All My Children questionaire (please help my thesis)

[JarrodMFiresofLove]

Growing up I had never watched AMC. My father's family watched CBS daytime, and my mother's family watched NBC daytime. So I watched shows on both those networks, never shows on ABC. I remember I was a teen, this was in 1988. We lived in a remote oil town in the middle of nowhere. My mother sent me and one of her friends to some city two and a half hours away to pick up supplies. On the way there my mother's friend and I started talking about soaps. She was an ABC soap fan, in particular AMC. So all the way there and back (about five total hours of driving time) she's telling me about all the main characters. Her anecdotes about Palmer (especially Palmer), Adam, Brooke, Phoebe and Erica made me curious. I thought okay, I will have to try watching this show and see if it's as good as this woman says it is.

 

So I did start watching it, never live, usually videotaping it. And the first storyline I got hooked into was the one with Lauren Holly's character Julie, and her relationship with a guy named Nico (pre-Sonny Corinthos Maurice Benard). I also liked the Palmer-Natalie-Ross story which I thought was very well-acted. Then there was Stuart's relationship with Cindy, the gal with AIDS. And this was around the time Cliff had been in South America and came back from the dead, reuniting with Nina who had become involved with Matt Connolly. AMC had a huge cast and a lot going on, and I did become a fan. But when I went off to college in 1990, I had less time for soaps and only stayed current with CBS soaps.

 

When I tried to reconnect with AMC, around 1992, it felt too different. I didn't like Trevor who seemed to dominate and pop into almost every storyline. I wasn't a fan of Hayley or Arlene, they seemed too loud, too cliched. I did still enjoy Brooke, Tad and the Martins. Erica felt underused in the early 90s, probably because Lucci was on "Dallas' and making TV movies. Adam's stories with Dixie and Brooke and Arlene felt repetitive. Palmer's story with Opal came across silly, it was glorified camp/comic relief that always seemed hollow. I felt like Angie was adrift without Jessie. I really started to dislike the show and stopped watching it again. None of the so-called issue-driven stories during that period could sustain my interest.

 

I would try to go back to it when I heard there had been a head writing change. But I never felt AMC in the 90s was ever as good as AMC in the 80s. Also it seemed like it went out of its way to be too liberal, too hip sometimes, at the expense of telling a simple straightforward story. In the 2000s the show became a showcase for Brian Frons' favorite actors, most of them were untalented pretty boys or egotistical actresses, and it was even more alienating. Ultimately I never had the same love for AMC that my mother's friend had, or the same love I had for other soaps on CBS and NBC that I stayed with for years.

 

Of course you couldn't skim a copy of a soap magazine or check out a book on soaps from the library without reading about Agnes Nixon. So even if you never watched AMC or OLTL you'd still know about her and who she was. In the late 2000s I did become a fan of OLTL. I was late to the party on that show. I think I started watching because I followed Jerry Ver Dorn over from Guiding Light. And then when others like Gina Tognoni and Kim Zimmer were added to OLTL's cast after GL's cancellation, it was easy to stay focused on OLTL. I also remembered Hilary Bailey Smith from her years on ATWT in the 80s, so she was another one whose stories I enjoyed watching on OLTL. I was actually glad AMC had gone off the air a few months before OLTL. I felt OLTL could've gone on, but AMC felt very wrecked in its last few years.

 

The fact both shows had a short second life online gave them new value, in at least an experimental sense. But the budget was different, the sets and cast were limited, and it felt like they were trying to be too daring, too explicit with some of the material. I suspect that Agnes Nixon's involvement in AMC and OLTL became quite peripheral in the 2000s and she tried to help them reboot online.

 

Usually when the creator remains in charge, the tone is consistent and the storytelling does not veer too wildly off center, no matter what the network suits are pressuring the producers to do. I think Agnes' babies got away from her and there's a reason AMC and OLTL didn't last. In a perfect world AMC and OLTL both should have outlasted/outlived Agnes Nixon. But they didn't. I guess there's some consolation in the fact that viewers' memories try to keep the shows' stories and characters alive in some way. But it's not enough.

[cct]

 

 

Not disagreeing with you at all here, but could you go into more detail about what you are saying?

[JarrodMFiresofLove]

 

Well, when I would re-sample the show during those years, especially when Pratt was writing, it just felt like it had no real connection with what came before. I don't think Pratt understood what Pine Valley was all about. But what "wrecked it" for me was when they moved the production to L.A. They lost some talent that did not make the move with them. Losing David Canary (yes, I know he did a short term arc at the beginning of the L.A.-produced episodes) was a huge blow. Jacob Young really couldn't fill Canary's shoes, at least in my opinion. And the whole tone of the show just seemed to change after they went west.

 

In comparison OLTL remained on the east coast and it never lost that "back east" sort of quality it had. The actors weren't coming on to the set all sun tanned after a day on the beach in Malibu. They were coming on to the set after braving the freezing cold weather outside the studio door. Those things affect performance, state of mind, and how the show comes across as a whole.

 

The online reboots were done in Connecticut. So again there was another shift in tone. But I do feel the online episodes, despite Susan Lucci's absence, were closer to how the show had been in its heyday than those two years when it was filmed in L.A.

[cct]

I feel like the show never recovered from McTavish's second stint as writer. I suppose, in an effort to grab ratings like Days and Passions, the show became more fanciful and stunt-driven. Esensten/Brown drove it into the muck and mire (Sextet of Suck) until Chuck Pratt drove it off the edge, as he just didn't seem to care about history or tone. Online definitely felt like the earlier days.

[JarrodMFiresofLove]

 

One thing good about the online version was because they were limited in the number of sets they could use, the show suddenly had a more intimate feel. And it had been trimmed to a half hour so there wasn't any filler comic relief. It helped having Ray MacDonnell and David Canary return for those episodes, plus having characters like Dixie back as well as Angie and Jesse. It's a shame it didn't work out. I didn't miss Lucci like I thought I would. I loved the fact Cameron Mathison was not in the online version. He had dominated the show's final decade on ABC and it was too much.

[KMan101]

 

I'll forever be sad that the online reboots didn't work out. I agree, I didn't miss Lucci that much. I figured she'd have signed on eventually. Same for MEK/Tad. It actually sometimes helps to have a break from characters that have long been on the show, as hard as it is sometimes to see them go. It helps. Actors get bored (MEK was checked out for years), characters stagnate with terrible writing ... (I think OLTL online benefitted from more of the cast from the ABC version moving online -- AMC had to more or less "rebuild" and while I think having other vets like Brooke, Francesca James, Dimitri, etc. around helped, I also think it would have helped the ABC viewers had a few more from the ABC version moved online -- but it's neither here nor there, they were sort of doomed to fail)

 

I like Mathison but Ryan always felt unneccessary. Same for Greenlee and Budig. I like Budig too, but I was fine with both of them not being a part of the online version. Same for Minshew as Kendall. All of them dominated for too long in what basically amounted to bed hopping and babies. (I remember being bummed Thorsten was coming on as Zach but I actually didn't mind him).

 

I also will forever love online AMC for bringing back Michael Nader as Dimitri. And giving me the perfect Miranda and AJ. And seeing Adam and Joe again. And Brooke was central again.

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I didn't like Francesca James as a new character though. I know they were likely going for the trope Agnes liked to use (older matriarch/patriarch shelters young teen) but it was the weakest part to me.

 

So much potential. Sucks.

[JarrodMFiresofLove]

 

I'd like to see the online episodes again for AMC and OLTL. Are they available anywhere for streaming? How many episodes were produced for both shows?

[KMan101]

 

I'm not sure. If I find anything I'll post about it. 

 

EDIT: Looks like maybe try YouTube? I just googled "All My Children 2013 episodes"

[JarrodMFiresofLove]

 

Thanks. Please do!

[mikelyons]

I started watching AMC in utero, but my first memories of AMC begin on Thanksgiving Day, 1990 which I believe was Kelly Ripa's first episode. Since my mom watched AMC from the first episode, it became something of a touchstone in our house. 

I believe I was always aware that the show had writers, but once I started buying soap opera books, I became fully aware of Agnes Nixon and her importance on the show and genre. I believe that first time I noticed a difference in the writing of AMC was when Disney bought ABC (1994-95-ish). They changed the classic falling picture opening to the one against the white background...and I loathed it. That was the beginning of the end for me as the show seemed to lose its fun, its drama, and its heart.

I always loved AMC because I believed in Pine Valley and its residents. It's hard to explain, but it was a TV show which had a heart, fine stories & fine dialogue, excitement, drama, the whole lot. You had nuts like Janet, tortured heroines like Natalie, warm mothers like Mona & Ruth, stand-up guys like Trevor, hunks like Dimitri and, of course, Erica Kane. AMC always felt like home to me, but, alas, that home was systematically torn down from 1994-95 until the very end. It's a fact that still breaks my heart to this day. (PS: The only time I've ever cried while watching TV was the death of Harold the Dog. Ugh. That was hard.)

[dragonflies]

I watched AMC sporadically through the 80's thanks to my Sis in law who watched all the ABC soaps. I never really cared for AMC then, I was more into OLTL, GH and Days.

 

I got hooked on AMC again when I happened to be channel surfing and saw Josh Duhamel as Leo on AMC. I thought "wow what charisma this guy has" and watched faithfully after that, till it became the Ryan Lavery show.

 

I wasn't much into knowing about writer changes unless I read it in SOD or until I happened to join some message boards about ten years ago

[EricMontreal22]

Man I wish we could find out what exactly the original AMC ending (with apparently a Six Feet Under-finale style montage at the end) would have entailed.

I agree with you, while I think OLTL's final year was largely a mess and overrated by the soap press, AMC was worse off--Pratt really decimated it, though in hindsight I think Broderick with Nixon consulting--despite how silly the Davis story was--showed a lot of hope with some fun, good stuff (I admit I loved seeing Erica with Marian and Janet in the mental hospital).  They barely had any time to change things around.  That said, I think AMC online was the better of the two and showed a true attempt to return to form (again, Nixon's involvement--even writing some scenes--probably helped.)

I agree about all of this.  It was also wise to anchor the show around the Hubbards I thought who became the heart of the show, and well deserved.  It was just getting better and better--even odd choices like the Billy Clyde stuff really worked with me (with a few scenes involving him feeling like vintage AMC).

I actually became intrigued with the Francesca James storyline near the end, and her ward (man, I'm forgetting the name) having visions of a menacing man--and then tying it into Billy Clyde.  Really wish I could find out where they were going with that (did James ever interact with the other established characters?  Could she have been somehow related to Kitty/Kelly?)

Esensten/Brown did well with Angie/Jesse (though from reports it seemed like Nixon did consult and help with that)--their main fault was how dull it was and how focused on the characters you mention.  But Pratt really was what destroyed it.  It's been basically confirmed that when McTavish came back in 98, ABC did push for more outrageous DAYS style stories (they had already done so under Broderick--I know one of the writers told me flat out that that was why they had the voodoo story).  Agnes Nixon's return helped bring back a small town feel and I liked the Bianca stuff, Leo, etc, but then when she left in 2001 and left it all to Passanante it really was a mess (all those ghosts running around town!)

Thanks for that Danfling--really enjoyed reading about your young viewing habits.

According to Nixon's memoirs she didn't leave Search for marriage, she was fired and heartbroken by it.  She said Roy Winsor brought on a friend Charlie Irving as her new boss and producer on the show.  The two of them called her into their office and Roy said Charlie had pointed out something about her story projection and that it was too filled with "psychodrama" which housewives had no interest in, and she was fired at the end of her contract's first cycle.

[cct]

 

 

For me, AMC hit its nadir right around that time with Rayfield and Cascio. Dog Boy, random teens, Anna/Alex, fading out of core families...cybersex with Weird JR and Boring Lori...it's saying something that I got down on my knees when McTavish came back.

 

And I hated Corrinne (?) and the voodoo story. Luckily, they dropped it like a hot rock and got back to the mainland. 

[Soapsuds]

Please send money/check to Hair by Rober........hahahahahahaha

[JarrodMFiresofLove]

According to the IMDb, there were 43 episodes produced of the online version of AMC, and 40 episodes of the online version of OLTL. They were reran on Oprah's channel, but have they been available anywhere else?