So, no one took my bait about Andre? I think he suffers from some sort of mental illness and always has even as a child.

I think this could end up being the case. I want to see how the storyline with him taking the pills plays out. Maybe he does have some type of mental disorder, and he's hiding it from family, especially Lucious, because he's afraid that Lucious will be ashamed of him and that this could cost him whatever chance he has of running the company. He knows that he's not Lucious's or Cookie's choice to run the company, and I could see that being one of the reasons why he's hiding his illness. He doesn't want to possibly diminish whatever chances he has of running the company.

We haven't seen flashbacks of Andre as a child yet, maybe we will see some flashbacks of him as a kid, that will give us some more insight as to what is going on with him.

Also, I was thinking along the lines of what DramatistDreamer had said about Cookie's reaction to Andre. I think that she did seem impressed, proud, but also maybe a bit embarrassed that her oldest son had done so well while she was away in prison. After he mentioned that he should have visited her, it seemed like she was implying that she didn't blame him for not visiting her, while he was trying to better himself. I thought that she seemed proud but also a bit embarrassed that she couldn't be there for her oldest son, while he was becoming successful.

Edited January 8, 201510 yr by xtr

With respect to Cookie and Jamal. I think it is as simple as he needs her more. This may not be a PC thing to say but mothers do not dish out love and attention equally.

Well, considering the boy's father put him in a trash can, I think it's inevitable that Cookie would try to make up for that by loving him extra hard. I agree that isn't fair, but it's not surprising. Also, she really doesn't have any relationship with her youngest yet. She's obviously going to try to turn that around, otherwise she wouldn't have bothered taking a broom to him.

I think this could end up being the case. I want to see how the storyline with him taking the pills plays out. Maybe he does have some type of mental disorder, and he's hiding it from family, especially Lucious, because he's afraid that Lucious will be ashamed of him and that this could cost him whatever chance he has of running the company. He knows that he's not Lucious's or Cookie's choice to run the company, and I could see that being one of the reasons why he's hiding his illness. He doesn't want to possibly diminish whatever chances he has of running the company.

We haven't seen flashbacks of Andre as a child yet, maybe we will see some flashbacks of him as a kid, that will give us some more insight as to what is going on with him.

Also, I was thinking along the lines of what DramatistDreamer had said about Cookie's reaction to Andre. I think that she did seem impressed, proud, but also maybe a bit embarrassed that her oldest son had done so well while she was away in prison. After he mentioned that he should have visited her, it seemed like she was implying that she didn't blame him for not visiting her, while he was trying to better himself. I thought that she seemed proud but also a bit embarrassed that she couldn't be there for her oldest son, while he was becoming successful.

I think you are right. Andre sees how Lucious treats his talented gay son. Just imagine how he would treat his none musically inclined mentally ill son. Mental illness definitely has a level of shamed attached to it. And i do think that both Cookie and Lucious value musuc and talent above most things.

I will have to see more of Andre and Cookie interacting before I make a good assessment of them. I just thought it strange that he started off the advice he gave her with, "do you really love me." It could just be the case of getting caught in the shuffle. Cookie gave special attention to Jamal cause he needed it and Hakeem was daddy's prince. That type of thing is usually a middle child ailment.

Cookie = Alexis Carrington

Lucious = Blake Carrington

Hakeem = Fallon

Andre = Adam

Jamal = Steven

#LOVEIT

Is Lucious' new woman supposed to be Krystle, then?

Is Lucious' new woman supposed to be Krystle, then?

Was Krystle passive aggressive? Because if so then yep! Based off the special that aired before the series aired, it seems like Anika is an aloof, passive aggressive witch!

Was Krystle passive aggressive? Because if so then yep! Based off the special that aired before the series aired, it seems like Anika is an aloof, passive aggressive witch!

Nah, Krystle showed you & told you real straight if she didn't like you.

Update: FOX Ordered rush nationals. American Idol & Empire both rose a tenth, to 2.1 and 3.8, respectively. Empire now ties How To Get Away With Murder for the highest rated series premiere of the season.

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2015/01/08/tv-ratings-wednesday-empire-premieres-huge-american-idol-returns-down-law-black-ish-peoples-choice-awards-fall/347264/

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2015/01/08/tv-ratings-wednesday-empire-premieres-huge-american-idol-returns-down-law-black-ish-peoples-choice-awards-fall/347264/

Yes! Eat [!@#$%^&*], Shonda. You know she was on twitter questioning the dialogue on #Empire. I can't stand her shows!

Edited January 9, 201510 yr by ajsp35801

Yes! Eat [!@#$%^&*], Shonda. You know she was on twitter questioning the dialogue on #Empire. I can't stand her shows!

I saw Shonda's tweet too. She needs to realize that FOX, unlike ABC, has always pushed the envelope so this is nothing new. It's part of their history--The Simpson, Tracey Ullman Show, Married with Children, Living Color, Martin.... I don't think she meant malice with it though. I love that Empire pushes the envelope. And unlike Shonda, who refuses to view her shows as "soaps," Lee has come out and said that Empire is a soap. Point. Blank. Period. I think it is smart on his part because soap fans are the most loyal and a quick way to build an audience.

IMO, I think Empire is the start FOX's way of going back to their roots. They are trying to regain their urban audience that they had in the 90s and lost in the 2000s. I think it is smart. Sometimes one (or a few) show can impact the lineup on a network. Look at what all the shows I listed above did for FOX. They were the hottest network in 90s. Especially for younger demos.

If that were the case Fox would be trying to keep Red Band Society from being canceled.

FOX put out a lot of crap over the years, including in their early heyday, but everyone I knew growing up, including a little Jewish kid like me, was watching In Living Color, Living Single, New York Undercover, etc. back then. They had a market cornered and they gave it up.

There's a really good book - I can't remember the title - written in the late 90s or early 00s about how FOX actively abandoned and was ashamed of their black-cast shows from the time X-Files took off. It's one of the reasons I don't trust them. Sleepy Hollow desperately trying to maximize a white cast, and once again, being ashamed of their POC cast, is another reason.

I hope this show does well, but between FOX and all I keep hearing about homophobic writing, I'm going to have to take a long wait and see on this.

You could just watch it and try it for yourself. I know I am about to. Lee Daniels is a gay man, I very much doubt he's out to make something homophobic but homophobia is a reality, especially in that world. (Here is a piece about the show's take.)

And they definitely made a move to get away from their roots. marceline and I have talked before about the culture shock that was Season 4 of New York Undercover.

I doubt he's intending to be homophobic, but if the reaction here and elsewhere is accurate, it's happening anyway. And I'd rather wait and see than get ensnared in flame wars like what went on today.

I doubt he's intending to be homophobic, but if the reaction here and elsewhere is accurate, it's happening anyway.

But that's always going to happen, especially on the Internet. I can't judge a program by its YouTube commenters. I can only watch the show and take it on its (and my) own terms. There is never going to be a show which presents with both quality content and a perfect audience.

Edited January 9, 201510 yr by Vee