Soaplovers

I couldn't get behind Holly and Roger especially when I found out he had raped her. To me..even putting them back together as a couple in the 90s was just wrong. So I was with Mctravish in regards to breaking them up....i just didn't like throwing Holly with Fletcher and turning Roger into a dark character when Pam long/Curlee spent years redeeming him. It is a shame Michelle Forbes quit because roger/sonni were an interesting pairing...and her verbal spats with Blake were well done. I do like that the show ended with Ed/Holly getting together...when holly had become confident without a man...and he came to her, not the other way around. It was done quickly, but made sense to me.

Agree... I thought the show realized a lot of that potential. The twist of her having Iris' grandchild was genius given the fact that her dad Russ had been engaged to Iris back in the 70s. A shame the actress left and the character ceased to exist.

I'd love the 13 episode season plus a 1 or 2 part reunion... and then a lost scenes episode. Back to basics.

I actually liked how she wrote Olivia.. but I do think the ball was dropped with Josie being Russ' daughter.. and basically writing off Josie and Russ months after the fact. With Olivia... I liked how Donna S kind of wrote the Sam/Olivia/Amanda triangle... with Olivia as the Rachel, Amanda as the Alice.. with Sam as the Steve....shame that Sam had two bad recasts.. but I liked the irony that the Rachel/Alice feud had moved to the next generation... but sadly without more visits from Alice.. it didn't live up to it's potential.

Didn't the actress that play Leslie opt to leave the show? In a way, it was probably smarter to kill her off then risk a bad recast (ala Jackie Marler a few years later). Just from the episodes I watched in 1980 (on youtube, plus some friends had copies of other episodes).. it looked as if Ed/Holly was being slated by Marland as the Bauer tentpole/end game couple.

Oc's best years were when the seasons were shorter...and it was a mix of fun and drama. Until season 10...it was somewhat toxic yet fun. As long as Vicki and t amra remain..the show won't ever evolve. NJ is smart having Siggy go bye bye...she was loco. Would you say she was as loco as Kelly benisomon?

It did free up Mike, but I often wonder had she lived...if the show would have made them the next generation tent couple?

I recall the big critism during her era was the pacing of her stories....that the ideas worked, but that the pacing w asnt good. An example given was character A and b were talking the kiss..ens of episode...then two episodes later, character a and b were still kissing. And I recall soap magazines thought the who shot Jake story was interesting, but the reveal was a letdown...and it was swept under the carpet except for one really good scene where Marley let Paulina have it for not fessing up... And viewers didn't like the hatchet job the show did to Kathleen to make Frankie look better. That the triangle had potential because Cass was good with both...but character propping of Frankie was evident. For me, she created Lorna...a small part that grew so much..and making her Felicia' s daughter was genius considering how Lorna spent over a year making Jenna' s life miserable....i recall my mom was watching during that time and was excited to see when Jenna would find out cause the two hated each other. I also think the reason her AW is looked at better is because she wrote it on her own with good support...while she shared co head writing on GL and AMC with a hack. Kind of wish she had been given a chance to write.those on her own. Last I read, she writes plays and works in community theater.

I liked Felicia best when she was single and playing the field...it just fit her better. The person that wanted the perfect romance, but either by bad luck or bad choices always lost. And oddly I could see the first love and first child being lost as the motivation to be a success and becoming a romance writer. I also liked how Felicia would take some of the younger female characters under her wing as her assistant and/or mother figure ...such as Julia, Lisa, Jenna, Lorna, Sofia, and Remy. It is a shame her connections to her niece and two daughters fell by the wayside....though inwad happy her friendship with Rachel stayed active up to the shows end. And I do think the Iris being chief story would have worked better if the rewrite hadn't happened... it could have been revenge against Mac and Rachel. With that said, Donna Swajeski did a good job making Rachel and Iris get along and have it be convincing after Mac's death. It was the one positive thing frokm the red Swan story...and having Mac die before he forgave Iris was an element used to enhance Iris' character..imho.

It's almost as if the show admitted even then that this was going to be a huge void that never was filled.

And it probably didn't work hence why she was softened by the mid 80s. Donna was created last minute cause they loved Anna stuart...and I think original recipe Donna was their answer to filling the void left by Iris.

In other words...probably closing. This happens in Chicago alot...and most times, they never reopen. Is Melissa's clothing boutique still open?

Agree to disagree with the period between 1984 and 1989 being destroyed....damaged...yes...but Nadine, Harley, and Blake were created during that time. Late 1988, you could see Pam Long and Nancy curlee getting the ball rolling to make the show go from passable to must see. And I think by 1996/7...the show had sort of rebounded...you had rick/Abby as the next generation Bauer couple, Michelle being the rebellious teen that rick used to be, and Annie Dutton was a tour de force (she was the reason for the rating increase..imho). 1998 was the start of the show freefalling..imho.

Remember when housewives went on individual vacations and they were featured? I miss those days since realistically...i don't always vacation eith my friends or co workers. I cant put my finger in it..but there is something kind of superior and judge about Teddi.

AM/Gilly would have been interesting.. and I thought that the show was heading in that direction. It would have also bought up history since didn't AM's grandfather also been involved in an interracial relationship... it could have also ushered in that branch of the tree sooner then the late 90s.

I loved the Three sisters episode (the women heading to a house on the market where it's haunted by ghosts). Showcased a lot of Val's internal struggles.. as well as showing off Laura's astute observation skills.. and Abby being the prankster/trouble maker (who ended up with photographic proof of ghosts).

Saw the last month's of 1984...and I think Sheldon wrote some great episodes....not anything like slesar..but the show was pretty good still. I would have loved to have seen the Alice in wonderland inspired mystery that kicked off the final episode...since I l9ve me some Alice in wonderland....and would have been interested to see how Mike's daughter Laurie would have adjusted to not being held captive 8n a hospital.

I can't believe Val would utter such a line..considering the work the show did to.show that Val loved Ben just as much as she loved Gary.

I could understand him trashing Phillips, etc... but Slesar?!?!?! The writer that wrote some great mysteries on both EON and Somerset, as well as utilizing the Washington DC setting for Capital ( i.e. political intrigue, scandals, espinage, etc). With that said, I was a child of 80s soaps.. and the soaps I liked as a child in the 80s were Guiding Light and Santa Barbara (two very polar opposite soaps). I loved that both were emotional, quirky, and full of life (I liked Pam Long's take on GL). I do wonder if Lemay had the idea to make Josie, Russ Matthews daughter, or if that was Donna Swajeski?

I recently researched season 1 of rhobh....it was like lightening in a bottle and set the bar so high...that the shoe had never been able to meet. It was very natural, the women seemed to enjoy each other.....and kim vs Taylor wad natural because you sometimes don't click with people...even recall when Kim tried to hang out with taylor to make nice...and Taylor was like not getting Kim's quirky/loopy/drunk vibe. In also forgot that LVP and adrienne were friendly and got along that season. I think L VP becoming the unexpected MVP made the other women jealous hence why in season 2..the other women were trying to one up her. However, Camille was the perfect villianess.....calm, calculating, and perfect balance of Cattiness and sweetness. I do agree that she would constantly win against Kyle since Kyle couldn't keep a handle on her emotions. Best moment of season 2 was Camille outing Taylor's abuse tales she was telling the other ladies behind the scenes. To this day, I'm not sure if she was being truthful or not....at least about the physical abuse aspect. The emotional abuse part...I could buy. Rinna is rewatching to get pointers for season 9...imho

Rachel didnt get off scott free... after all, Karma bought Iris into her life when she moved on from Steve to Mac.

Shelley fabares character was best used in small doses....like a recurring guest star then a full time cast member. I think Bonnie Franklin wanted to do some more stage work/theater so her presence lessened because of that. I think MP's problems off set hurt the shoe because Julie was a pretty good contrast tomboy Barbara. She also had good comic timing, yet was intense in the dramatic scenes. Her absence was felt.

Actually from reading the history if the shoe..and talking to my mom who grew up during this triangle....she thought Alice and Rachel were too good for steven....and that he was the cause of all the heart ache cause he couldn't keep his pants zipped up....and played both women against each other...and gave mixed signals to both. Rachel wasnt all evil (but she sure w asnt put upon like you ranted about)...and Alice wasn't all pure (but she sure w asnt the harpy you say she was).

I kind of got a kick out of Kathryn.. though I think being shell shocked at the reunion and holding onto a pillow when the other women were arguing probably sealed her fate. She and her husband were kind of cute together, and she seemed kind of quirky. Hopefully, Luann is doing this because she truly has accepted she has hit rock bottom and not to generate more airtime and story. I'm hoping she comes through this, but cynical me remembers her from seasons past.. and it will take action more then words.

That's why I rate Anne Heche as my favorite recast.. because she fought to make Marley a character instead of being seen as Vicky's boring twin. Plus, it seemed like two different actresses were playing the characters when Anne was playing it especially during the rape trial. When I would watch scenes with marley/Vicky when Anne Heche played it... it was like two different actresses and I could tell which twin was which. Marley had a softer/gentler approach in facial expressions and vocal tones.. while Vicky had a more intense and dramatic delivery in her voice. Ellen did better as Marley then Vicky... and despite Jenson's dislike of playing Marley.. she played Marley better then she played Vicky.