On 6/14/2022 at 2:50 PM, Broderick said:

I wouldn't call Bill Bell's decision to ditch the Brooks and Foster families "suicidal".   He was just ready to reinvent his show with some families who hadn't been recast a zillion times and married to each other a zillion times.  Once the dust settled, he found himself in a much better position than he'd been in previously.  (In fact, it's a shame the same thing hasn't been done again.)  

Agreed. A lot of soaps could benefit from this. Families do move away, it's so much they can do with letting entire families leave town. Bill Bell was a genius for that, regardless of his reasoning.

On 6/30/2022 at 6:55 PM, Paul Raven said:

Y&r had the opportunity to revive the past by making the Ashland character Brooks Prentiss.

Obviously the story points would have to differ but Brooks would have been the new dynamic businessman in town who romances Victoria.

Lorie and Leslie could make appearances and their history come into play. Lots of possibilities there.

I like this a lot! That's definitely something that would excite me. 

On 7/1/2022 at 10:30 AM, SteelCity said:

Unpopular Opinion: I don't like when soaps become too family oriented. It just becomes very incestuous at times. That's why I love characters like Nicole. She can be a romantic wildcard because she's not related to everyone. I remember around 2005 the Brady's were dating in to he family, solely based on the fact that there were no characters in that group to mix it up with.

We are >>><<< with this. I totally agree, the canvas should always remain a happy balance of core families and wanderers. Nicole is a great example btw!

On 7/1/2022 at 11:29 AM, SteelCity said:

Exactly, they also have the issue that a lot of keeping all the Black characters in one bubble. It limits them, when they just play Winters Roulette.

Bold and the Beautiful is one of the WORST when it comes to this.

True. 

One of the things I loved about Sunset Beach is that they didn't really rely on the family aspect. It really opened up the canvas.

For a long time, I thought the Newmans were a creative albatross around Y&R’s neck.

They’ve struggled to create fresh and interesting dynamics for them. Victor is a caricature. They tried to make Nick into an alpha businessman, that flopped, and now he’s back to just sorta being “there.” Victoria has flailed in her father’s shadow for two decades. Abby’s Newman heritage has almost become an inconvenience. They’ve essentially written Nikki into a corner enough that she’d hardly be missed if MTS left.

They’re played by some of the least dynamic (and often laziest) actors on the show.

They haven’t been able to elevate a newer generation. Victoria’s kids are pretty much props, and they couldn’t find a place on the canvas for Reed. Part of that is the resistance to let Victor ride off into the sunset, and neither AH nor JM can convey gravitas. Nick is so infantilized that Noah feels like his peer. (The less said about the characterization for Noah, the better.) They refuse to invest in a vibrant teen scene to support Faith.

They so quickly burned through story with Adam that he’s become rather absurd and stuck. 

Unfortunately they are hugely popular with viewers, and on a show as gutted creatively over the years as Y&R has been, they are foundational. One would need a writer as talented and creatively unfettered as Bill Bell to replace them, and that’s never going to happen.

Mal’s instinct to push Victor out was the right one, but Mal sucked.

It’s a wonder they haven’t explored Victor and Nikki’s extended families more, brought Casey back with family, or something. 

But it’s hard to pinpoint the Newmans as problematic when Y&R overall and soaps in general are so dreadful.

Edited July 17, 20223 yr by Faulkner

@Faulkner Dead on! Daytime as whole is afraid of taking chances like those you mention. Agreed about Mal Youngs reign. My Unpopular opinion is Charles Pratt/ Mal Youngs era was the last time i enjoyed the show.

 

@SteelCity Sunset is the one Soap i have not watched.

On 7/21/2022 at 1:31 PM, DemetriKane said:

@Faulkner Dead on! Daytime as whole is afraid of taking chances like those you mention. Agreed about Mal Youngs reign. My Unpopular opinion is Charles Pratt/ Mal Youngs era was the last time i enjoyed the show.

ITA! Mal Young tried to modernize the soap... I just don't know if The Young and the Restless was the best fit for him. Still, though, I enjoyed his regime!! Couldn't miss a single day!

On 7/18/2022 at 2:08 AM, Faulkner said:

For a long time, I thought the Newmans were a creative albatross around Y&R’s neck.

Bill Bell didn't follow his own lead and revamp the show once the lead characters had  exhausted logical story possibilities.

If Eric or Melody had chosen to leave then things would have been different.

Otherwise Victor and Nikki should have settled into backburner status earlier. The children being SORASED so early also led to the problem that 10 years on they too had begun to run out of story possibilities.

5 hours ago, Paul Raven said:

Bill Bell didn't follow his own lead and revamp the show once the lead characters had  exhausted logical story possibilities.

If Eric or Melody had chosen to leave then things would have been different.

Otherwise Victor and Nikki should have settled into backburner status earlier. The children being SORASED so early also led to the problem that 10 years on they too had begun to run out of story possibilities.

yeah, Bell's soaps wet nuts with SORAS back in the 1990's, that's why they're having babies all the time, i really think the minimum time should be 10 years

Re The Fosters and the Brooks. With JLB gone, Peggy never really clicking and Chris and Leslie very much locked into their relationships with Snapper and the 4L's, I agree that the time had come to drop the Brooks.

However I think the Fosters had more longevity. Bill kept Jill on, even going through 2  recasts to keep the character there. He moved her away from Derek/Kay and it worked.

Greg was still viable but the Howard McGillan casting was all wrong, If Wings had been recast better, Greg still had a lot to do. All purpose lawyer in town, confidante to Jill , ex to Nikki and available for romances with Ashley, Julia etc.

Liz should have stayed on with 2 kids on the canvas, her ties to Kay and possible friendship with Mary Williams. Julianna was too good not to be there.

If Robert Colbert had agreed to recurring he could still pop up from time to time and a link to the Brooks family would remain. Maybe he could be used as a talk to for John Abbott.

Then down the track a SORASED Jennifer arrives as a new teen. Maybe a friend to Cricket.

So plenty of options for the Fosters.

A newer generation hasn't really been promoted well enough. once Victor, Nikki and Jack go, you can wrap the show up basically. Core families work on a show like ATWT which was reliant on a more transitional and conservative soap audience, and went for multi a generational cast of characters. 

Core families also work on a large casted show like GH where there are several families (Cassadines, Quartermaines, Spencers) but enough characters outside of them so that everything doesn't become B&B level incestuous. 

Edited August 1, 20223 yr by ironlion

On 7/30/2022 at 5:59 PM, Paul Raven said:

Liz should have stayed on with 2 kids on the canvas, her ties to Kay and possible friendship with Mary Williams. Julianna was too good not to be there.

I could definitely see Liz friends with Mary - with Mary always getting carried away concerning Paul, and Liz trying to be her voice of reason.

Liz also would have made a good ally for Nina.

Y&R should bring on some more of Snapper and Chris's kids or grandkids.  Greg Snapper could've had grown kids or grandkids by now.

If Paul appears more, you could give him nephews or nieces via brother Steven or half siblings via father Jim Bradley aka Carl Williams and his wife. 

Plus why are there so many next generation characters just collecting dust?  Fen could be a spoiler to Summer/Kyle for one example.  Reed should be active on canvas and they definitely should actually use Faith and Moses.

For General Hospital there's lots of options like Tommy Hardy.  For Days. Tommy Horton could've remarried and have grown kids out there, since he hasn't been on canvas in like 40 years. 

For Bold, there's no reason why RJ, the one child of Brooke and Ridge should not be driving major story.  It's practically a crime.  Have him get I to a rivalry with half brother/cousin Jack.

Lots of missed opportunities out there to build on legacy instead of creating one rando character after another.

Edited August 9, 20223 yr by Spoon

At this point (some of) the Newmans could use a rest on Y&R.

They have been going through the same stories forever. Nick and his boring ladies drama, Victoria and Sharon getting married all the time, Adam is so bad, Abby and Noah haven't even found a real purpose in all these years.  

On 8/9/2022 at 1:06 PM, SAPOUNOPERA said:

At this point (some of) the Newmans could use a rest on Y&R.

They have been going through the same stories forever. Nick and his boring ladies drama, Victoria and Sharon getting married all the time, Adam is so bad, Abby and Noah haven't even found a real purpose in all these years.  

I would Do Like this:

Victoria for once decides to step out from the family drama, Either Take a Vacation or Have a Mental Breakdown etc.

Nick would stay single by choice for a while, he wants to find new focus for his lfe, with Victoria Out he could throw himself at work, And He would have to learn how to Work WITH Adam for a change

Abby was born to be a IT Girl but i would give her a real raw deep drama that us mere mortals could have too like being raped for example i could see tons of drama coming from it

I understand the point that people are making about the need to widen the gene pool.  Of course, OLTL created some genetic diversity by introducing the Rappaports.  But they felt so shoved down the viewers throats, especially Sam Rappaport, that many fans became extremely resentful.

Edited August 25, 20223 yr by StevieM

On 6/14/2022 at 3:40 AM, robbwolff said:

The Another World Homepage shows a lot of this is urban legend. Irna was the one who got rid of Granny Matthews and the one who created Ernest Gregory. Lipton later introduced other members of the Gregory family. Alex Gregory stopped appearing while Lipton was head writer. A month later, Agnes killed off the character. She killed off one Gregory, not the whole family as has been claimed for decades. She dropped Karen Gregory days into her run and a month later wrote out Ernest.

I grew up believing Granny Matthews lasted a year and Janet five years, thanks to Robert LaGuardia’s books.  According to Eddie Dreuding, Granny lasted a month and Janet two years.  And this misinformation occurred basically only a decade after the premiere of the show. 
 

A decade later, Christopher Schemering would write that Agnes killed off all of Lipton’s characters (the Gregorys) in a plane crash. 
 

I mean, let’s just make stuff up since virtually nobody is going to contradict us!  LOL. Reminds me of the Wiki on GL’s Cassie about 15 years ago—she was Bill Bauer’s daughter!