Members MarkH Posted May 31, 2009 Members Share Posted May 31, 2009 Michael was never good as frontburner? Total Emmy victor...I think that disputes your claim somewhat. Judith Chapman is entertainment just by appearing on screen. Total gem. That's why she is around. She is NEVER not entertaining, even if you hate Gloria. And MAB has said in several interviews now that she "likes the funny". The Fisher-Baldwins and Amber, despite their detractors, consistently bring the funny. No no no to the Williams clan. If canvas-paring needs to be done, cutting Vail and Paul and Mary Jane is done much more quickly and easily. Sadly, they won't even be missed. Not so for the Fisher-Baldwins. Their departure would suck the entertainment right off the canvas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members lmfan Posted May 31, 2009 Members Share Posted May 31, 2009 I would be fine with all of that. I like Jana and EOB but MAB seems to want to pair Kevin with Amber. I like JC and TS and think they are good actors, but Gloria and Jeff have run their course and Gloria has hurt the Michael and Lauren characters trememendously because they have written them as nothing but props for Gloria for years. I don't expect either Michael or Lauren to be lead, but they are good actors who can play strong supporting characters if MAB just used them. I also think they need some conflict. I also think MAB needs to remember Lauren has connections to so many characters on the canvas other than the Fishers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members lmfan Posted May 31, 2009 Members Share Posted May 31, 2009 Mark, the problem is that MAB doesn't want to write Michael as lead. I have come to accept that, so I would rather see CLB get some great support work like he did in the past than continue to be used as a prop to Gloria and Kevin. Gloria can be a funny character, but she brings so much baggage with her with the cream scandal and I loved Gloria and Jeffrey paired in the beginning, but the way Jeffrey and Gloria have been written as a couple I wonder who in the audience is still rooting for them. And I afraid that as long as Gloria is on the canvas, Michael and Lauren will not get a story other than propping her, so I would rather have Michael and Lauren get story than Gloria and Jeffrey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members dm. Posted May 31, 2009 Members Share Posted May 31, 2009 I just wanted to say that he's amazing as a strong supporting character, not leading man material. And that's why she submitted that episode for the Emmys... stupid, stupid. She had a lot of amazing material to submit instead. Chapman is a wonderful actress; the character is so played out that I want to scream. Well you can't exactly say anything about this since we can't see much of the family. Hiring a good actress to play Mary would add some fun... having Kevin around as wise-cracking coffee shop employee is enough. Meanwhile, I'd cut the Winters family before either of this families. Neil is just horrible; Tyra and Ana don't know how to act; nobody cares if Tyra isn't related to Devon... this family is basically nothing with a strong female like Dru. Exactly! Gloria hurt Michael and Lauren as characters in so many ways... Totally! Lauren would never be the type of character to just settle down and keep quiet about all the craziness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MarkH Posted May 31, 2009 Members Share Posted May 31, 2009 Well, if they brought in a good actress for Mary (Betsy Palmer was recently suggested) that could totally energize the Williams. But...and I know for some this is not a good reason...I feel the Winters deserves extra attention for reasons of diversity. It is NICE to see a rainbow canvas, and it is SUCH A WASTE that Y&R threw theirs away. That's why I asked yesterday about how to fix this situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members dm. Posted May 31, 2009 Members Share Posted May 31, 2009 Me too; that's the first family I would fix. And it's easy. But for some reason (probably unknown to God) the writers don't know how to write for this family without Rowell there. Maybe it is the fact that all of these characters are so bland. Neil has never been way too interesting, Lily is (enter all the previous comments), and Devon is no fun either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members lmfan Posted May 31, 2009 Members Share Posted May 31, 2009 I think they wasted a good potential Bloom and Engen pairing, but I don't see them as big a loss as the backburning and potential loss of Michael and Lauren. As for B&B, Michael is a lawyer so could fit in anywhere. They could even have him floating between both shows as both B&B and Y&R happen in the same universe. By the way, I don't want Lauren and Michael to go to B&B, but if MAB refuses to write for them, maybe they can be used over on B&B since Lauren was a regular and Michael has done a number of crossovers. As for Nick and Phyllis, I just don't see what Nick does for Phyllis at this point. Their affair was hot, but I think the scenes with MS and PB this week show us how much better of an actress MS is when pushed in scenes by PB or even CLB. I think you are right on about Nick meeting Phyllis' physical needs while she turns to Michael and Jack for her cerebral needs. This has been true through her whole marriage. Michael has always been the one she confided in even before her husband (her pregnancy, her blackmailing of Sharon and Brad, what happened with Dru on the cliff, her true feelings about Nick and Sharon's kiss and affair) but her begging and twisting to hold on to Nick at this point is weakening her character. I don't know if I want Phyllis back with Jack, but from an acting stand point their scenes crackle, and I just like watching them in scenes together. Phyllis desperately needs a friend right now and Lauren needs some scenes, so why they can't write Phyllis turning to Michael and/or Lauren for advice is beyond me. As for Phyllis and Nick, at some point in a marriage, you need more than the physical. I believe Phyllis is fighting for an idealized marriage she never really had with Nick. Nick needs a time out. Phyllis should dump him and Sharon should not fall right back into his arms again with her life in so much turmoil. We need to see Nick actually reflect on his actions. I get that he has been the sexy himbo, but the guy is in his mid 30s and needs to show some growth if we are to take him seriously in any story. I don't find him realistic in the business setting and with his indecisiveness with Phyllis and Sharon, how can we believe him in any relationship at this point? Karma has come knocking at Phyllis, Sharon and Jack's doors. I think Nick is in need of a big helping of karma at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members lmfan Posted May 31, 2009 Members Share Posted May 31, 2009 They need to get rid of Tyra and Anna pronto. I don't know what they can do about Lily because Christel Kalil is who she is and unless they recast her I think we get what we get. Her learning that Cane betrayed her should send her realing, but I don't know if CK's acting will reflect that. I think Devon is actually a pretty decent actor, but he hasn't had the writing. I thought having Michael be his father might be a decent story because it could possibly cause some conflict between Michael and Lauren, Michael and Neil, and integrate the Winter's a bit more but I don't know how much potential that story would have long term. I think they need to recast Dru or bring in a very good, dynamic actress to work with Neil. He is laid back and he worked with Dru because she was so energetic. I don't think the show will bring VR back, so they need to look for another strong, over 35 actress to work with Neil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cara mia Posted May 31, 2009 Members Share Posted May 31, 2009 Michael/Lauren are a potential supercouple so as a romantic couple, they should have story as a couple. They could be a great comic Thin Man type couple and the show is wasting their chemistry. From a pure character view though, Adam had the potential to be worth more than all the Fisher-Baldwins put together. This is Victor Newman Jr. for goodness sake and he has been terribly & criminally wasted. It's quite amazing how MAB & the Gang messed up the writing for a character that writes itself. As for the Winters -- they are all boring outside of Dru. They are all supporting players in search of a lead. The way to revitalize them (outside of VR returning) is bring on a sexy & smart leading man to play Nate. He should have the charm of a young Malcolm or the fire of a male Dru. And since he's Olivia's son, and the actress is willing to recur, build the core of the family around them. Technically they are not "Winters" but close enough. Does Neil really need a woman? Does Jill need a man? Now I'm going to sound like Moila (where did she go?) but the show needs to fix the younger characters first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DeeeDee Posted May 31, 2009 Members Share Posted May 31, 2009 Amen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members soapydoc Posted May 31, 2009 Members Share Posted May 31, 2009 I absolutely agree with this. Josh can't be Peter because that is not his style nor in his comfort zone. His scenes with Phyllis after she confessed she was in Paris were extremely moving. Their fight when he found out about her trying to set up Brad as replacement once the Shack marriage went sour was actually powerful. He simply has to do what he can do with what he's got. He can and has come through. I do think that this storyline is a tough one for him. He does not seem to enjoy Nick being the huge dick in the center of this story. I wonder if he thinks by putting MORE into his scenes that he will look like an even bigger jerk. His extreme discomfort with what he's being given came home for me on tomorrow's show. I don't, for a second, believe him in any of his scenes. That's a big deal for me as a fan. Michelle Stafford is the wronged wife, Peter Bergman is the supportive ex, and Sharon Case is the mentally ill flawed heroine. Who is Josh playing? Nick the dick, who feels "guilty" about his past but is so dumb he's moving at full speed ahead to repeat his mistakes. Out of the four of them, he has the crappiest motivation for his character's behavior. The actor is trying but he seems very uneasy. Hey, it's his job to make us believe him. But the better he is at making us believe him, the more we are going to hate him. I suspect that's at the back of his mind or even the front. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MTSRocks Posted May 31, 2009 Members Share Posted May 31, 2009 MAB does a good job bringing back characters from the past, but when it come to integrating the current canvas, she can do a better job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jcar03 Posted May 31, 2009 Members Share Posted May 31, 2009 This is already on the second page and the week hasn't even started yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members dm. Posted May 31, 2009 Members Share Posted May 31, 2009 You should have seen how many pages last few weeks had on the first day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DeeeDee Posted May 31, 2009 Members Share Posted May 31, 2009 :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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