully edited and a lot of stuff I'd never seen before. I still try to watch the full episodes when I can of that era but I have a certain preference for edited clips because I think this can enhance the power of a story.

Edited January 15, 2011 by CarlD2

[Y&RWorldTurner]

I think Grant did love Sharon though, I think he loved her to the point it drove him crazy (added on with his war and childhood experiences, he was very mentally unstable).

I think Sharon kept her integrity and characterization for all of the storyline and left with the upper-hand and her dignity in tact.

I don't think Grant ever got over Sharon. He certainly didn't love Tiffany to the extent he loved Sharon

I wouldn't be opposed to them revisiting Grant and Sharon, if it was written properly and Grant matured as a character. They were and still are a very popular pairing with fans.

It's amazing how long this story went on, yet viewers were still interested. Soaps don't write for the longterm anymore though.

This person's channel is filled with videos of the Watts family, not actual videos of the scenes themselves, just collage videos.

Edited January 15, 2011 by Y&RWorldTurner

[DRW50]

What I hate most is that soaps write things that should go on for years and yet don't follow through, which makes them seem hollow. They might as well write short term story arcs. Eastenders used to have those at one time.

Yeah that person used to have tons of clips of the Watts, very carefully edited, into different stories, like Den's prison stint, the buildup to Shannis making love, Den's return to Walford and his reunions with all his old friends and foes. And then of course Endersfan, who had some gems I still miss, like the one selling Eastenders abroad which had the whole cast in the Vic, speaking different languages, as Grant steps forward to talk to the camera; and then the full episodes of Kathy's rape and Lou's death, both superb pieces of TV. I still have that image of Wilmott-Brown slithering back into Walford and seeing the charred remains of the Dagmar.

That story is the only time I think a rape story has ever produced any powerful drama, for me.

I think I got tired of what I saw as the show glorifying the Mitchells and their worst traits, and usually letting them win. The Sharon story stands out because that's the one time someone in their life got to really stand on her own, and unlike Kathy, wasn't killed offcamera like some sort of cheap punishment.

So if you had to rank the Mitchell girlfriends/wives from those you liked most to least, how would it go? I mean mostly Grant and Phil, so if you don't want to include Billy, or Jamie (but then you wouldn't be able to rank Sonia #1), that's OK.

[Y&RWorldTurner]

Someone mentioned at Walford Web today how woman are constantly falling weak to Phil's poor boy act and end up sleeting with him (like Glenda did in Friday's episode), but Sharon was the only one who was immune to Phil's manipulation and knew how he was and called him on it before it got out of hand.

I think it was their connection to Sharon that established the Mitchell's on the show more than anything else. Had they just come in and not involved with her, would people have cared and would they have lasted this long? To this day, I think Phil, Grant, and Sharon's defining moment on the show is the Sharongate story.

I think Sharon is probably known more for her affiliation with the Mitchell brothers than she is for her affiliation with the Watts dynasty. Someone mentioned that Sharon was probably the love of both Grant and Phil's lives, but they probably weren't for her. I think I agree with that assessment.

I haven't really liked most of Grant or Phil's romantic relationships post-Sharongate. I did think Kathy and Phil worked initially, but it ended at the right time and there was no reason for Kathy to ever want to be with him again. But I haven't really liked most of Phil's relationships.

I actually didn't mind Lorraine and Grant, I think they were kind of suited to one another in a way.

I never liked Grant and Tiffany. I hated Tiffany once she became Grant's victim, and I never believed she loved Grant or that Grant loved her. I think Tiffany loved the idea of being with Grant more so than Grant himself, and Grant never got over Sharon or his mental instability.

[DRW50]

I think Tiffany was very weak, which is the main reason Grant stayed with her.

I liked Lorraine with Grant but eventually I wanted her to find someone better.

I hated hated hated hated hated hated hated Lisa/Phil. I never really saw the best of Kathy/Phil, but I often wondered why she stuck with him. He was such a downer and her marriage to Pete had humor for many years. I think Phil sort of drained Kathy's spirit. (Was she with Phil when Pete died)

My favorite Phil relationship would be Phil/Kate, as I thought they had a lot of chemistry and she managed to make me tolerate him.

I can't stand Shirley/Phil. I often hear people say "the writing is ruining them." I swear I've been hearing that for 3 years! It isn't the writing, it's them. Shirley is a pathetic woman who enables Phil's worst demons.

[Y&RWorldTurner]

Do you think if they ever bought Simon Wicks back and Sharon, they should revisit their relationship? I know he dumped her for my girl Cindy Beale, but she's out of the picture. Maybe in later years, they could have more success in a relationship if they were both brought back at different times.

Pat always loved Sharon too, and I think she would love it. Ian probably wouldn't be too thrilled though...

[DRW50]

It would be nice to see Sharon have some fun again. I think the idea would be great, as long as he wasn't playing her. The show could use that type of character again, what Simon used to be. He'd probably get along with Alfie, so that might bring some more stuff with Sharon and Kat.

[Bright Eyes]

Is Whitney's past abuse common knowledge?

[DRW50]

Yes, most people on the show know about it, which is why Ian said she had been "fiddled with by a paedo."

Edited January 15, 2011 by CarlD2