ALL: Returns That Fizzled

[Vee]

I usually do too, haha. Just ask the GH threads. But I am simply not well-versed enough in the period to wax as rhapsodic. I'll have to check around if anyone has a vault.

[carolineg]

Yes, lol.  John/Marlena fans bought sheets so J/M could have more love scenes-and they used said sheets for Steve/Kayla.  It's hilarious that a fanbase bought sheets, but also that Days was so cash strapped they used them for a different couple! 

I don't agree with the show writing John/Marlena out.  They had just reunited haphazardly slapped together at the end after months of RoboJohn-and he ended up paralyzed.  It was clear Higley just wasn't a fan of the couple and Marlena specifically.  Sacred couple or not, it alienated a large (for Days) fan base.

I don't really mind the Kayla/Steve write out.  They weren't doing much.  I think it's silly to write out two main couples.  The show was suddenly losing some foundation and adding characters that to me weren't relevant.

I will never like Carly or Chappell so the entire return was unnecessary and just a blip on the Days radar for me.  Ditching two main couples and breaking up the third main couple was never going to work and the timing of CC's hiring was right around the time Deidre and Drake were fired, so I always correlate it together.  Which may or may not be fair.

Some elements of that era worked, but most didn't which is why Days rebooted a few years later and went back to their main baseline.  I can't say if creatively that was right or wrong but Days is still going, so probably?

[Vee]

I have said it before but John and Marlena's exit story was so hasty, slapped together and demeaning. The firing should never have had happened, nor should the story.

I think bringing back Carly and CC could've worked. Dena Higley was never the writer for it. Steve and Kayla have come and gone many times so I understood it but I am glad they're there today.

[carolineg]

The John/Marlena exit story was ridiculous.  I can't believe that's how they wrote out their main supercouple.  I would obviously keep both of them, but if cash was that strapped I would have written out John before Marlena.  John could have been sent to rehab for the time being and Marlena could make frequent visits.  It was always so odd that with all the Sami happenings during this era that Marlena wasn't around at all.

CC/Carly probably could have worked with the proper writing with an earlier return.  She was never mentioned and not important when she came back.  It was far too late to make Carly important again, although I would argue they could have brought her back when Lisa Rinna left instead of recasting Billie.  I think CC was too busy being a juggling clown on OLTL or something though.

[dc11786]

I think there were hard decisions to be made in late 2008/early 2009 especially since the show was on the verge of being cancelled. This was the time of the infamous "Days won't be around in 2010" line from Jeff Zuker or some other NBC honcho. I don't think there was any way to feasibly go forward with all those vets leading story. I am always curious if the show could had kept John and Marlena around in a more supporting role in this period (limited guarantees or recurring) if the audience would have accepted it. I've always felt them being gone for a bit made people more accepting of the more supporting role in those mid-2010 years.

The super couple fans were definitely treated badly. The comments about just seeing their favorites at fan events and then writing those books with the gone characters. It wasn't respectful. Steve and Kayla's non-exit as well. I don't love the way it went down, but it also didn't have the impact people thought it would. The numbers actually went up in this period (2009) without the fired vets and mostly carried through by the baby swap storyline. It definitely seemed that a strong story with an emotional climax could maintain the viewers even without some fan favorites. That's not to say that John and Marlena couldn't have carried one of those stories, but the guarantees in that era were tight. Peter Reckell's PR person loved to go to SOD every time Reckell's guarantees were up and he was sidelined for a few weeks. 

The ratings may not have gone up substanitally, but enough that they staved off the original cancellation. I definitely feel this was a love it or hate it period and was part of a very tumultous couple years with highs and lows (you and I would probably disagree about which was which and probably already have lol). The 2011 reset of course was then undone by the 2012-2013 reset which was undone by the 2015 reset and so on and so on. I think Ron Carvilati's work did manage to save the show from yet another cancellation precipice and I would say that he used John and Marlena pretty significantly. I am not sure it was the only way to survive, but it did.

Do you feel the same about Vivian's 2009 return?

[carolineg]

All your points are valid and I do know the numbers did go up, which did surprise me.  Like I posted I think you could have taken John off the canvas and had Marlena visit him frequently to free up guarantees and it wouldn't feel as awkward as them both leaving and not involved at all in Salem going ons.

I thought Ron did a good job of using John/Marlena and Marlena specifically.  It was clear he loved the Marlena character.  While I disliked a lot of their Ron stories I thought the shoot the bride story was excellent and one of the best J&M arcs in years.

Vivian works to me as a character that pops in and out.  I didn't love her 2009 return, but I also don't think she's fit to stay on the canvas for long periods.  She got very tired near the end of her 90's run.

[bongobong]

Unpopular opinion (at least for non-Xennials) but Peter Reckell's 1995 return as Bo on Days sucked all the air out of the Bo/Billie/Hope triangle. It was the only triangle on the show at that point with competing rooting interests, but that went out the window with the recast. I now know the BTS reasons, but I never cared about Bo or Hope after that. Of course, that also led to RKK's awful stint on AW mentioned already.

Speaking of 1995, I think Darnell Williams' Jacob on Loving/The City qualifies. Even if the show(s) insisted on Williams not being Jesse, they should of waited until The City premiered to introduce him - if promoted properly that could have been a draw for AMC viewers to check out the show. Particularly those who sampled Loving a number of times over the years but never took to it. In hindsight, Angie & Frankie should have guested on AMC for a few weeks before City premiered then travelled to NYC after seeing Jacob/Jesse on the news or something along those lines.

That said, at least Williams gave effort and a good performance as always, unlike Morgan Fairchild as the awful Sydney Chase. What a horrible, ill-conceived character. It's been 30 years and I still wonder what they were thinking. The publicity for the show emphasized that they were going for a youthful/90s/multi-racial vibe....but they decided to make of it the most generically 1980s style diva imaginable the face of the show?

[asafi]

Still bugs me that Marlena didn’t come back for Alice’s memorial. Even one episode would’ve made sense - her absence made the whole tribute feel incomplete.

[carolineg]

I don't think that's unpopular.  It did suck the air out of the Bo/Billie/Hope triangle. LR/RKK had great chemistry.  PR/LR didn't have nearly as much.   Once Kristian returned it was obvious how it was going to play and Rinna left not long after.  It didn't help that JER didn't seem to care much for Bo/Hope and saddled them with some bad stories.  

I don't think her absence made the whole tribute feel incomplete.  It was glaring though, especially when characters like Carrie came back, who objectively wasn't terribly close to Alice.  I wonder if the show even asked Deidre or if Deidre declined.

[Vee]

I was pissed when Peter Reckell came back as a kid lmao. RKK was the hottest thing on two legs at the time, and fiercely intelligent onscreen too. Suddenly I tune in one day and I'm like 'who is this hick?' I had no idea who he was.

I grew to like him of course, but it was a shock!

Edited September 21 by Vee

[carolineg]

I preferred RKK's Bo too for most of the 90's.  I loved Bo/Billie in the beginning and was so mad Hope came back.  To be fair, I still don't care for Hope but I like Peter so much as Bo now.  It's hard for me to imagine RKK playing most of the Bo stories Peter got from the 2000's on.

[bongobong]

That's very insightful. Beyond his looks, he did stick out as the only man with a brain in a town full of himbos.

Yeah, seemed obvious that JER lost interest once PR was foisted on him. IMO, when most of the shows started copying Days in the mid-90s, they misread what its appeal was to younger viewers. They started doing over-the-top stunts & stories, when the real appeal was its consistent, erotically-charged Gothic vibe. JER gravitated towards sultry actors like RKK, Lisa Rinna, Mark Valley, Jason Brooks & Lauren Koslow who could facilitate those stories.

[carolineg]

It's pretty clear JER preferred couples he created like Bo/Billie and was forced to go with Bo/Hope once both actors returned.  They were relegated to more B stories while John/Marlena/Kristen and Sami/Carrie/Austin/Lucas were featured more heavily.

Even though he didn't create John/Marlena he did create romantic John/Marlena where it wasn't a love based on Marlena thinking he was Roman.  I don't think JER ever knew what to do with Hope/Bo or 'got' their appeal.  They never really fit on his ideal canvas.  The miscasting of Krista Allen as Billie didn't help either.

[Soaplovers]

Continuing on the Days momentum, as much as it pains me to say.. but another failed return was:

Jennifer in 2000 as played by Melissa Reeves.   After the way she quit suddenly in late 1995 at the height of the Jack/Peter/Jennifer story... there was excitement for a return by Jennifer.    Sadly, it was without Jack so the show had to find her another actor/love interest (I think his name was Colin).. and it didn't work so Matt Ashford was lured back in order to reunite Jack/Jennifer before writing them off again in 2005.

For whatever reason, JER seemed inspired to write for Jennifer when Melissa Reeves was playing her in the 90s.  She had chemistry with the actor playing Peter (On and Off screen as we came to find out) and even had good chemistry with Mark Valley as a recast Jack.... so I don't know who the writers were in the first half of the 2000s, but they seemed unsure of how to write Jennifer during that period.

And after her brief return during Alice Horton's memorial where she had a great scene with Vivian over what Lawrence did to her.. she was bought back full time and it started off promising until she was subjected to Daniel and lost her spunk/drive.   

A character like Jennifer is now best seen in small doses because she can come in, have scenes with her relatives, react with her feisty temper at something she doesn't like, and then will say her good byes and leave.... and Cady was not a good Jennifer and I'll die on that hill.

[kalbir]

All the BTS drama at Reilly Days yet the ratings weren't impacted. We know Reilly Days shot up to 2nd in summer 1995 and came within 0.3 of Y&R in summer 1997.