Soaplovers

Problem with using pop music in the 80s and thereafter is that there are so many loopholes to jump through with the royalities for the songs and also royalities to the performers that have to be paid.

I couldn't get into the show when a character like Teresa is rewarded for her stalker behavior by getting the guy that she was obsessed with and manipulated to get numerous times.

@Mona Kane Croft Thank you for that compliment.. it's probably due to the fact that I originally went to college to study to be a therapist so that's why I seem to have somewhat of a handle on psychological drama. @Khan To your point, I actually think how Iris was written in the late 80s/early 90s was pretty good.. though the last few months of 1994 derailed a lot of what made Iris tick (i.e. more plot driven then character driven). The only silver lining of Mac's death was how it changed Rachel and Iris.. and how they interacted with one another. Iris and Mac were on the outs due to the takeover attempt when he passed away so she had immense guilt over never resolving her issues with him. This drastically affected her as a person for the next 5 years or so of her stint on the show. Iris/Rachel became unlikely allies and occasionally even had fun together when they weren't bickering. They were allies when Paulina came into the picture, when Carl had his 1991 reign of terror, and lastly when Jake was trying to take over Cory Publishing. Iris even admitted after Mac's death that she felt concern over Rachel that she didn't understand.. but accepted. However, Iris was still Iris even with the death of Mac. She still was devoted and too wrapped up with him.. but that obsessive devotion was transferred to Cory Publishing. As with all of her relationships/marriages in the 1970s.. her obsession with Macy and Cory Publishing caused the end of her relationship with Hank. She missed their simple wedding because of Cory Publishing business.. and it caused him to break things off. And also, her disapproval over Rachel/Carl was in character... but her shooting at Carl at their wedding ceremony was out of character. Framing Carl for something that would cause Rachel to doubt he changed was more up her alley than shooting Carl. The ending I would have done to Iris's stint on the show would have been a big showdown between Rachel/Iris over the past.. and Iris again lamenting that Cory Publishing was given to Rachel.. that 'daddy' only cared about Rachel over her, etc. And Rachel would have promised not to expose/turn Iris in for what she did if she left Bay City and was out of her life forever. And we could have ended with Iris lamenting how she messed things up again and focused back on her life in NYC living the high life.

That's why I bought Rachel's relationship with Carl because 1993 was a year of incredible change/loss for Rachel. She lost Ada, almost lost Cory Publishing, and then was basically pushed out by Amanda.. so she went to NYC to recharge and had Loretta as a surrogate mom. Loretta didn't have the history with Rachel that Ada did so even if Loretta had reminded her that Carl was bad news.. Rachel wouldn't have listened. Also, the only reason I could think of that Rachel was cool with Ada's close relationships with Nancy/Clarice, plus was accepting of her mom's marriages was because Rachel wasn't abandoned by Ada. She was abandoned by her father so her outlook was different. In a weird way, Rachel and Iris were more alike then either would admit... both had daddy issues, both had abandonment issues, and both didn't always parent their children effectively.

Nice to see history being respected. Cole/Victoria sobbing in one another's arms after finding out they're 'related' was so sad..and the scene when Victoria threw her ring at Victor and blaming him for all that happened was powerful. HT's Victoria always stood up to Victor and was so good at it. For me, the Cole/Nina/Ryan/Victoria quadrangle was effective and ended too soon. Cole/Nina had chemistry, Nina/Ryan had chemistry, Ryan/Victoria had chemistry and Cole/Victoria had chemistry. Plus Nina and Victoria were evenly matched in acting and verbal putdowns. Shame he'll be saddled with sad sack AH as Victoria.

Sharon Gabet should have been Pammy for sure. Rachel having both half sisters in Bay City...close to one and rivals with the other. Pammy would be more like Rachel of old.

I think the City was too focused on the new film style, new setting, and getting Morgan Fairchild instead of focusing on strong plots and good characters. I did think over that first year, the show did smooth out some of the early rough patches.. and started to connect the characters in a found family sort of way. Had Morgan Fairchild opted to renew her contract.. her character would have continued being intergrated into the show. Heck still hire Jane Elliot as Tracy Quartermain because I did like the few Sydney vs Tracy scenes that we got (unless I'm imaging the two interacting with one another). And Jocelyn was a poor subsitute for Ava.

Because Marland had trouble writing certain characters well... and a character like Shannon needed a different writer to really keep her interesting/popping. If you ever saw Susan Bledsoe Horgan, who created the character of Shannon, in interviews or seen pictures of her.. you would understand how pre Marland Shannon came to be. Very similar personalities.

Season 2 proved that the show could have focused on the rich and famous.. and still had strong characters/plots. Claudia's emotional and mental decline that played out throughout season 2 was so well done.. and it climaxed at the start of season 3 as an effective red herring when Little Blake was kidnapped. Krystal vs Alexis was very effective in season 2 with the two correctly sizing one another up and being more subtle in their battle. Their catfight in season 2 was effective because there was motivation behind it (Alexis causing Krystal's miscarriage). Sammy Jo was an effective Have not element... but I do agree that maybe Heather Locklear should have been a recast Lindsay... who would have gone after Steven romantically for revenge because she blamed him for breaking up her parents marriage. And her schemes against Krystal in later seasons would have been effective had she been Lindsay. Season 3 did have potential stories that were more emotionally deep.. but you could see the show veering toward the over the top tropes. You had Adam coming on as the kidnapped son of Alexis/Blake, the introduction of Joseph's daughter Kirby (the have not element), and I do remember one heart felt scene between Krystal and Alexis once it came out that Steven was alive. Sadly.. Steven was miscast, Adam became a creepy rapist, and Kirby was sweet.. but lacked agency.

RHOBH: There is not one redeeming quality about Ericka. Why is she allowed back season after season? She offers nothing interesting. Kyle is a professional victim. Dorit's one nice trait are when she's with the kids... so Bravo.. film her more at home to provide layers to her. Sutton is a control freak.. and I get why she's a control freak. Being married to someone that made all that decisions left her in a very fragile place after the divorce... but she's become just as bad as her ex-husband in terms of the controlling tendencies. Garcelle I think might turn against Sutton... why else go to Ericka to talk about Sutton. Crystal was the reason for the Vegas trip.. but she was non-descript. Why wasn't she made a friend of? Her brother was more interesting than her...imho. @Cat Bethenny has been delusional for a long long time.. and I don't think she's ready to admit that she's stumbled anytime she's tried to do something outside of the Housewife world. The delusion for that one started back in season 7 when she was bemoaning being 'homeless' even though she was living in a hotel. My late mom watched it and said 'wow.. Bethenny has lost touch with the real world if she says something like that'.

Iris always had a fear of abandonment.. and I do seriously think that Mac and her had an emotional incest type of relationship. It stands to reason that the woman Iris thought was her mom probably was resentful toward Mac and to a lesser extent Iris so she withdrew any sort of attention/affection. I'm guessing she was also a jet setter as well. If I recall.. when she was first introduced to the show.. wasn't she a jetsetter and wasn't a present parent to Dennis?

Watching episode 780 on Youtube, I was pleasantly surprised to see Delia's fantasy scene showed me that IK could have easily played a more upper east side Delia... and have been at ease as hostess/part owner of the Crystal Place. Also, seeing Kathleen Tolan playing the meek secetary was the best acting she had done up to that point... maybe she would have been better playing a different role than the strong willed Mary Ryan. Shame IK felt off playing that aspect of Delia when she came back to the role in 1982.

Season 2 was the last time that Krystle had layers that made her more than just the 'good one'. The way she went after Alexis in the gatehouse during the catfight and the way she felt guilt over being the other woman while Claudia was in the mental hospital showed that her character still had layers. Starting in season 3, Krystle became a stepford wife... losing all the layers/strength she had in the first 2 seasons. In fact, right before Claudia's death in season 6... Claudia rightly called out Krystle's passiveness remarking how that was more dangerous than the people doing horrible things.

Timeslot is key to a soap. EON, Dark Shadows, and to a lesser extent Somerset benefited from the 3 or 3:30 timeslot since the demo targets were home from school, etc. Had affiliates not had so much power, Loving/The City should have been a late afternoon soap

For me, TPTB created the Loving murders in order to do away with Loving and be reborn as The City... but I was more interested in seeing a post serial killer Corinth and how everyone would deal with the aftermaths of this serial killer. And if I recall, Corinth's main economic hub was the university so I imagine with the serial killer at large, people were opting to drop out of the school and opt not to go back for future semesters. And if enrollment drops, that affects the # of employees working at the University and affects all of the businesses that depend on students for business, etc. To me.. trying to rebuild/reinvent Corinth after the deaths of most of the Aldens would have been fascinating to see.

GL: I actually liked the Nursery Rhyme stalker story

I always thought deep down Gwyn was framing Trisha out of her anger/revenge for refusing to come back and her mental state caused her to believe it was Trisha during the killings and not herself. And I wonder if Trisha popping up right after Jeremy's death threw Gwyneth for a loop and she decided to hide her daughter in an attempt to protect her.

Marie came on in either late spring (like May) or during the summer pre-Marland. She was the reason why Frannie/Kevin broke up.. and Frannie partly ended up coming back to Oakdale in the spring of 1985. The only thing that Marland really did was connect Marie/Kevin/Frannie to the Doug Cummings story.. and also use Iva as a red herring because of the Tad situation.

Of the 1981 experiments, I liked the Judith Barcroft soap opera character arc the best.. at least from the little of it I saw. It managed to include Seneca, Delia, and Roger into it... and I do think maybe Jill could have been incorporated into it based on the law aspect and her past ties to the other core characters. Jill/Jack would have been lots of head butting and arguing.. which would have been a real acting workout for both Levin and Addison Altman.. and given them something to do until Leigh Kirkland and Frank came onto the scene in early 1983. And I haven't seen much of 1982, but I just can't imagine Ilene Kristen playing Delia co-owning the Crystal Palace nor trying to fight with Hollis for air rights to the property. Randall Edwards had a ditzy aura to her Delia.. but she was more crafty and seemed more assured as Delia then Illene was ever playing Delia. I

I always thought the time that Roger/Holly slept together in mid 1993 after the cliffhouse story was the start of the end in terms of good storytelling for the two of them. I think Megan McTavish had said when she took over that she didn't understand why they were a couple again especially after the way he had raped her, kidnapped her, and dragged her through Santa Domingo. So I understood her reasoning as to why they split them up as a couple... but the execution was wrong. It would have been better if Holly saw Roger yelling at someone.. and it triggered her memories of what happened between them in 1979/1980. She then realized she still had a lot to deal with and pulled away from him... which made him feel the impulse to keep pursuing her. Eventually they could have come to a place where they couldn't be a couple.. that the past really couldn't be forgotten and then the two co-existed in Springfield in separate stories/couplings.. but would come together if Blake had a crisis, etc.

I think Iva kept her drive and quirky/youthful fashion look until the pitchfork scene where she revealed to Lily that Rod/Josh was her dad and that she was raped. After that happened, it seemed as though Lisa B and Marland both became intent on making Iva this sad put upon victim. I also wonder if perhaps when Ellie was introduced in 1988 that Marland decided to difuse Iva's early personality and put that into the Ellie character.

When Jenson first debuted in 1991, I found that she had a better handle on playing Marley then in playing Vicky. Most likely because Jenson had played Sarah on OLTL... and her character on there was more like Marley. I think it was also because Marley had more stuff going on when she first took over. She was dealing with the after effects of the rape, the trial, and trying to grow her relationship with Jamie... plus trying to be able to conceive. There was more to play then what Vicky had going on at the time (which was her growing relationship with Ryan.. that was more on the backburner). And Marley's emotional issues started coming up again after she was taking a new fertility treatment where she assumed Paulina/Jamie were carrying on.. and then after finding out Paulina was the one to shoot Jake.. she was furious. All of that got dropped/resolved quickly and once she started dating Dennis in mid to late 1992.. her character lost purpose and focus. On the other hand, by mid to late 1992, Vicky's next long term story really started... which was her entanglement with Grant... and then she became the character with more going on then Marley. To me, how I would rank the actresses playing both twins: Marley: Ellen 1st, Anne 2nd, and Jenson 3rd (after mid 1992, her Marley had no story). Vicky: Anne 1st, Ellen 2nd, and Jenson 3rd (her Vicky in 1991 started off unlikable/mean... then became entitled.).

It sounds like Beacon Hill jumped too quickly into the serialized waters before audiences had a chance to care about the characters.... and introducing 19 characters in a pilot episode would be too much to keep track of right off the bat. Also, wasn't Upstairs Downstairs still running on PBS back then? Why make an American version when you could watch the original version on television.

RHOSLC Monica is trash. She has nothing to offer except showing that she's thirsty and has no place in the housewife world. Dubai: It appears as though Brooks and Stansbury are on the outs as well. @Catthe fact that Ayalan has blind loyalty to Ubah tells me that maybe she needs more therapy. Family should not trump common sense or morals.

What I didn't understand was why didn't the show revist Jack/Jill during the time when Frank was off the canvas between fall 1981 to early 1983. Jill barely did anything during the time Frank was off the show. My mom was a hug Jill fan.. how she was a lawyer, independent, etc... so when I watched the reruns.. I said 'how can you admire a character that settled for being the other woman, and waiting for Frank to get his ass in gear'. My mom said 'well I just loved the actress.'. At least Faith was given different stories during the times when Pat was off screen.