Members Angela Posted March 8, 2012 Members Share Posted March 8, 2012 Highest rated non-sporting event ever for HBO at that time. She still has the same back-up singers? I was watching a clip from I think S&S Tour and they looked like the same back-up singers. I was reading some old articles the other day. Before "Sex" and After "Sex." The bolded part is so accurate. I'm not sure why she tries to make that about men and women even though she may have a point. The fact is along with gay men, young girls and teenagers made up her fanbase and she had a very public frickin naked, sex-ed up times infinity period. I was 12ish at this time and that's not what i wanted to see...because I was 12. Then lets add in the parents she upset greatly, lol. I fit in the latter group but she's really lucky she was able to climb out of that somewhat successfully, very successfully. It wasn't all luck at all, it was business savvy and that's why I got respect for her. She could have not gotten back up from the beating she took for that period. That was a big ass hole she digged to jump into. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Y&RWorldTurner Posted March 8, 2012 Members Share Posted March 8, 2012 (edited) The Sex book wasn't even that graphic, IMO. That 92-93 period was scathing for her. She was overexposed, and you couldn't turn on the TV or read a magazine without something talking about her. Up until that point there had been a careful balance between the music and the image she was trying to convey, and the music was lost in the shuffle during that era. Not to mention, Erotica was never a particularly commercial and radio friendly album, and one of the reasons she primarily focused on ballads in the mid 90's (with Something To Remember), was to soften up her image. Bedtime Story was her transition album, and one of her most dated IMO. Of course, in addition to motherhood and the glow she had after Evita, it all laid the groundwork for Ray of Light in the end. Edited March 8, 2012 by Y&RWorldTurner 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Angela Posted March 8, 2012 Members Share Posted March 8, 2012 In more ways than one. I don't blame the press. She was being a (rebelling) exhibitionist past a functional degree. The more the press was on her the more she wanted to say f-u, f-u, f-u, instead of "you may have a point." Reminds me of parents and a child. The transition was quite brilliant though from Erotica/Justify My Love/Sex to Bedtime Stories (45 to 90 degrees) to strong ballads and Evita (90 to 135 degrees) then to ultimately motherhood and Ray of Light (135 degrees, she'll never do a 180, lol). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Angela Posted March 8, 2012 Members Share Posted March 8, 2012 I was just looking through my old tapes (not video tapes). First I was sad that I have not one cassette player in my life anymore lol. I have the Like A Prayer album, I have the Immaculate Collection album and I have the Bedtime Stories album (all on cassette). I'm not sure why I bought that last album, I liked Bedtime Story (lets get unconscious baby) but I only loved Take a Bow from that set. I also have the "One Sweet Day" single (Mariah), hee. Cyndi, Bette and Celine round out my collection (all greatest hits type albums). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members EricMontreal22 Posted March 8, 2012 Members Share Posted March 8, 2012 Yes, this aired oddly in Canada too on a Quebecois station (I say oddly because we also got the HBO, France one but some months later since Canada didn't have HBO Canada back then). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members EricMontreal22 Posted March 8, 2012 Members Share Posted March 8, 2012 (edited) I love both of those, though it's hard to pick between the two Express Yourselves from each tour. I know she burned her bridges apparently with Nicki Harris after the Drowned World tour, but I wouldn't mind seeing Donna DeLory back as a backup singer on this new tour--I missed her (*among other things) during Sticky and Sweet. For Confessions our seats were right at the part of the stage Donna was often at when Madonna would be elsewhere, and she really was a great performer in her own way. I also find it kinda funny how Madonna largely poipularized those head mics for dance heavy shows--but then (and partly due to Madonna herself, as she did lip synch more back then, and used them for completely lip synched TV appearances) they became so connected in people's heads with lip synching (also thanks to Janet, who did it much more), that now most performers have gone back to hand mikes, even when they do heavy choreography, as a sort of proof that they're singing live, including Madonna... My only problem with Keep it Together (such an underated/forgotten single) is they really should have given Bob Fosse some credit for the rip off. Then again, Paula and Beyonce never have, and at least Madonna did do some (minor) work with him, so... Edited March 8, 2012 by EricMontreal22 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members EricMontreal22 Posted March 8, 2012 Members Share Posted March 8, 2012 I was 11 or 12 at the time, and I remember going on a school trip to the library and some boys in my class trying desperately to see if they had the book (I think there was a rumour they kept a copy you had to read IN the library, but now I'm thinking that's probably not very likely at the library we were at...) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members EricMontreal22 Posted March 8, 2012 Members Share Posted March 8, 2012 Absolutely. I love a lot fo Bedtime Stories, but working with softer R&B producers (Babyface, etc) never fully suited her (though it was fairly brave to still end with a song written by Bjork). I actually did really love the Something to Remember ballad compilation though, although I haven't played it much for a while. I think in some ways she would have had somewhat of a backlash anyway--and it's not like Erotica was a huge flop, but I do see some of it as her fault. Sex isn't very graphic (a lot of it is kinda dumb--the diary sex fantasies, umm her and Vanilla Ice lol, or pseudo arty), and of course it's barely a blip now in the era of internet porn and celeb sex tapes, but... She also initially marketed Erotica as almost aural pornography--it was seen as that out there, when really, after the lead single and her Dita dominatrix image, the album isn't very erotic at all (one critics said, I remember, that some might be surprised that a song called "Why's It So Hard" on an album called Erotica is about compassion and understanding). It's perhaps my favorite album of hers, though it's still a fairly tough listen--it's long (it was sold on double vinyls), it uses a lot of less mainstream forms at the time like a more commercialized form of "sleaze" which was big in gay clubs, etc. Even early on in the project she started to try to soften her image, releasing Rain and Bad Girl from it. (It may have thrown people that just before Erotica's lead single came out, she had a US number one with This Used to be My Playground from League Of Our Own, which shared Erotica's main producer with Shep Pettibone, but feels like it fits much more with the I'll Remember/Bedtime Stories Madonna era). But I think even without courting controversy, Madonna had reached such a height, that some backlash was inevitable--it's just the way it goes. . Angela, does your Like a Prayer casette still smell like petchouli or have the safe sex insert? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Angela Posted March 8, 2012 Members Share Posted March 8, 2012 Or much any library, hee. See, the thing about sex tapes is they all lie and use "oops, somebody else leaked it." Save lying, it's almost equivalent to Madonna's Penthouse and Playboy spreads - she admittingly did take nude pictures before her career got started but she didn't do it for the purpose of them being spread in the worlds two largest soft-porn magazines when she was famous. There's a victim element to it. To this day, if a young female or male person who was a hit with young women (and men) - teenagers - was openly and willingly exposing everything on the street and in a book about sex I STILL think it would still be an issue. Madonna opened the door for hot, sexy & controversial videos but nobody could open the door for bringing that much blatent nudity and soft core porn to the mainstream. Yes, you can push the envelope pretty dang far with intelligent craftsmanship but opening it is another story. There's no denying the book and the video (Justify My Love) sold well but eh. I've never seen the book and I didn't even think about buying the Erotica album so I can't really judge the album. Circa Sex, since childhood I've seen a picture or two and I did see Madonna "hitch-hiking" nude via the news way back in the early 1990s. For some reason I only have left the plastic cover and accompanying material for Bedtime Stories out of the three Madonna albums, Eric. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Angela Posted March 8, 2012 Members Share Posted March 8, 2012 Color me a little bit surprised, Gang Bang (really? really?? really??? lol) has been the only single/snippet to win me over almost instantly so far. The beats are not drowning her voice out as much. The music is a little bit less generic. I look forward to hearing how the longer version of this one sounds. This song should have been titled Bang Bang from the sound of it but I guess Gang Bang is more interesting a title choice. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members EricMontreal22 Posted March 9, 2012 Members Share Posted March 9, 2012 They said the reason Gang Bang has that title (besides obviously to provoke) is it was called Bang Bang, but they didn't want it to have the same name as the famous Cher (and every other cover artist) song. Same with why Gimme All your Luvin is spelled that way, so it's not mixed up for the more famous song of thesame name. Apparently... I love that clip! LOL I hope she does it live, I could see a crazy staging for it. Angela, Erotica really is a good album--there's one awful one-joke song about cunninlingus (I'm sure I spelt that wrong, it's not a word I use often lol), but otherwise it really doesn't even have much to do with sex. I really hope she'll do Deeper and Deeper again on some tour I get to see live. As for the Sex book--you can see it very easily online if you're curious. Honestly I think what shocked most was, as you say, the idea that she was doing this book. It's not hardcore pornography--it is soft porn I guess but even then it's hidden under the claim of being arty (whether it is or not is not up for me to judge, but I mean the shots are all staged, often somewhat obscure in terms of if you can see what's going on, etc). I personally wish it was more genuinely arty--it's soimply not very good at what Madonna claims she was trying to accomplish IMHO which would be a book of photographs and writing that were erotic but genuinely had some artistic credit, they weren't just there to shock, but were there to provoke a reaction. To me the book fails at that--so it's not good porn, not good art, it's just kinda junk. I also don't really buy that Madonna ever felt a victim about the reaction to the book--yes she got criticism for it, but she was NOT blacklisted at all by it the way some people might be. It seems to have fulfilled all the goals I suspect she had for it--it' got a huge reaction, it sold well, etc. At that point, like I've said, I think Madonna would hjave had some negative backlash no matter what she did as she had gotten so big. What I meant about how now we net porn and sex tapes things are different was more that the book looks even more tame now when any kid can do an innocent google search and suddenly be shocked to see some random porn image. I really think in that sense it woul dbe a much bigger non event now, and really if she wanted to make as big a rucus in this day and age she would have to do a hardcore porn movie or something. Things have changed that much in the past 20 years. You are right though that sex tapes, even though we all know this is often not true, still allow the performer to hide behind claims of it not being their fault that it leaked. (Althoughif Madonna had had a sex tape leakj out in 1991 it probably would have had a stronger reaction than they do now). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Angela Posted March 9, 2012 Members Share Posted March 9, 2012 Yeah, I guess I do agree with that to a point. I am not. I become disillusioned when I see a famous person naked too much. So, yeah I've seen more than enough of naked Madonna I'm looking at the singles list from Erotica. From video play: I did like Deeper and Deeper. I liked the different sound of the single Erotica. I also enjoyed Bad Girl, Rain and the remake of Fever (the Fever video was pretty ne...cool). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Y&RWorldTurner Posted March 9, 2012 Members Share Posted March 9, 2012 (edited) Some of Shep's Pettibone's best work was with the Erotica era remixes, which were heavily house-influenced and surpassed a lot of the album versions. <iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/k3rqs5LaXZw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe> Edited March 9, 2012 by Y&RWorldTurner 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Y&RWorldTurner Posted March 9, 2012 Members Share Posted March 9, 2012 (edited) One of the best Behind The Music specials VH1 ever did was Madonna's. There's an even longer version from 2001, but here is the original version that aired in 1998 during the Ray of Light era. She talks about the Sex book era in this part ...http://vimeo.com/6743317 (I can't embed the video or post the link fully) Edited March 9, 2012 by Y&RWorldTurner 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Soapsuds Posted March 9, 2012 Members Share Posted March 9, 2012 On this song I actually prefered the original version 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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