2 hours ago, Franko said:

Yes, most of the Cape Fear-inspired aspects, specifically Carter menacing Natalie on the boat, happened on All My Children. After he was presumed dead, JWS crossed over to Loving for a few weeks in an attempt to get revenge on Dinah Lee. Jeremy, who had begun to care for Dinah Lee while she was in Pine Valley, had visions of her in danger. Jeremy and Trevor (separately) arrived in Corinth and rescued Dinah Lee from Carter.

Ceara was in London at the time. I'm not sure when Genie Francis' last episode was, but she never came back to AMC, nor appeared on Loving after the initial crossover. (Ceara, played by a stand-in, was killed off on Loving in December 1992.)

Thank you so much, @Franko, for sorting all that out for me.  I was pretty sure that JWS crossed over to LOVING after AMC, but I couldn't remember whether Jeremy and Ceara's crossover happened before, after or during that period.

In retrospect, I wonder whether Jeremy and Ceara's initial crossover was Agnes Nixon's way of testing the waters to see whether one or both could be a part of the LOVING canvas full-time.  Because, IIRC, once Jeremy helped to rescue Dinah Lee, he pretty much sticks around Corinth until Gwyneth bumps his off during the LOVING Murders storyline.

And what is it with Genie Francis and stand-ins?  Not only was there the Ceara stand-in who gets killed (I think) at the airport, but there also was that mop that stood in for her for years at GH.

Edited March 27Mar 27 by Khan

6 minutes ago, Khan said:

In retrospect, I wonder whether Jeremy and Ceara's initial crossover was Agnes Nixon's way of testing the waters to see whether one or both could be a part of the LOVING canvas full-time.  Because, IIRC, once Jeremy helped to rescue Dinah Lee, he pretty much sticks around Corinth until Gwyneth bumps his off during the LOVING Murders storyline.

Yup. Jeremy's listed as a contract arrival for Loving in October 1992. He officially moved to Corinth in mid-November. I wonder if he got a grand farewell on All My Children, or if it was treated like an afterthought.

2 hours ago, alwaysAMC said:

what years did you consider all those to start their downward descent?

It really depends on the soap.  In general, though, I'd say 1991 and 1992 were the last two years when I felt good about these shows and about the genre itself.  (I realize the Linda Gottlieb/Michael Malone regime at OLTL has its' fans, but speaking as one who still remembers watching the show as a two-year-old everyday with his mom, I hated it, and still do to this day).  By the next year, it was down to one show, GL*, and the cracks were starting to show even for them.

(*Two, if you count Y&R, which I still wasn't a fan of 100%, although that would change once I saw how gimmicky AMC and DAYS were becoming).

14 minutes ago, Franko said:

I wonder if he got a grand farewell on All My Children, or if it was treated like an afterthought.

Good question!  By that point, I think, I was starting to dip in and out, because I just didn't like what AMC was becoming already with Megan McTavish as HW.  (Have I mentioned before how much I hated the Natalie/Janet storyline, lol?). And I'm not talking just about stories either.  Even individual scenes were becoming more about characters screaming at each other than anything else.

Edited March 27Mar 27 by Khan

Thanks for that great Loving site link, Franco!

I don't think Jeremy got much of a send off on AMC at all though I'm sure he must have had SOME exit scene that I don't remember (surely he said goodbye to Erica?) 

Some of those cross overs confused me--the whole Carter stuff was heavily advertised (some of the ads are on YT) which is how I found out about it, but, for example, when Angie was brought on AMC, I still think they should have acknowledged it on AMC (maybe brought her on to AMC first for a bit) because I feel like a lot of AMC fans simply didn't know the character had returned even if it was to a different show.

22 minutes ago, EricMontreal22 said:

Thanks for that great Loving site link, Franco!

You're welcome. Hopefully it answers some questions/re-rings some bells.

22 minutes ago, EricMontreal22 said:

I don't think Jeremy got much of a send off on AMC at all though I'm sure he must have had SOME exit scene that I don't remember (surely he said goodbye to Erica?) 

Erica was the first person I thought of when wondering about Jeremy's goodbye. She might have been occupied with the Dimitri and Edmund story, though. For all I know, Jeremy's goodbye might have just been a scene with nu-Natalie and Trevor, or even just Myrtle (since Ceara was her niece).

22 minutes ago, EricMontreal22 said:

Some of those cross overs confused me--the whole Carter stuff was heavily advertised (some of the ads are on YT) which is how I found out about it, but, for example, when Angie was brought on AMC, I still think they should have acknowledged it on AMC (maybe brought her on to AMC first for a bit) because I feel like a lot of AMC fans simply didn't know the character had returned even if it was to a different show.

Say what you will about Tracy Quartermaine joining The City, but they at least gave her a few weeks back on General Hospital to try geeking up some fans.

4 hours ago, Franko said:

Well, sorry for the spoiler, I guess. 😜

Genie wouldn't return to GH until Oct. 29, 1993. (I'm grateful that ABC didn't call her bluff in 1992 and bring back Laura as a recast.)

They did, yes, from November-December 1991. Jeremy & Ceara then married on AMC on Dec. 31, 1991. @Kane's site has the details.

https://lovingsoapopera.wordpress.com/2021/09/03/character-profile-jeremy-hunter/

It's funny that there's all this talk of Ceara's demise, as I actually just wrote the recap for that episode of Loving.

21 hours ago, alwaysAMC said:

Great memory!  So yes, the Christmas miracle and looking up at the angel, man I was right haha.  I can envision that scene perfectly now that you confirmed it and reminded me of the angel.

We must be near the same age (I'm 41).  My grandma and mother both watched AMC religiously, so I grew up with it at home and just fell in love with it.  Even my dad hate-watched it with us every night with dinner.  He never wanted to admit it, and would always talk about how AMC was on the TV, but then ask 'what happened to this character' - he was invested  

But I think when you start watching soaps as a teenager, you find that you'll always hold that era in high regard.  We're so impressionable at that age and it just really sticks to you as you learn things about life and grow up.

I totally agree with this. I'm 42, started watching soaps in '93 (although I have some memories of seeing soaps before that, thanks to my mom watching Days and GH and grandma watching Y&R) and watched pretty religiously through the rest of my teens and the '90s is always what I gravitate to first when I'm looking to pick up a new soap playlist.

8 hours ago, Khan said:

To me, Kate Collins and Natalie were never better than when she was with Jean LeClerc/Jeremy.

I know that it's because Collins and Kiberd had chemistry, but I've always found it kind of strange that after building the Jeremy & Natalie pairing for years, on and off, they finally made it official and then split them up with no question of ever returning to it.

52 minutes ago, Franko said:

Say what you will about Tracy Quartermaine joining The City, but they at least gave her a few weeks back on General Hospital to try geeking up some fans.

Ah, I didn't know that!  I was never a GH watcher so she was new to me when she was on The City (well--I was aware of the character, kinda)  I actually thought it was only when she joined that The City started to find its footing.

9 hours ago, Khan said:

To me, Kate Collins and Natalie were never better than when she was with Jean LeClerc/Jeremy.

You're right. They were great together, loved them, especially in the beginning. I liked Erica in that orbit as well. 

Her affair with Ross was basically a redo of the affair with Jeremy. I just so happen to enjoy it more that's all. Actually, I believe Jeremy was one of the first people that caught them cheating, lol.

Edited March 28Mar 28 by DemetriKane

17 minutes ago, EricMontreal22 said:

Ah, I didn't know that!  I was never a GH watcher so she was new to me when she was on The City (well--I was aware of the character, kinda)  I actually thought it was only when she joined that The City started to find its footing.

I love Jane & Tracy but I disagree about THE CITY. I am one who thought it was a clusterfrack of the first order that they didn't get Morgan Fairchild for a solid contract guaranteed 2 years not just one. i felt we were all cheated. 

And then they made it worse, marrying her off to a mob boss? WHAT?! If i did not know it is true, I would think you were pulling my leg. GMAB  Tracy was better than that.

Did you know? realize? Tomorrow is the Endiversary of THE CITY! Last day 3-28-1997. Tomorrow is the 28th, right? Yes, I see that is.

Wanna have a party?

My god, it's been 28 years. 

 

Hopefully one day we'll be able to know exactly when Ceara's last appearance was. She and Jeremy were at Trevor and Natalie's wedding.

 

Aww and Angelique with Dimitri...  I suspect I am the only one who actually kinda loved Angelique and felt sorry for her (hey I was 12 and new to soaps and I think somehow I related to her lol...)  Around the same time I saw Season Hubley (sp?) on a rerun of the Partridge Family...

 

26 minutes ago, Contessa Donatella said:

I love Jane & Tracy but I disagree about THE CITY. I am one who thought it was a clusterfrack of the first order that they didn't get Morgan Fairchild for a solid contract guaranteed 2 years not just one. i felt we were all cheated. 

And then they made it worse, marrying her off to a mob boss? WHAT?! If i did not know it is true, I would think you were pulling my leg. GMAB  Tracy was better than that.

Did you know? realize? Tomorrow is the Endiversary of THE CITY! Last day 3-28-1997. Tomorrow is the 28th, right? Yes, I see that is.

Wanna have a party?

My god, it's been 28 years. 

 

I will say it was a dumb idea to get Morgan for such a short contract.  Sure it may have worked for Rosemary Prinz when AMC started, but Though I thought the biggest mistake The City made early on was the Masquerader (I think??) serial killer storyline--just because Loving's ratings had improved during their storyline which had JUST finished it felt like.  But I'll save the rest for the Loving folder (I'm game for a party though--funny it both seems far more recent and somehow even longer ago that The City finished.)

Edited March 28Mar 28 by EricMontreal22

13 hours ago, EricMontreal22 said:

I will say it was a dumb idea to get Morgan for such a short contract.

I agree.  I also thought it was dumb not to have Morgan Fairchild appear on LOVING first as a way to help viewers become better acquainted with Sydney Chase.

17 hours ago, Khan said:

It really depends on the soap.  In general, though, I'd say 1991 and 1992 were the last two years when I felt good about these shows and about the genre itself.  (I realize the Linda Gottlieb/Michael Malone regime at OLTL has its' fans, but speaking as one who still remembers watching the show as a two-year-old everyday with his mom, I hated it, and still do to this day).  By the next year, it was down to one show, GL*, and the cracks were starting to show even for them.

(*Two, if you count Y&R, which I still wasn't a fan of 100%, although that would change once I saw how gimmicky AMC and DAYS were becoming).

Good question!  By that point, I think, I was starting to dip in and out, because I just didn't like what AMC was becoming already with Megan McTavish as HW.  (Have I mentioned before how much I hated the Natalie/Janet storyline, lol?). And I'm not talking just about stories either.  Even individual scenes were becoming more about characters screaming at each other than anything else.

You didn't like the Natalie/Janet storyline?!?  Dang  That's what got me hooked as a kid.  That and Hayley/Brian, with Brian climbing through the window to rescue Hayley from Janet and BANG!  

13 hours ago, EricMontreal22 said:

Aww and Angelique with Dimitri...  I suspect I am the only one who actually kinda loved Angelique and felt sorry for her (hey I was 12 and new to soaps and I think somehow I related to her lol...)  Around the same time I saw Season Hubley (sp?) on a rerun of the Partridge Family...
 

I was just going to comment - Angelique!!  I don't remember liking her that much, but I really enjoyed the storyline generally.  I have this vivid memory of Helga wheeling Angelique through Wildwind.  How mysterious and gothic that was!

25 minutes ago, alwaysAMC said:

You didn't like the Natalie/Janet storyline?!?

Even at 12-13 years old, I thought the premise was absurd - Janet and Natalie were not twins! - and too gimmicky for a show like AMC, which, to me, had always been one of the most grounded soaps on the air.

I also hated the "Who Killed Will Cortlandt?" story, because, as soon as I looked at that picture of all the suspects posing for the cameras in trenchcoats, I knew Janet would be unmasked as the killer.  Dixie would've been the shocker, but Janet was the only one who was truly expendable.  (There was also An-Li, but that would've made no flipping sense, lol.)

Edited March 28Mar 28 by Khan

No offense, but All My children stopped being super grounded with the arrival of the Cortlandt's. Kelly (Kitty's twin), Erica becoming a super model, etc.

After the whole Goldie/Silver story, Stuart being revealed as being hidden in an attic, and Eric Kane faking his death by being a circus clown... the Nat/Janet story wasn't so far fetched.  After all, Natalie had come onto the show in 1985 as being somewhat unbalanced and obsessed with her now step son Jeremy so it makes sense that her sister Janet wouldn't be paying with a full deck of cards.

The only complaint I had about the Nat/Janet story was that the quirky/awkward Janet quickly became obsessed with Trevor and turning into Natalie.. instead of letting the story simmer.

@Khan I assumed Dixie was going to be the killer of Will.. and was disappointed that she wasn't the killer.  Her mental state had been on the decline since the 'death' of Tad with her rash marriage to con artist Craig.. then finding out that he was conning her and sleeping with her newfound friend Gloria... and seeing her brother that she grew up with become unhinged and threatening to assault Hayley would have been the final straw especially if the guilt she felt ignoring the signs from everyone, including from her sister Lainie.