Bill Cosby

[katie_9918]

Wow, this thread has gone off the rails.

[cassadine1991]

What would you expect to happen. What Cosby did is depraved

[Khan]

"Depraved" is almost too mild of a word to put on it. I'm just sorry this scandal has effectively tarnished all the strides he has made over the years in regards to education and humanitarianism. But, as Fleetwood Mac once said, heroes are hard to find.

[Vee]

It will take a decade or more to begin to recover what is left of his good works. And that's very sad, because when I was a kid he was everyone's dad, black, white, you name it.

I'm not sad for him, because Bill Cosby is a serial rapist. I'm sad for that legacy of work - what little of it can be separated from the rapist. And I don't know how much that is. Maybe we'll never know.

[All My Shadows]

At this point, I figure you just move on. If his legacy is strong, it'll stand on its own, and there will be no need to say that "Bill Cosby started this" or "Bill Cosby created this." That might be hard, thought, because Cosby was the original Tyler Perry when it comes to plastering his name on every-[!@#$%^&*]-thing he created.

[Khan]

For the most part, Vee, I agree with you. I, too, don't feel sad for Cos, because, well, how CAN you feel sad for someone who drugged and raped multiple women? Does the man have psychological demons? Most def. And if he hasn't sought professional help before now, then he should. But that is as far as my empathy will extend.

Where we might disagree, though, is whether his legacy as a comedian -- the TV shows, the films and comedy albums, etc. -- will ever be reclaimed from this mess. The more I think about it, the more I think it will -- but not during his lifetime. In fact, it might not even occur during OUR lifetime. I think our present generation will have to die out first. Then, in another generation or two down the road, people might re-discover his work in one form or another, and they will be able to appreciate it as you and I and so many others did once upon a time. The scandals won't be forgotten, but enough time will have passed that it will be a side- or foot-note, perhaps, and not the beginning and end of the story.

At least, I hope so.

[SFK]

Bill's become another Rev. James Cleveland in my book. I'm perfectly capable of separating the man from the music so to speak, and while I'm content with that, at times I do judge myself for not having a strong aversion to everything associated with these men. I'd be lying if I said that I'll never seek out The Cosby Show and Fat Albert dvds, just as I'll go on listening to Peace Be Still and Jesus Is The Best Thing That Ever Happened To Me. Perhaps it's a character flaw of mine, but I find it easy to compartmentalize people.

[Khan]

Again, I hope so. When I say these tragedies have tarnished Cos's legacy, I mean to say they have tarnished it for our generation (meaning, the children of the '70's, '80's, and early '90's, the ones who, as Vee so eloquently said above, looked to him as everyone's dad). Never again will we look at him OR his body of work without at the very least a side-eye. But, who knows, maybe future generations will feel differently. As I said before, though, it'll take time and distance from the rapes before that occurs. And even then, you know, there is still no guarantee "The Cosby Show" -- the so-called "crown jewel" of his legacy, the single biggest advancement in the cause of better depictions of African-Americans and traditional family values on network primetime TV, and a ratings and syndication juggernaut in its day -- won't end up buried next to "Beulah" and "Amos 'n' Andy" in the Black TV Series Graveyard (something, by the way, I never would have thought possible).

But I'll say this much: because his involvement was more limited than it had been with his other shows, I have a feeling "A Different World" might be the one enterprise of his that will come through this relatively unscathed -- which is really ironic when you think about where it stood in the Cosby empire BEFORE these events unfolded.

[Vee]

It's particularly painful to consider watching reruns of Cosby or A Different World, knowing at least some of those women were victimized by him - possibly even some of the stars we've mentioned.

I feel particularly bad for ADW, which is still modern and ahead of its time in many ways.

I think its criminal notoriety now, if not its past legend, will see to it that never happens. The question is, what of the good in it will hold up?

Edited July 18, 2015 by Vee

[Khan]

And there is nothing wrong with that, IMO. Just hold onto those DVD's so you can pass them down to your kids, should you ever have any.

But seriously. I wish I COULD emulate you in this instance. The single greatest disappointment of my life -- next to finding out about Cosby, of course -- was learning what a POS Cybill Shepherd was and is IRL. For me, this knowledge ruined my love for "Moonlighting," a series that practically gave me life as a comedy writer, to the extent that I wouldn't go anywhere NEAR the DVD's OR the episodes that others posted all over the 'net. It's just too bitter-tasting for me (and knowing Bruce Willis was no day at the beach himself makes it only worse).

[Vee]

I mean, damn, Khan! Cybill Shepherd can be a diva, but she's just typical Hollywood. I think you might be able to save Moonlighting just a little bit more easily than The Cosby Show.

[All My Shadows]

See, and the thing about that is because the one Cosby work that I truly stan hard for (The Bill Cosby Show) came way before his image as America's Dad, I find it easy to compartmentalize as well. Every time I go to the bookstore, I'm tempted to pick up the DVD set because it was such a great low-key comedy for its time, sorta this mix of Julia and Room 222, and I love that, but now it's just...ugh. It pisses me off that a person could do so much good while being so bad.

[Khan]

Random thought, apropo of nothing:

To think: Ed. Weinberger and Stan Daniels, who guided such shows as "Mary Tyler Moore" and "Taxi," also had to work for Bill Cosby and Johnny Carson, the two biggest jerks in an industry that also employed Jackie Gleason, Arthur Godfrey and, until a few weeks ago, Donald Trump. Granted, they were never raped and never had to join Joanna on the Rich Bitch Alimony Tour. Nevertheless, the dues they had to pay, making those two yahoos look good to the public.

[Khan]

Good point.

If and/or when future generations will be able to look past the retroactively added innuendos of "Dr. Cliff Huxtable" as a sex fiend, I think they will be able to appreciate, as we all do, the fact that a Black family could be on TV and NOT be living in the projects or trading in putdowns of their Caucasian counterparts or of each other.

[Khan]

Oh, I agree -- totally. I'm just saying, I never could look at "Moonlighting" once people like Glenn Gordon Caron and Alan Ball dished their dirt on the broad. Knowing the stars' personal lives upsets the Irna Phillips in me, I guess, lol.