In my opinion, it should always be the plan that the villain be present for 3-month or 6-month arcs and then disappear.   Coming back periodically every two years for a completely unexpected arc to stir up trouble.   If a villain is hanging out with the heroes in regular public places year round, then it defies logic and dilutes the drama. 

I strongly dislike the notion that if an actor does a good job playing a villain, then "we have to keep them around!".  I feel that if the actor is doing a good job as a villain, then let them play the strong villain who gets defeated and leaves periodically.  Watering the villain down doesn't honor the actor.

Making a villain be someone that you joke with at the coffee shop --  dishonors the entire canvas of the show.

Edited August 3Aug 3 by janea4old

4 hours ago, Taoboi said:

And we are definitley not checking for Dani/Andre/Ashley either. 

 

 

I feel like they could make something out if Dani/Andre if they went for it but the interloper should be Bill, if anyone.

We all have to remember that MVJ spent a long time at B & B so Brad Bell's horrible story choices probably had an effect on her.. hence the whole Dana/Leslie situation where she caused irredeemable acts so early in the run of the show.

While I love the actress, I do think perhaps Dana/Leslie needs to be laying low and leaving the canvas for the time being so that Nicole/Ted/Eva can move forward... and then once the next stage of the plot occurs... Dana/Leslie can pop up.

The show is pretty good with their Point A, Point B's, etc.... the weakness for me is the journey/process of getting from Point A to Point B and so on.  

19 minutes ago, Soaplovers said:

The show is pretty good with their Point A, Point B's, etc.... the weakness for me is the journey/process of getting from Point A to Point B and so on.  

Absolutely. I've been saying this for months. I'm glad I'm not alone in thinking it. Even though they are improving... The first 6 months are one tabloid headline after another. One culmination after another. What is in between is what bothers me. They flatline after powerful moments. It seems like they only think of how to wow and shock and not much about how to sustain quality build up. I get that they are battling for ratings in order to survive... I get that, but still... I can't only wait for culminations.

Still. They are improving. So I am becoming optimistic.

Edited August 3Aug 3 by Maxim

Thought Friday’s show was superb. Excellent production values. The songs were decent. Loved the energy. Btw if that’s Kat’s real hair, please KEEP IT that way. 

I have a fondness for Sharon and Tracy. 

As for the rest of the storylines… looks like even the latest big story (Martin’s) has fizzled. Good luck going from point A to B. I expect some more friction with Jacob and then everything will be swept under the rag, much like what happened with comic-relief Leslie. 

Edited August 3Aug 3 by Aback

9 hours ago, EricMontreal22 said:

Word.

I speak only the truth. lol.

 

I see the potential, but I just feel like if it go there...and I feel like they will...it's propped writing to keep the focus on where the writers want us to focus...the A story of Dani/Bill/Hayley...which is my least favorite of the 3 main A stories. Though it's good with the new baby lie, it's just slanted writing for me.

 

I would almost be over the idea of it if it was not for the fact that it's been established since the first episode that Andre does like Ashley so the idea of him dropping Dani for her is not far-fetched. Several characters have called Andre out on his feelings for Ashley. Also, the potential of that triangle mixing up with Dani/Bill/Hayley is intriguing enough due to Ashley suspecting that Hayley is lying and we are still waiting for the other shoe to drop when Ashley realizes that the other woman in Andre's life IS Dani. Now that the show has shown us that Ashley can be neurotic AND petty, it's not far fetched to imagine her finding out for sure about Hayley, about to tell the truth, only to find out about Dani and Andre and keep to herself out of spite for Dani being the 'other woman.' Look at her she treats Shanice. 

3 hours ago, Soaplovers said:

We all have to remember that MVJ spent a long time at B & B so Brad Bell's horrible story choices probably had an effect on her.. hence the whole Dana/Leslie situation where she caused irredeemable acts so early in the run of the show.

I admit that I'm starting my rewatch and it is (no offense to TMG or AM) irking me that two months out from the anniversary party, SilkPress and Eva are ki-ki-ing like nothing happened. Where are the consequences? Aren't we overdue for someone to talk to our resident Nosy Nurse about Lulu? 

 

6 hours ago, janea4old said:

In my opinion, it should always be the plan that the villain be present for 3-month or 6-month arcs and then disappear.   Coming back periodically every two years for a completely unexpected arc to stir up trouble.   If a villain is hanging out with the heroes in regular public places year round, then it defies logic and dilutes the drama. 

Wow...TWO YEARS? lol. jk.

 

Seriously though, I agree. Some of what made Stefano so terrorizing on DAYS in the 90s for me as a teenager was the fact that he came in and out of plot as needed. Usually unexpected. Sometimes as the Friday cliffhanger. With an entrance, theme music and all!!! And you knew stakes were IMMEDIATELY raised. Before he was walking free all about town as if nothing happened. It's to JM's strength that you still feared Stefano walking around free, but it was such a weak vibe versus not knowing.

 

5 hours ago, Chris B said:

I feel like they could make something out if Dani/Andre if they went for it but the interloper should be Bill, if anyone.

I agree. That was what I liked about the show separating Dani and Bill into separate stories for a little while. Once Bill made it to the hospital, Dani/Andre had been going on for a while so now there was some organic tension between them. I would take Bill over Ashley as the interloper any day. But alas.

 

13 minutes ago, Aback said:

Btw if that’s Kat’s real hair, please KEEP IT that way. 

Same.

Since we are coming on the much-discussed six month mark...I figured that I'll be this over now from the other thread...

 

Well now that I'm coming off the Comic-Con madness and I might feel differently come August 24th or when the post-feedback episodes finally arrive, but...I do believe we are officially into Month 5 of BTG. So given how often I've discussed the first set of A stories since the premiere, I started to think about how I would 'Report Card' them now that we are approaching six months. Part of it is to see how I'm feeling cuz I know I've been a little more snarky with the show than I've been lately but it is arriving at Month 6 so lol. Part of it is that...I guess I am thinking old school when I think that there should be new A stories to get main focus going into the fall. So I expect endings and/or turns in the current A stories.  So with that in mind, I always said the A stories were THREE stories. So in order...

 

1) DANI/BILL/HAYLEY.  You know what? I would probably give it a solid B. It did get the show off and running. And that was great for the first two/three weeks. And I've always said that I loved that the writers stopped more or less after that point to give separate stories to the characters, so we got to know them better. Bill got his hand issue and that sexual harassment story to flesh him out and his family dynamic...not to mention villain moments with Martin. Dani got to deal with some of her fallout, a fling with Andre that grew, and her own family dynamic. Hayley...got...okay nothing. lol. I still feel a way about the show getting back to them too soon, but I did like that with the Bill hand thing coming to a head, it made organic sense to bring the three back together into plot. And after so much wishy-washy-ness with Hayley, her baby lie storyline has set her up in a love-to-hate villainess way with me because I felt NOTHING out of the three for her. Now I'm at least part intrigued, part hissing at her since the audience is in on it which makes her fake and phony in all her scenes, giving her layers without giving her layers if that makes sense. And it seems like the story will definitely have a turn going into the fall so...while not my favorite of the A stories...the potential for soapy mess is there and surprising me by holding my interest. 

 

2) SILK PRESS SHEILA. Honestly? I would give it an A BUT the fallout from the anniversary party has been a mess. Before that...it was the best paced of all three stories. Twists. Turns. Near-misses. And great acting. Leading to a great set of episodes and fierce fashion. And it was a story that gave subplots (the rivalry between Eva/Kat, whether there was a baby switch is STILL out there, Laura's accident). But since then...what appeared to look like it was playing beats (to me)--outside of the flaw of Nicole not having a POV in her own storyline- has dissolved in what feels like slanted writing on one hand...cuz you have a great villainess and not much wiggle room out of a corner...and...prop writing on the other...cuz of more POV for Eva&SilkPress with Kat/Nicole coming off as villain and not heroines. It was much better when the writing had it as a level playing field. Don't get me started on the recast who (when he gets writing) appears to be more in a traditional soap triangle versus what the original was giving...which was not confusion over who to root for. As is...I would give it all a B-, saved by the acting...shoutout to Nicole NOT playing stupid heroine in her scene with SilkPress last week when she knew those marks on her neck were fake. 

 

3)MARTIN'S SECRET. For me, it started well. Martin just reacting to something in his dreams. Then we got sounds. THEN we got flashes. Then we got images. Then...the story got pushed back. Like the situation with Dani/Bill/Hayley, I in hindsight liked it because the story being pushed back allowed for the audience to get to know Martin, his husband, and his family. And I felt gave it stakes. And then we got flashes that build up. Then we found out it was a whole conspiracy. And I loved that in the last month, it did build nicely. I liked the reveal after watching again. And so far, the fallout has been good. And given today's episode...it is already set up to have a turn in its plot come next month. Unless I'm wrong. That said...thinking about it, yeah, I could see some plotholes in it. And I still have some questions. And I think we all kinda guess what the secret is two months back. I still feel like there might be some twist coming off of that secret. It seem like the writers were setting up for down the road the Duprees vs Joey, too. I also love how the secret is not just something that is black or white either...pun unintended. While I get it in hindsight, the stalling push the story to a C. Though I'm definitely invested in seeing where the story goes. Especially after today. 

 

And ALSO...

 

And going off of that A story tangent...5 months in...so...what B plots are you all liking? What B plots are you NOT liking?

 

And any C plots that have intrigued you? 

1 hour ago, Taoboi said:

Andre does like Ashley so the idea of him dropping Dani for her is not far-fetched. Several characters have called Andre out on his feelings for Ashley. Also, the potential of that triangle mixing up with Dani/Bill/Hayley is intriguing enough due to Ashley suspecting that Hayley is lying and we are still waiting for the other shoe to drop when Ashley realizes that the other woman in Andre's life IS Dani. Now that the show has shown us that Ashley can be neurotic AND petty, it's not far fetched to imagine her finding out for sure about Hayley, about to tell the truth, only to find out about Dani and Andre and keep to herself out of spite for Dani being the 'other woman.' Look at her she treats Shanice. 

I can't see this happening, but wouldn't it be interesting (OK, odd, but interesting) if somehow Dani and Ashley teamed up to expose Hayley?  Still rivals for Andre, but with a common goal (though Ashley wanting to expose Hayley because of her friendship with Bill's daughter doesn't seem like something the current incarnation of Ashley would do...)

5 hours ago, Soaplovers said:

We all have to remember that MVJ spent a long time at B & B so Brad Bell's horrible story choices probably had an effect on her.. hence the whole Dana/Leslie situation where she caused irredeemable acts so early in the run of the show.

While I love the actress, I do think perhaps Dana/Leslie needs to be laying low and leaving the canvas for the time being so that Nicole/Ted/Eva can move forward... and then once the next stage of the plot occurs... Dana/Leslie can pop up.

The show is pretty good with their Point A, Point B's, etc.... the weakness for me is the journey/process of getting from Point A to Point B and so on.  

Well said.  I may be missing some plot details (I had to rush through some of the past few weeks) but I don't even get why Leslie is sticking around now.  Does she honestly think she has a chance with Ted?  Does she think she can get more money?  Does she just spend her time watching her stories and talking back to them, talking in the mirror, looking fabulous, and then going out to places she knows people who hate her will be just to rub it in their faces?  She got her revenge, and I think it's true that if we took a realistic approach to this story the revenge would not be satisfying, but...  Wouldn't it make more sense to at least for a while cut her loses (has she run through all her money?) and lay low somewhere else while people try to get evidence to arrest her....

7 minutes ago, EricMontreal22 said:

I can't see this happening, but wouldn't it be interesting (OK, odd, but interesting) if somehow Dani and Ashley teamed up to expose Hayley?  Still rivals for Andre, but with a common goal (though Ashley wanting to expose Hayley because of her friendship with Bill's daughter doesn't seem like something the current incarnation of Ashley would do...)

OOooo not necessarily. You saying that brings to mind that Ashley/Hayley talk where she was calling Hayley out about their past before she got with Bill. And she has had her own petty moments with Hayley as of late. Ashley might be willing to do the team-up.

5 minutes ago, EricMontreal22 said:

(has she run through all her money?) and lay low somewhere else while people try to get evidence to arrest her

Apparently this week she has gone through all of her money. I frowned at that news and side-eyed the writers when she said that in dialogue. Cuz that was a LOT of money. How? 

 

And I hate to say it, but I feel the people trying to get evidence to arrest her part of her storyline has definitely stalled. A shame when Shanice is literally RIGHT THERE.

2 hours ago, Taoboi said:

Also, the potential of that triangle mixing up with Dani/Bill/Hayley is intriguing enough due to Ashley suspecting that Hayley is lying and we are still waiting for the other shoe to drop when Ashley realizes that the other woman in Andre's life IS Dani.

-- I wish I thought the actress could play that effectively.

I don't.

 

-- I'm also concerned about how many times I'm hearing on this board that various storylines have "stalled." Stalling can be an effective story-telling device, but I think the show has to be careful about using it too often, to the point where it feels as if it's all the time.

13 hours ago, Taoboi said:

And we are definitley not checking for Dani/Andre/Ashley either. 

 

 

+1

8 hours ago, janea4old said:

In my opinion, it should always be the plan that the villain be present for 3-month or 6-month arcs and then disappear.   Coming back periodically every two years for a completely unexpected arc to stir up trouble.   If a villain is hanging out with the heroes in regular public places year round, then it defies logic and dilutes the drama. 

I strongly dislike the notion that if an actor does a good job playing a villain, then "we have to keep them around!".  I feel that if the actor is doing a good job as a villain, then let them play the strong villain who gets defeated and leaves periodically.  Watering the villain down doesn't honor the actor.

Making a villain be someone that you joke with at the coffee shop --  dishonors the entire canvas of the show.

Someone send this to Brad Bell, he didn't get this memo lol