But ita to whomever who said that DG is the mvp so far to me, he's really brought it and truly looks and act like a man broken and desperate.

I think DG is a good actor. It's when he's paired w/ CKLily doing the baby talk and all that drags him down so I hope they stay apart. DG said on his Twitter on Fri. that all the scenes were shot back to back and in one take. I think he's been doing a great job in this storyline too. But...the story itself is just pure and utter nonsense. I'm not buying what they are trying to sell me. This storyline along w/ pretty much everything going on right now is just disappointing to me--I honestly don't know which character will do what next b/c no one is acting true to character anymore.

Edited July 8, 200916 yr by loveshery&r

Khalil isn't nearly as bad as people are saying.

But she is.

Brianne Moncrief bad.

I felt every emotion from her hurt to anger

I totally appreciate CK's organic, subtle style. I can always see the emotion in her eyes.

If CK and all the others who are supposedly so awful actually were then they would have been replaced, end of story. It's not like Y&R hasn't recast characters when the actors are not suitable: Eden, Billy, and Daniel to name a few.

After seeing TB now, I really wish they had just kept his run on the show to Cane replaying that scene of "I'm In" and we see Phillip there on the other end of the phone. I was so excited after that scene but these current ones are leaving me cold. I think this might be more fun if Nina got to confront Cane about the frozen blood and being backed into a corner he was forced to admit that the real Phillip is alive but appears to have gone into hiding. Nina could have the blood tested for Huntington's and they could start an international man hunt but leave it at that. If TB doesn't want to act but MAB wants to help him out, why not commission some of his paintings for the art collection Victoria is rebuilding for Victor or for her own?

Heather should totally be prosecuting these frauds, but then she might not come off as the bad guy and MAB seems intent on destroying the Williams family. That also wouldn't fit in really well with her get the Newman's agenda.

As much as SH is selling her story, it is going into a corner that I see no way out of. To me Sharon should be her target instead of Phyllis as she's the one who is keeping Jack away from her. Patty must also be a very terrible lay as Jack only seems interested when he's got no other options.

On a side note, I enjoyed Wednesday's US show, mainly because there was no P3 storyline and the Sharon/Phyllis scenes were quite touching. I am however, sick of Nick's feeling sorry for himself, like he deserves to get everything he wants in life.

I think both Khalil and Goddard are FINE. Bryton was great yesterday. I loved Neil as protective-daddy-with-big-guns! It all worked. This has been a shot in the arm for the Winters.

Yes! And it goes to show that they don't need Tyra or Ana or any other 'exciting' newcomers. (Although I would welcome Karen back with open arms.)

I totally appreciate CK's organic, subtle style. I can always see the emotion in her eyes.

If CK and all the others who are supposedly so awful actually were then they would have been replaced, end of story. It's not like Y&R hasn't recast characters when the actors are not suitable: Eden, Billy, and Daniel to name a few.

Word.

After seeing TB now, I really wish they had just kept his run on the show to Cane replaying that scene of "I'm In" and we see Phillip there on the other end of the phone. I was so excited after that scene but these current ones are leaving me cold. I think this might be more fun if Nina got to confront Cane about the frozen blood and being backed into a corner he was forced to admit that the real Phillip is alive but appears to have gone into hiding. Nina could have the blood tested for Huntington's and they could start an international man hunt but leave it at that. If TB doesn't want to act but MAB wants to help him out, why not commission some of his paintings for the art collection Victoria is rebuilding for Victor or for her own?

I think they should have eased him in more slowly, a set amount of scenes over a period of weeks, to let him get more used to acting again. Not just a few scenes then a long gap and suddenly he gets heavy material. I still think they should have had it where he faked his death because he was in danger and didn't want his family to be put in danger, then he sent Cane because he heard that Katherine and Jill were investigating the past and he was afraid they'd find out about him.

They could have still made him gay, if that's what they wanted to do. It just didn't have to be the reason he wanted to be away from them.

I want to like this story, because it involves several of my favorite characters and is the only one which isn't centered on complete ugliness or on wacky hijinks, but the inability to plot or pace seems to be flaring up.

Tuesday's episode was pretty good. Bierdz isn't as horrible. His speech is a bit stilted, but he's not horrendous.

I know what you mean about his speech, but three things struck me. First, he grew up in Wisconsin for real (I believe), and I really heard the "midwest" in his voice. I don't remember that so much from his earlier stint... Second, I wondered if he was extra-enunciating to try and counter the more relaxed habits of speech that we all develop when we are not on camera. Most importantly, I actually found the nature of his delivery quite close to that of "Brock".

Regardless, it is not a speaking style I find particularly off-putting. I could readily get used to it.

I don't understand Maria and Company's purpose for creating this ridiculous rewrite, especially when she only gave Bierdz a 6 month contract. What is she trying to accomplish that she couldn't do without Bierdz being there and pissing on a ton of history? If Bierdz is gone in 6 months, what did storyline really accomplish other than messing with already troubled history (thanks initially to Latham), make Phillip III an even more unlikable character, and forcing so many unrealistic excuses and holes in this storyline on the audience?

Here's what I think she accomplishes: [ a ] She brings Nina back to the cast for a while. Cast has been universally popular since she first showed up at Kay's funeral. [ b ] She undoes a death that many of us felt was a mistake. I could have done without this retcon, but the point is that it eliminates a key concern. [ c ] She introduces an out gay character (who is apparently now comfortable in his skin) as a member of a core family...thus breaking the gay moratorium at Y&R since 1977. [ d ] CHANCE! She introduces the young scion of one of her core families...giving that family still further life and extending it into the future.

I totally appreciate CK's organic, subtle style. I can always see the emotion in her eyes.

If CK and all the others who are supposedly so awful actually were then they would have been replaced, end of story. It's not like Y&R hasn't recast characters when the actors are not suitable: Eden, Billy, and Daniel to name a few.

Both good points. I do understand the concerns about CK-Lily. There is no denying it is sometimes hard to see her as Dru's daughter, and she sometimes seems to have evinced little growth from her younger days. At the same time, I am continually reminded that she is a Paris-educated spoiled girl...and I think CK-Lily actually conveys that nicely.

In this case, within the way Lily has been defined, I found Lily's behavior both realistic and even emotionally affecting. I found KSJ remarkably powerful as the angry and protective daddy too. The fact that he interfered while Lily was trying to do her business with Cane is a true mark of Neil's character consistency. He has always tried to impose his will on his family.

Yes! And it goes to show that they don't need Tyra or Ana or any other 'exciting' newcomers. (Although I would welcome Karen back with open arms.)

Very good observation, and I agree about Karen (if she is written as she was at the end).

Here's what I think she accomplishes: [ a ] She brings Nina back to the cast for a while. Cast has been universally popular since she first showed up at Kay's funeral. [ b ] She undoes a death that many of us felt was a mistake. I could have done without this retcon, but the point is that it eliminates a key concern. [ c ] She introduces an out gay character (who is apparently now comfortable in his skin) as a member of a core family...thus breaking the gay moratorium at Y&R since 1977. [ d ] CHANCE! She introduces the young scion of one of her core families...giving that family still further life and extending it into the future.

Most of this could have EASILY been done without the damage this rewrite creates, Mark...

In the end, we'll be asking ourselves if all of this is worth it. Right now, I'd say no. Especially if Bierdz is gone in 6 months.

We clearly see that she's feeding us bad explanations and her storyline is riddled in holes. Why the hell should I invest in something that clearly takes me and other viewers as idiots?

Edited July 8, 200916 yr by Y&RWorldTurner

Even though I am not overly impressed with TB's acting as of yet, I am not sure if better acting would make a difference. As many of you have said, it's the writing that's the problem. The reveal is feeling really rushed and disjointed. Yes, MarkH, you can hear the upper midwest in TB's accent. It's a nice bonus to hear some authentic Wisconsin on a show with Ausleen! TB & TC really have got some great chemistry. In a weird way it's really working against the Phillip is gay story because you keep expecting him to say, "I'm gay, Nina, except when it comes to you!"

CK is fine as Lily. Of all the problems with this show, she is not one of them.

Monday's episode seemed very phoned in for Khalil but today was better in some parts.

Monday's episode seemed very phoned in for Khalil but today was better in some parts.

I actually enjoyed her confrontation with Goddard tuesday. She finally evoked something. But I hated how she handed the ring back to him. I would've thrown the thing across the room. But whatever. Cane is the one who needs to leave that brat.

And I hated KSJ nearly knocking down the door. It seemed like he was Lily's lover, not her father. Lily was the one who went over there anyway, the way that scene was set up was ineffective. There was a beat and a bunch of emotions missing.

I could say the same thing for the scene with Phyllis and Heather. It seemed like something was missing. Like Heather should've been just as angry at Phyllis. Her motivation should've been emphasized because her reaction for being slapped didn't seem correct to me. If I'm a lawyer trying to do my job, I would've been pissed that this woman who I believe poisoned her daughter slapped me.

Morrow was really good too on Tuesday. He must've really had difficulty understanding the quad s/l , which is why he couldn't emote anything really. Since Summer's been in the hospital, he's been good.

Mary Jane's creeping me out.

The preview of Rafe and Adam looks realllllly good.

The Slap

When does this slap happen? I may have to watch just for this lol. Forget the Winter's Heather is Y&R's stepchild

CK is fine as Lily. Of all the problems with this show, she is not one of them.

Agreed. It all begins and ends with the writing: story planning to dialogue. If you are going to do your grand retcons at least take the time to lay the ground work. Even the little things like the way they ignore and neglect past relationships and friendships preferring instead to relegate characters to a certain story and group.

One day it will get better.

When does this slap happen? I may have to watch just for this lol. Forget the Winter's Heather is Y&R's stepchild

The slap was on yesterday's show. I like Heather but was so glad Phyliss slapped the [!@#$%^&*] out of her...LOL.