Bill Has Done it Again!

[VirginiaHamilton]

It doesn't exempt anyone, period. And as much as I do respect and support our Black biracial president, to hold him up as a sign of ultimate triumph and demolishing of racism is dangerously mythical - especially since he (as well as our wonderful First Lady) has had to make plenty of concessions in order to be the top dog in the Oval Office.

There's no movement going here. He made a half-witted generalization and I've reacted to it accordingly.

[alphanguy74]

When did I say it was ultimate triumph and a sign racism was over? It's a sign of staggering progress, not ultimate victory. But what Bill is basically saying, is that ultimate Victory will never be achieved if people remain uneducated and speak ignorantly as some sort of twisted rebellious act. So what are you saying??? That because complete equality is not here RIGHT NOW, that everyone should just not give a sh!t? That's the best way to guarantee it will NEVER happen, and you'll only have yourself to blame.

[Wales2004]

Generalization I see to an extenrt because it's not prefaced with "if the shoe/cap fits..." But then people usally knows when something does not apply to them. The people to whom it applies tend to be oblivious to that.

Half-witted--I don't see at all. Bill Cosby is of a generation that is less selfish than subsequent ones. When his generation uses the term "community" they mean it in the true sense of the word. Neighbors looking out for each other. He's told stories of how they'd get scolded by neighbors for doing things. People didn't "mind their own business" back then and the village raised the children.

He probably cares and has tried to do more and has done more for the children than all the people who have criticized him.

I read an opinion piece that knocked him in a number of ways and siad that he should not have said what he did in front of white people. The same individual went on to compare what he said to a Chris Rock routine and applauded Crhis Rock for saying, accoridng to him, the same thing as Bill Cosby but in a funnier and better way. He said this routine "N*****s have got to go" was right on the money but Bill Cosby is a senile old out of touch man.

So is it the message? Part of the message? Or simply the messenger?

I couldn't follow his logic or conclusion because I believe Chris Rock's routines are very public. And the idea that it's better to refer to people as a bunch of blanks who have got to is baffling to me.

[alphanguy74]

Wales it's simple deflection... those who are guilty of what Bill is talking about can't handle looking in the mirror, so they attack the messenger. The messenger does not matter if the message is true.

[ReddFoxx]

Maybe some of what he is saying is true, but there are plenty of other groups of people who need to look at themselves and get in the right places. Some people out there will look at a black person who speaks intelligently and is in a good position with utter contempt, because they feel as if that is some sort of infringement on traditional values. Sometimes, it's other blacks who believe that education and advancement is a sign of trying to be white and a lot of times, it's white people who like to bring out the word uppity.

And there are plenty of folks in Appalachia who are poorly educated, hooked on methamphetamine or prescription drugs and on welfare. The bulk of those people are white. Cosby was only addressing his people, who he clearly knows more about, but at this point, I think we have to start addressing all people. Blacks may be disproportionate poor, but at the end of the day, an uneducated black person from a big city public housing project and an uneducated white person from a trailer park in a rural county are both likely to end impoverished. Poor education and poverty is not an exclusively black problem.

[DeeeDee]

+1.

[VirginiaHamilton]

I've been saying from jump that a 'proper name', an excellent command of the English language, and being a product of a two-parent household doesn't shield one from racism in this country or guarantees that one reaches the pinnacle of success, contrary to what the hypocritical Dr. Cosby proclaims in contrast to his virulent disdain towards 'shiftless Negroes'.

[Wales2004]

I actually think that the people about whom he spoke were and remain oblivious to the whole thing.  Those "advocates/experts" who wrote about it and appeared on shows never once brought up the thing I found troubling in his speech.  They were so focused on defending the poor but mainly about attacking him on a point they failed to comprehend.  Here's the quote again:

 

"With names like Shaniqua, Shaligua, Mohammed and all that crap and all of them are in jail. <b>(When we give these kinds names to our children,<u> we give them the strength and inspiration in the meaning of those names. What’s the point of giving them strong names if there is not parenting and values backing it up).</u></b>"

 

In no way did he imply that there was anything with wrong with naming children any of those names,  Queen Latifah's character in <i>Beauty Shop</i> said something along that line when she suggested discussing people giving their kids names to which they cannot live up....calling a pinto a mercedes. The difference is that Bill Cosby wasn't placing the onus of living up to the name on the child, but rather on the parents.

 

But I agree with you about it ultimately being a deflection because attacking Bill Cosby and/or his message advanced nothing.  The problems persist--plenty of complaints and no solutions.

 

Two or three months ago, I saw Marc Morial on MSNBC appealing to Nike to withdraw their planned LeBron James sneakers.  According to him, people would choose to pay the hefty price of the shoes instead of buying necessities.  Bill Cosby made the same point about choosing sneakers over paying for educational aids to help their children.

 

Life doesn't come with guarantees but what is the point of putting a disadvantaged child even further behind the line for the sake of fashion?  Barack Obama isn't proof of a post-racial society.  America is far from that.  What he is, and for that matter all the former Presidents, is an example of what you can accomplish if you don't take on a defeatist attittude.  You might have several degrees and get nothing for it or you might end up in your dream job.  Life is like that.

[DeeeDee]

Exactly.

[SFK]

It's true. And that's why I get sick when I hear people talking about Affirmative Action being based on economic status and not race or sex. Totally missing the point. Black people haven't been denied educations and opportunities merely because they were poor, but because they were black and white people in positions of authority didn't want them around. No first name, manner of talking, or family background will ever change that.

[Cheap21]

Wow, just came into this thread and way too much bullsh-t to read up on

[Wales2004]

I've never heard anyone say that about Affirmative Action but it just goes to show that people can have very little understanding of the things they condemn.

California has a special crusader against it who managed to get a proposition against it through. Now some of the state colleges/universities find ways around that proposition.

Instead of people simply getting angry about it and proclaiming it unfair, they should try to see the whole picture. It is totally unfair for qualified applicants to be overlooked for jobs or schools based on race. What people ignore is that the individuals are qualified which is totally different than just putting some unqualified person in a slot just to be able to fill a quota. A much higher degree of emphasis is placed on the race part than on the qualified part.

I'm not fond of the practice of using the disproportionate line to constitute an argument on race because it requires too much filtering. I've heard people make the claim that both the NFL and NBA should have more black coaches, managers, et al. because both leagues have over a certain percentage of black players. If you turn around and apply that logic to the nation then you're looking at roughly 14% of the population. So it seems as if it would be much better to approach poverty as an economic problem as opposed to a racial problem. It makes absolutely no sense to have black women as the face of welfare when the majority of welfare recipients are white.

America's global ranking as far as education goes is pitiful. That's an across the board problem.

[allmc2008]

I can so Identify with this! I am not Black but what I can identify is the overall message of "Live up the the Stereo type-The Stereo Type will always be there". I hate being a Texan with a passion! I hate the "Uneducated Cowboy" persona along with the accent that I have spent a life time (well from all the life I have lived so far anyway) trying to depart from.