39 minutes ago, JaneAusten said:

I don't know what to say if the stories about the White House actually knowing about Russian intervention in our election back in August working to get Trump elected, told the GOP house and GOP senate leadership, and was told they would make it a partisan issue if it was disclosed this close to an election. If true how could the President allow himself to be blackmailed in this way.

 

And yet, Little Jimmy Comey, who was probably working under orders from someone within the GOP, was allowed to re-drag Hillary mere days before the election without any push-back whatsoever from the Repubs, or even the MSM and many on the left.  And all over what turned out to be nothing.  Again.

 

I must admit that when I read how Mitch McConnell basically blackmailed Obama into sitting on this information, I lost what little respect I had gained for our outgoing president.  I understand Obama's belief in the so-called "better angels of our nature" and that individuals CAN work toward a consensus if we appeal to their sense of reason.  But there comes a time when, as a leader, you have to set aside the Arthurian ideals and just do the damn thing, and to hell with the consequences.  McConnell (and others) want to accuse President P-Funk of partisanship?  Whatevs, man.  We'll deal with that AFTER we let America know what the frak Putin is up to.

 

Frankly, Mr. President, if you haven't learned by now that the GOP will resist anything you even THINK about doing or saying -- even if it means putting the safety of this country in jeopardy -- because it's you who is doing the doing or the saying, then I don't know what to tell you.  Except maybe, just maybe, I was right all along and you weren't cut out for this job.

 

And yes, we have officially made ourselves Putin's bitch.  But you know something?  Sometimes we get what we deserve.

^^@Khan. I have the utmost respect for President Obama but if this indeed did happen I have lost a ton. My biggest issue with Obama has been his perpensity for playing to the better natures of people. And that lot in Washington has none. If anything I doubt Clinton would have played as nice and ethically as Obama had, had she been elected.

 

I just realize I think how really vulnerable our democracy is to corruption and to survive you have to have people serving who give a damn. For the most part we don't. Heck I think George Bush a colassal failure but I don't even think he would have sold us out this way. I'm so disillusioned with our leadership including Obama.

24 minutes ago, JaneAusten said:

My biggest issue with Obama has been his perpensity for playing to the better natures of people. And that lot in Washington has none.

 

The thing is, I THOUGHT Obama had learned that.  I THOUGHT that was why he had issued all those executive orders that Trump keeps threatening to rip up and throw away as soon as he is inaugurated -- because he (Obama) had realized the other side would never compromise with (yeah, I'm gonna say it) an HNIC.  

 

Of course, leave it to Obama to exercise his power against unreasonable people by doing something that could be undone the minute he leaves office.  The schmuck.

 

Just shows to go you how ineffectual and inconsequential I always thought he'd be in the end.  If we're all concerned that Trump could wipe out Obama's legacy with a few strokes of his pen, then maybe Obama's legacy wasn't that strong to begin with.

Edited December 12, 20169 yr by Khan

Just now, Khan said:

 

Just shows to go you how ineffectual and inconsequential I always thought he'd be in the end.  If we're all concerned that Trump could wipe out Obama's legacy with a few strokes of his pen, then maybe Obama's legacy wasn't that strong to begin with.

 

Well that's one of the issues which got focus in recent weeks - that thanks to Congress stonewalling him, so much of what he planned really was just via executive order. That's one of the reasons he likely fought so hard for Hillary to win. 

 

I have to admit I'm not sure if Obama saying anything about this (instead of just letting underlings say it) would have made a difference. If anything it may have hurt her even more.

Meh, the same complaints and frustrations slung at Obama are the same that were slung at Jimmy Carter. Only years later, after the Reagan years did people find out that Carter accomplished much more than he was accredited with accomplishing. 

Decades from now, Obama might be 90 and have a legacy of helping others that rivals Carter and what will be said of George W. and Trump years from now? 

 

No one, not least Obama has been willing to concede how virulently racist America is and how a Black man even at the highest levels would be restricted to a Congress that had many members who were resentful of his very existence.

 

Given that, I don't know whether Obama saying anything would have done much when from day 1 he's had members of goverment yell "You Lie" in the middle of a SOTU address and be complimented on it. 

 

I'm convinced that a good deal of the American public would rather believe a lie than the truth. When Hillary mentioned DJT's collusion with Russian intelligence, it was summarily dismissed anyway. Didn't anyone pay attention?

Khan, one day you and I are going to throw down about Obama the way Vee and I used to fight about Evangeline Williamson.

 

I have to ask, and this may sound like a harsh indictment to some but why didn't Black women believe the lies as others did?

 

Kind of a rhetorical question but one that I think is important to ask, if anyone cares to know what Black women think and society has by and large shown us that they don't.

 

ETA.

The woman from WV who called FLOTUS "an ape in heels" and was 'fired' apparently now has her job back.

Call me cynical but I can't even fake being surprised at this.

Edited December 12, 20169 yr by DramatistDreamer

3 hours ago, Khan said:

Just shows to go you how ineffectual and inconsequential I always thought he'd be in the end.  If we're all concerned that Trump could wipe out Obama's legacy with a few strokes of his pen, then maybe Obama's legacy wasn't that strong to begin with.

 

Well that is the myth of the presidency, without Senate or Congress you can't get much done that will be effective in the long-term. The Republicans really worked to make sure he could and would accomplish nothing, and they succeeded. I remember in 2015 feeling as if he had accomplished so much to bring the nation forward: same sex marriage, universal healthcare, economic progress, bank regulation, death of Bin Laden, Climate regulations, etc. But all of that looks to be undone. The Republicans want to bring the entire nation back to the dark ages, and it's only going to get worse. 2020 can't come fast enough. But I fear what the disgruntled white population will do when Trump fails. I feel like race relations will just get worse.

 

 

Edited December 12, 20169 yr by Skin

23 minutes ago, Skin said:

 

Well that is the myth of the presidency, without Senate or Congress you can't get much done that will be effective in the long-term. The Republicans really worked to make sure he could and would accomplish nothing, and they succeeded. I remember in 2015 feeling as if he had accomplished so much to bring the nation forward: same sex marriage, universal healthcare, economic progress, bank regulation, death of Bin Laden, Climate regulations, etc. But all of that looks to be undone. The Republicans want to bring the entire nation back to the dark ages, and it's only going to get worse. 2020 can't come fast enough. But I fear what the disgruntled white population will do when Trump fails. I feel like race relations will just get worse.

 

 

 

Will they even acknowledge that he's a failure?  Or will they watch or consume any news that doesn't kowtow to how "great" he is making America again?  That's equally scary.  

 

I see what you're saying though.  President Obama legitimately tried to do things for the betterment of this nation.  Congress went against him simply because there was a "D" after his name and I truly believe to a larger extent, the color of his skin.  It's sickening.  In the end, he is still consequential.

 

4 hours ago, marceline said:

Khan, one day you and I are going to throw down about Obama the way Vee and I used to fight about Evangeline Williamson.

 

 

And I will lose.

4 hours ago, DramatistDreamer said:

I have to ask, and this may sound like a harsh indictment to some but why didn't Black women believe the lies as others did?

 

IMO, Black women, in general, know b.s. when they smell it.  Regardless of the rhetoric.

Edited December 12, 20169 yr by Khan

5 minutes ago, Khan said:

 

And I will lose.

 

IMO, Black women, in general, know b.s. when they smell it.  Regardless of the rhetoric employed to sell it.

 

Also, most Black women, by and large are not intimidated by a strong women and the perceived lack of popularity of a qualified women who can do the work doesn't mean sh*t to us since we've been villified since the beginning to time.

JMO, speaking as a Black women 

3 hours ago, DramatistDreamer said:

I have to ask, and this may sound like a harsh indictment to some but why didn't Black women believe the lies as others did?

 

 

I think a better question is: why would they?

Look at the votes.

 

Black Women have been trying to save America from itself for years.

11 minutes ago, DramatistDreamer said:

 

Also, most Black women, by and large are not intimidated by a strong women and the perceived lack of popularity of a qualified women who can do the work doesn't mean sh*t to us since we've been villified since the beginning to time.

JMO, speaking as a Black women 

Trump also didn't have a single thing to offer black women. He offered non white males the continued power of the patriarchy and white women continued white privilege. Really it was more like the illusion of those things, but people fell for it.  I still can't believe so many white women voted for this man, but it does tell you the state of feminism in this country. It's pretty damn sad. I guess some people don't mind that they are completely disrespected as long as they can believe they aren't at the bottom of the totem pole.

4 hours ago, marceline said:

Khan, one day you and I are going to throw down about Obama the way Vee and I used to fight about Evangeline Williamson.

 

 

Leave me out of this!