Annnnddd...it's not like Jack put the coffin in the ground and Gloria had to talk to a picture...the body was still there and those that cared about what she had to say listened.

Now, if he would have put the coffin in the ground...then perhaps, I wouldn't feel like LMBO at the scheme he pulled.

Lynn is trying her best for us the viewers to sympathize with Gloria, I give her props but with this viewer it just isn't working and never will work. She's done to much damage to the Abbotts and is the sole reason they've seen all this turmoil, both directly and indirectly. The show would be wise to write the witch right out of town.

As much as I can't stand Gloria for the crap she has done, all of these people, with the exceptions of Traci, Jill and Katherine, are acting like two-year-old selfish children. Billy has been gone, so he has been spared the "wonderful" family atmosphere that has going on in the Abbott home.

Gloria condemns Jack and the rest of the Abbotts for doing the very same thing she has done herself. Jack even gave her a chance in the beginning, because he kept telling Ashley that she made John happy. That changed when it came out that she had kept the fact that Michael and Kevin were her sons from John and the rest of his family. John forgave her for that. Then she didn't tell him or no one else about Tom, until it was too late. She tried to play Victor against Jack, stole money from John's account and then lied to him about it, when she giving it to Tom, felt she could just waltz into Jabot without any business experience and take over, and then the skin cream fiasco, which could have destroyed Jabot and indirectly cost a woman her life, landed Abby in the hospital, and costed Jack his job as CEO of CI.

BUT, their hands are not clean either. How many times has Jack almost destroyed Jabot his damn self? How did Victor get his hands on it? Because of Jack. This is the same man who was screwing his father's wife behind his back, and when Katherine told John about it, it caused him to have a heart attack. He left Victor for dead, and had taken NE from Victor when everyone though he was dead in a plane crash. The only person Jack gives a [!@#$%^&*] about is himself. He can't stand Gloria because he sees her as a female version of himself.

And Ashley?! The same woman who stole a man's sperm, got herslf pregnant, had the baby, and was never going to tell the father about it. The same woman who dumped her husband to go after another woman's husband, and got upset when she was turned down. This is the same woman who played games with Kevin when he got hired on at Jabot (A job he apparently doesn't go to) so how can she talk smack?

Someone should remind Kevin that he should be glad that his bitch ass isn't sitting in prison for first-degree attempted murder. This is after he molested Lily and got away with it. And Michael? You would have thought that he would not trust one word that came out of his mother's mouth. But Noooooooo. The ex-convict who I had liked so much is now starting to sacrifice his marriage for the sake of a woman who never gave a damn about him. That is tragic.

So, it may have been long-winded, but I can't root for any of these people. I would see more adult behavior watching Romper Room.

I will concede that Jack telling GloHo the wrong time so she missed John's funeral was petty and wrong.

Off to a good start

But, Gloria lied and manipulated and schemed with John, his money and bagging him as her husband since day one. John loved Gloria through all her glaringly obvious faults, and would have stood by her during the Tom Fisher thing had she told him what was going on. Had she not stolen Abbott money to pay him off again and again and told John "He's trying to blackmail me", that would have been the end of it. But she wound John up with fear and half-true stories, filled him with paranoia to his breaking point! He shot the man, and went to jail for her saggy-assed lies! And now he's dead cause of the added stress.

Here we go....I disagree that's like me blaming Nick/Sharon for Cassie's death. If they were paying attention to there daughter more and didn't let her go out that night then she would have still been alive today. Who's to say if Gloria told John the truth right away that he would have acted any differently. John already knew about how terrible Tom treated Kevin. Besides that it WAS NOT the added stress. If I recall John was PISSED that TOM FISHER had something to do with Lauren's "death" and when he heard that Tom was back in down he went out with vengence on his mind. So I guess Lauren is partly responsible too? Also John was already PISSED of Tom's involvemnt with his DAUGHTER Ashley.

Gloria Fisher killed John Abbott.

And no, Jack Abbott's never been a completely nice or good guy. Thats why fans of Y&R have loved him for these past 20+ years. As Cheap said, I've watched this show for too damn long (17 years!), invested too damn much in the Abbott family to have any sympathy for Gloria. For me, as a viewer, she's as much an intruder to that family as she is to the characters in the show.

Gloria Fisher killed John Abbott? How? By LOVING the man (lol sounds so dramatic). Anyways, Jack KNEW that John had a severe heart condition but what did the self-righteous SOB do........he went and BAD MOUTHED HIS WIFE ON JOHN'S BIRTHDAY NO LESS!!!!!!!!!! So I guess Jack is to blame as well for putting all this stress on John the NIGHT of his stroke. Jack just couldn't STFU. Let's face it Gloria ain't perfect and John never was good at picking out women. The only woman who TRULY loved John the most was paid one million dollars to get the hell out of here. Go figure.

Another thing...dear God in Heaven I love you John but who the bleep told you to pack heat? Keeping a GUN in a DRAWER in the DINING ROOM where poor innocent ABBY could have easily ACCESSED it and caused "Joshua Cassein Part Deux!" There are SO many ways to protect your family. Security, alarm systems...for Gawd sake you're an ABBOTT you can AFFORD it. Gloria did not say the night that Tom died, "You know what John, I really wish Tom was dead. Heyyy you have a gun why not kill him for me?" John killed Tom himself, self defence or not John went out there that night with intent to commit a deadly action, so JOHN and only JOHN is to blame for being landed in prison.

and semi OT - but that new shot of Gloria in the opening disgusts me! Does the show love her that much that they get that awful woman to pose for her shots while everyone elses are from the episodes, or are those truely the day-to-day mannerisms of Gloria. BAH!

Everyone who got a new update got to pose. Michael, Bryton, Amelia, Rikaart....

Team Abbott ALWAYS and FOREVER, no explanations needed!

There is NO way this show is going to make me feel any sympathy for the skin cream killing opportunist and her child predator, statutory raping, arsonist, attempted murdering son as far as this war is concerned.

Those are some awful crimes there

Let's not forget Jack and his ill tempered self THREW a CHAIR out of a HIGH RISE BUILDING, which could have hurt civilians walking by; all this just because Victor wanted to sit on it.... Yeah, go Jack

BTW didn't Kevin SAVE John Abbott's life.

Yup, Kevin did in fact save John's life.

It's the funniest thing; I can't stand Kevin (well, I liked him for a bit when he was trying to mend his ways after his whole incident in jail) but I love me some Michael Baldwin; go figure, and he raped and tormented Christine when I first saw him on the show.

So, basically DruRocks, what you are saying is that I should excuse Glroria from everything that she did. And, to compare what happen with Nick/Sharon and Cassue? I disagree completely. Sharon didn't want her to go out because of her behavior. Nick thought it would be cool that one time. Circumstances interceeded, and she ended up dead. It was a tragic accident.

How is it an accident that Gloria didn't tell John about Tom? And, was that the first time she either kept something from him, or lied to him? It sounds like to me that you feel I should like Gloria because she is misunderstood. No, I can't do that. She is a gold-digging skank as fas i'm concerned. Now, if you dig her, cool. I can't stop you. But, to say "Here we go", becuase we disagree? I just think that's kinda wrong.

I don't begrudge anyone for liking any character on a show that they watch, but I will not like that woman in the slightest until she gets busted for what she did, learns from it, pays for it, and grows up, the very same thing I said about Jack and Ashley. Now, if you disagree, cool. But, I'm not changing my mind.

No basically what I was saying was s--t happens. The post was saying had this or had that, but that's all irrelevant in the big picture anyways because in the end you make your own decisions, and plus nobody had a gun to John's head.

Oh hell Jill was a gold digger!

It's the funniest thing; I can't stand Kevin (well, I liked him for a bit when he was trying to mend his ways after his whole incident in jail) but I love me some Michael Baldwin; go figure, and he raped and tormented Christine when I first saw him on the show.

Yeah but Michael went to jail so that's probably why? Then again anybody who dear messed with the Bug ALWAYS pays ROYALLY.

Team Abbott ALWAYS and FOREVER, no explanations needed!

There is NO way this show is going to make me feel any sympathy for the skin cream killing opportunist and her child predator, statutory raping, arsonist, attempted murdering son as far as this war is concerned.

Preach it.

BTW didn't Kevin SAVE John Abbott's life.

didn't Kevin try to burn John Abbott's granddaughter alive?

She is a gold-digging skank as fas i'm concerned.

you should see her tomorrow when Christine tells her John left her half his estate ... I've never seen eyes go so wide and bright with joy - even for Judith Chapman.

you should see her tomorrow when Christine tells her John left her half his estate ... I've never seen eyes go so wide and bright with joy - even for Judith Chapman.

Haven't seen this scene but after all the nonsence Jack just pulled I could see why she would be happy.

Looks like 4 ppl on Team Fisher!

Judith Chapman can work those eyes to no end....While I love Judith Chapman, I still can't stand Gloria; but for some reason, that always change....

In all honesty, I hope Jack has to face up to what he did to Victor; I hope they don't sweep that under the rug.

Haven't seen this scene but after all the nonsence Jack just pulled I could see why she would be happy.

Looks like 4 ppl on Team Fisher!

whatever Jack does or doesnt do, Gloria's her own person.

Here's gloria when she's depressed over finding out she's not John's wife:

:'(

Here's Gloria after she finds out she owns half the estate:

$ $

o

Both Gloria and Jack are self absorbed.

I don't think Jack is self absorbed, he's VERY concerned when it comes to his family. Hell, he even plays dad to Phyllis' son even though he has no reason to. Jack would give the world for Ashley, John and the rest of the Abbotts.

Look at Gloria, she uses her two kids to do her dirty work and cover up her crimes. She risked losing John's company forever just to make it look like Ashley was in the wrong for the skin cream murder. She didn't blink an eye when Abby got that stuff on her and could've died.

People talk about how awful what Jack did was (I thought it was fitting), but Gloria has done much worse in the past. Especially what she did with Abby and blaming it on Ashley. Ashley could've gone to P-R-I-S-O-N! I hope when it's revealed Ashley gives her a big piece of her mind.