20 hours ago, DRW50 said:

 I would have recast Russ rather than bringing back Bailey.

To reiterate our discussion about the current DAYS writing team, the issue with casting Russ should have been secondary—if Olivia had been a well-crafted character, her lineage wouldn’t have had to carry the weight. The case of Olivia is a clear lesson: simply belonging to a storied family like the Matthews does not guarantee a character’s popularity or resonance. What we needed was depth—perhaps more insight into how her identity as a dancer shaped her personal life. That kind of interiority could have made her genuinely compelling.

Invoking legacy by name alone—be it Matthews, Harrison, or any other—amounts to little more than empty gesture if it isn’t anchored in the present storytelling. A legacy is only meaningful if it meaningfully informs a character’s evolution.

Take Willis, for example—arguably my first favorite character. Would I have appreciated an update on him in 1989? Certainly. But simply reintroducing him wouldn’t have worked in that moment. By then, the show’s tone had shifted, and the qualities that once made Willis dynamic would have needed adjustment to remain palatable to a late-’80s audience. Nostalgia can’t write itself.

It’s easy to lament the way soaps sometimes seem to forget their own history, but honestly, I can’t think of a single instance where a new writer successfully resurrected an old plotline or introduced a character from a legacy family that truly landed with the audience. Soap fans are nothing if not imaginative—we project myriad possibilities onto past characters. So when a new writer delivers a definitive, canonical outcome for a returning figure, it almost inevitably falls short of the expectations we’ve built in our minds.

 

Bad Recasts:

Russell Todd ( Jamie Frame)      Very Bland...

Linda Borgeson ( Alice Frame)   Boring...Boring...Boring...

Judy Dewey  ( Blaine Ewing)     What a letdown after Laura Malone...

Good Recasts

Irene Dailey ( Liz Matthews)     Great Actress...Great chemistry with Doug Watson, Victoria Wyndham, Beverley Penberthy and Hugh Marlowe...

Nancy Frangione ( Cecile DePoulignac)  I did enjoy Susan Keith as Cecile.

11 minutes ago, j swift said:

To reiterate our discussion about the current DAYS writing team, the issue with casting Russ should have been secondary—if Olivia had been a well-crafted character, her lineage wouldn’t have had to carry the weight. The case of Olivia is a clear lesson: simply belonging to a storied family like the Matthews does not guarantee a character’s popularity or resonance. What we needed was depth—perhaps more insight into how her identity as a dancer shaped her personal life. That kind of interiority could have made her genuinely compelling.

I actually did think Olivia was compelling, although that may be more down to Allison Hossack than the writing. She was mostly just used as an obstacle for Sam/Amanda rather than a character in her own right. 

I think that Russ was important as a character in his own right, especially if they knew another important character in his age range (Mitch) was going. They would repeatedly try to find more men in this age range and none stuck, due to actors leaving or story issues. The most successful was Carl, who had tried to kill much of the canvas. If they had found a strong actor for Russ and rooted him to the canvas, it would have been good for present day, good for Rachel, Iris, etc. not just because he was a Matthews.

14 minutes ago, jmgaw said:

Bad Recasts:

Russell Todd ( Jamie Frame)      Very Bland...

Linda Borgeson ( Alice Frame)   Boring...Boring...Boring...

Judy Dewey  ( Blaine Ewing)     What a letdown after Laura Malone...

Good Recasts

Irene Dailey ( Liz Matthews)     Great Actress...Great chemistry with Doug Watson, Victoria Wyndham, Beverley Penberthy and Hugh Marlowe...

Nancy Frangione ( Cecile DePoulignac)  I did enjoy Susan Keith as Cecile.

I think you're new here & so I want to say WELCOME! (If you're not new, oops.)

 

15 hours ago, Contessa Donatella said:

You didn' t love her when Amy played her? I ask only because I did.

I think Amy is a good actress who was probably best served by her work in her primetime procedurals. Josie was such an aimless character and then they decided to just make her into cop Harley. Not really a fan of Gary/Josie either - AW is probably Tim Gibbs' best soap work, but the stories are all a slog.

I am a fan of Alison Hossack and enjoyed Olivia when she was given something interesting to do. The issue was not Hossack or David Bailey. The issue was that Donna Swajeski did not have a vision for them. If Harding Lemay has remained as Head Writer I believe both Olivia and Russ would have had a more significant and longer lasting presence.

Olivia did have a strong friendship with Jenna, even advising her on how to navigate men and sex.. when it came to Dean.   She also did have a good working relationship with Matt/Jake/Dean at the record company.

Ironically, the last months of her stint with the pregnancy and her scenes with Marley while discussing the pregnancy and possible adoption were pretty good scenes.  Plus, the fact that the real father was Dennis thus her baby would have been Iris's grand daughter and a Cory.

While Hossack opted to leave at the end of her contract, it's a shame that the show didn't think to later recast the character and bring her back to the show with the baby and having to deal with Iris as a pesky presence in her life.  Aunt Liz would have certainly gone up against Iris for sure.

5 minutes ago, Soaplovers said:

Olivia did have a strong friendship with Jenna, even advising her on how to navigate men and sex.. when it came to Dean.   She also did have a good working relationship with Matt/Jake/Dean at the record company.

Ironically, the last months of her stint with the pregnancy and her scenes with Marley while discussing the pregnancy and possible adoption were pretty good scenes.  Plus, the fact that the real father was Dennis thus her baby would have been Iris's grand daughter and a Cory.

While Hossack opted to leave at the end of her contract, it's a shame that the show didn't think to later recast the character and bring her back to the show with the baby and having to deal with Iris as a pesky presence in her life.  Aunt Liz would have certainly gone up against Iris for sure.

Olivia is one of those characters where the stories weren't up to much but the scenes were interesting, as Hossack knew how to layer with vulnerability. I did appreciate some of her relationships. Your idea about the conflict between Liz and Iris, which would have drawn in all the Corys, and likely Jake, makes sense. It's a shame by that point the show was barely using Iris and Liz even less.

29 minutes ago, Efulton said:

I am a fan of Alison Hossack and enjoyed Olivia when she was given something interesting to do. The issue was not Hossack or David Bailey. The issue was that Donna Swajeski did not have a vision for them. If Harding Lemay has remained as Head Writer I believe both Olivia and Russ would have had a more significant and longer lasting presence.

I think Bailey just wasn't a compelling presence, but I agree that if he had stayed and Lemay had been able to write for him it could have worked out. 

Edited April 23Apr 23 by DRW50

Whenever I think of David Bailey, the only thing that comes to mind is, well, this:

 

Just now, Khan said:

Whenever I think of David Bailey, the only thing that comes to mind is, well, this:

We didn't even get to the part where he starts throwing money at her.

The point remains: the reflexive urge to go back “when things were good” inevitably results in bad recasts and characters that are family in name only, when under the guidance of a new writer. 

Here's my challenge, name a character created by a writer in the last decade of the show, who was introduced as a member of an established family, that was well received?

I'm not talking about recasts, like Anne Heche.

I'm talking about family members in name only.  Those characters who weren't at all informed by their family dynamic.  For example, Dr. Jamie, lil'Maggie-2Dads, macho-Dennis, the-suddenly-Cory cousins, and Olivia.  It is rare for a writer to create a character tied to a core family that sustained or was popular.

But, if anyone can think of three examples, I might change my opinion.

Edited April 24Apr 24 by j swift

6 minutes ago, j swift said:

The point remains: the reflexive urge to go back “when things were good” inevitably results in bad recasts and characters that are family in name only, when under the guidance of a new writer. 

Here's my challenge, name a character created by a writer in the last decade of the show, who was introduced as a member of an established family, that was well received?

I'm not talking about recasts, like Anne Heche.

I'm talking about family members in name only.  Those characters who weren't at all informed by their family dynamic.  For example, Dr. Jamie, lil'Maggie-2Dads, macho-Dennis, the-suddenly-Cory cousins, and Olivia.  It is rare for a writer to create a character tied to a core family that sustained or was popular.

But, if anyone can think of three examples, I might change my opinion.

Frankie Frame

Paulina Cory

Dean Frame

3 hours ago, j swift said:

To reiterate our discussion about the current DAYS writing team, the issue with casting Russ should have been secondary—if Olivia had been a well-crafted character, her lineage wouldn’t have had to carry the weight. The case of Olivia is a clear lesson: simply belonging to a storied family like the Matthews does not guarantee a character’s popularity or resonance. What we needed was depth—perhaps more insight into how her identity as a dancer shaped her personal life. That kind of interiority could have made her genuinely compelling.

Invoking legacy by name alone—be it Matthews, Harrison, or any other—amounts to little more than empty gesture if it isn’t anchored in the present storytelling. A legacy is only meaningful if it meaningfully informs a character’s evolution.

Take Willis, for example—arguably my first favorite character. Would I have appreciated an update on him in 1989? Certainly. But simply reintroducing him wouldn’t have worked in that moment. By then, the show’s tone had shifted, and the qualities that once made Willis dynamic would have needed adjustment to remain palatable to a late-’80s audience. Nostalgia can’t write itself.

It’s easy to lament the way soaps sometimes seem to forget their own history, but honestly, I can’t think of a single instance where a new writer successfully resurrected an old plotline or introduced a character from a legacy family that truly landed with the audience. Soap fans are nothing if not imaginative—we project myriad possibilities onto past characters. So when a new writer delivers a definitive, canonical outcome for a returning figure, it almost inevitably falls short of the expectations we’ve built in our minds.

 

I would say that Susan Stewart's return to ATWT was a success and Anna Holbrook's Sharlene Frame was more popular than Laurie Heineman's. Proving that the past can be remembered and honoured with good writing. But it is definitely rare.

37 minutes ago, j swift said:

I'm talking about family members in name only.  Those characters who weren't at all informed by their family dynamic.  For example, Dr. Jamie, lil'Maggie-2Dads, macho-Dennis, the-suddenly-Cory cousins, and Olivia.  It is rare for a writer to create a character tied to a core family that sustained or was popular.

IIRC, Robyn Griggs actually was well-liked by viewers. She was fired because of offcamera stuff. After that nothing seemed to work with the character.

Edited April 24Apr 24 by DRW50

1 minute ago, DRW50 said:

IIRC, Robyn Griggs actually was well-liked by viewers. She was fired because of offcamera stuff.

I would agree with this. I remember a lot of viewers were perplexed by her firing if they didn't read the gossip columns.

Did a lot of people remember Laurie Heineman by the time Anna Holbrook came on? I've seen some soap articles that claim Holbrook originated the role of Sharlene. While Carmen Duncan was always my Iris, I was aware of McKinsey playing Iris even though I never saw her until recently. 

6 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

IIRC, Robyn Griggs actually was well-liked by viewers. She was fired because of offcamera stuff. After that nothing seemed to work with the character.

I loved Robyn as Maggie.