So, AMC's like "Norma Rae"? Huh?

Next thing you know, someone's gonna compare AMC to the guest on "Maury" who gets in the dude's face when the DNA test proves he is the baby's father; and OLTL to the bitch who runs offstage and through the halls crying when the test proves he isn't.

AMC is more like the guy that bangs your wife, gets her pregnant and stays quiet while OLTL pays for the child support.

AMC = "Judge Judy" Plaintiff

OLTL = "Judge Joe Brown" Defendant

(Yeah, I don't know what that means either.)

All fair assessments. The point being: on the grand scheme of things, AMC ain't goin' out with a whimper.

Yes they did and GL was the longest running show on the air, while B&B is the most popular soap in the world.

ATWT, I don't know honestly....

ATWT and GL (and Y&R/B& were huge in the South for yeeeeeeears and had very loyal viewers.

But have DAYS, B&B, and the P&G soaps?

I've always heard OLTL referred to as the "forgotten soap" because no matter the ratings, it never got the attention that many other soaps have gotten.

OLTL remained high in the ratings for a long time--in fact I think 85-88 or so it was higher than AMC (which was still doing well). It was the fact that Rauch's campy rich people hi jinx started getting out of control on OLTL (and I think Peggy O'SHea who managed to ground them, left as writer with her associate Michael Scnessel--sp?--not being able to handle the mix at all) that the ratings tumbled so fast around 89-90. Rauch had the right idea to refocus on class and social stories in 1990, but he handled it clumsily (the rap storyline, etc) even though ABC hired Margaret DePriest as writer to help out (a year or two earlier she had been hired to AMC to help when its show became too large character wise and had too many isolated stories). She didn't really help and Gottlieb/Malone/Griffith were brought in. OLTL then became a comfortably middle rated show, but their stuff, because of the groundbreaking subject matter, did get a ton of press and attention.

That said, even in its 80s heydays, while a lot of soap fans seem to remember things like Tina going over the falls, I do get the feeling that OLTL wasn't taken seriously (fair enough given their style) which may have played into why it was not given the attention of AMC and GH. But part of the whole issue prob goes back to the 70s--the mid 70s OLTL was a very middling soap ratings and audience wise, and while it became big by the late 70s with Karen's story, etc, and critically loved, I think that hurt it early on. AMC was never high rated till the mid late 70s--but it had a very steady upwards climb that never ended--really--till the late 90s, but OLTL started strong and then kinda went to the middle. And I suppose some of that could be blamed on Agnes Nixon the way many OLTL fanatics love to do, although it's been documented how carefully she coached and trained, and hand chose, the brilliant Gordon Russell to follow her. It's not like she just took off.

All fair assessments. The point being: on the grand scheme of things, AMC ain't goin' out with a whimper.

ATWT and GL (and Y&R/B& were huge in the South for yeeeeeeears and had very loyal viewers.

DOn't forget in the early 80s GL often came close to GH ratings wise (under Marland). And ATWT was the highest rated soap up to 1979 from its second year on, that's a huge legacy.

Well there was talk that AMC would move to Stamford, CT where Maury, Jerry, and Steve Wilkos now are. That's about a 45 min. express train ride from Grand Central. Ironically, Canary would have already been in the 'hood.

Y&RWorldTurner, GL and ATWT had their long-running iconography going for them while Y&R had Victor, Katherine, and strong black representation, B&B its Y&R lead-in (and international success), DAYS it's Marlena, Bo&Hope and overall '80s soap splashiness... especially by the '90s, I think OLTL and AW fell into the generic soap opera category to the masses, just one of the many kitschy soap opera titles out there. You had your grandmothers who remembered feisty Rachel, your uncles who had the hots for Tina and Gabrielle, but the utter lack of soap knowledge to non-soap fans cannot be overestimated.

But despite what some on here think, I think it's clear Canary wanted to retise. If it had been close to where he was, he might have made a few more cameos that prob by now would have died off anyway. The fact that the gossip (pretty much the same gossip we're getting now abotu AMC) had been for a full year before the move that Canary wanted to retire and wasn't feeling up to the job, says *something* and I know Vee and others whose opinion I respect feel the move was done by Frons to get rid of him--to which I call bullshit.

Re OLTL I stand by what I said, a lot of casual soap viewers do seem to remember some of the crazy mid 80s storylines on it--like Tina, Nicky coming back, and it had huge numbers, so it was on the radar, but it wasn't stuff critics would love (mostly) and the soap's name simply never became synomynous with soap opera the way AMC, GH, Y&R, ATWT even did.

Laugh all you want but I really wish that AMC had moved to Chicago instead of LA.

Not that many of them would be missed, but would much of AMC's younger cast have moved to Chicago, a city with far less acting opportunities than LA or NYC? I know Chicago has a lot of talk shows, etc, but would they have had the tv drama directors, cameramen, designers, etc, there to work on it? Wouldn't it have cost more to import lots of these people?

I, for one, wish AMC had stayed the hell in NYC and sent JHC packing instead. Because, if saving money was really the answer here, then why not move production to, say, Vancouver? But, you know, that's just me.

I'm biased, living there, but Van at least would have had the actors and studio facilities--more so than Chicago or CT, for a TV drama. But ABC doesn't have a house studio there, do they?

But I agree, I wish they had TRIED getting rid of JHC in the past five years before focusing on the writers, and keeping Frons as de facto EP.

I don't know if Chicago is cheaper. I just hate the effect the LA move had on the show. IMO, moving to Chicago - or even Vancouver if they wanted to go that far west - would've been better for the show aesthetically and easier on the actors who chose to commute. Admittedly, it's a bias of mine but I haven't seen any good come from the move to LA.

A number of people--the majority of fans I'd say on here, did say the show looked a lot better when it moved to LA, but that could have been the move to HD. Otherwise, I sadly do agree with you.

I agree, CT may have meant more cameos or even staying on a bit longer but I can believe that DC was ready to go. Having the show right in your backyard however would have been an ironic twist and would have certainly given him a lot to think about. Moving to CA did that thinking for him.

I think the cast is much happier being in L.A. than they would have been in Vancouver or Chicago! No question. I'm sure the younger ones were thinking, "If this doesn't work out at least I'm in L.A. and can do the film and TV thing blah blah." CT would have been a closer and more urban Peapack type situation. There are union rules about providing transportation back to the major transportation hubs in the city (Another World had cars to drive its Manhattanites back in from Brooklyn). Maybe they'd have to provide train and cab fare and that could get very expensive. In L.A. everyone's got their own wheels.

Edited March 25, 201115 yr by SFK

Here's what I don't think people get yet. What are the characters on AMC really doing. What is thier s/l? No srsly

Erica

JR

David

Jackson

Amanda

Jake

Colby

Asher

Marissa

Caleb

Griffin

Cara

Tad

Jesse

Angie

Franklin

Randi

Scott

Madison

Ryass

GreenBitch

Liza

Binx

dumbass Kendall

What are thier s/ls, they use to have stories to tell, what is thier s/l?

They all have stories--good stories is debatable, but this isn't like under B/E where there were two "stories" going on for their whole stint.

Would it make any sort of sense to have AMC run 6 months of the year and OLTL the other 6 months? Or would that just lose all viewers? Or even split the weeks? They could (in theory) come up with stronger writing, and it would slash the budget, but I guess it's not thinkable. But when I mentioned on the phone to my mom the cancelation rumours, and she doesn't really get how networks think, but that was her suggestion lol. I dunno, it does seem like instead of just trashing the soaps one by one, thinking of cutting the schedules might make more since--most soap viewers now TIVO anyway...

Here's what I don't think people get yet. What are the characters on AMC really doing. What is thier s/l? No srsly

Erica is torn between Caleb and Jack

JR is trying to get his family back and be a new Adam, including going after Marissa

David is trying to redeem his image one citizen at a time and seems to have teamed up with Liza who he's interested in

Jackson was fed up with Erica but now foolishly thinks that she's ready to marry him

Amanda is jealous of Cara but trying to hide it, and is getting more and more insecure

Jake iis fighting feelings for Cara, trying to keep his marriage stable, and annoyed at Tad and Cara

Colby us starting a blog, hates her mom, is heartbroken

Asher is being JRs whipping boy, trying to suss out his dad and after Colby

Marissa is worried about her feelings for JR and becoming close with Binks while becoming a lawyer

Caleb has decided he wants Erica and is getting more agressive, and wants his son away from the Chandlers

Griffin feels guilt over Zach's death, attraction for Kendall, annoynace at his sister's issues and is trying to bring down the casino people

Cara just had to marry Tad to escape a potential death sentence, is fighting feelings for Jake, etc

Tad is havign a midlife crisis, married Cara, doesn' want Krystal to move out, etc

Jesse is worried about his wife, her pregnancy

Angie is blind and about to have a baby

Franklin is ummmmm.... lucky when he appears

Randi is useless

Scott is trying to get his life back on track, befriended Madi cuz Greenlee forced him to but has feelings for her

Madison is pregnant with her exes baby, doesn't want him around, and getting close to Ryan

Ryass still has a hero complex, just got his daughter back, doesn't know Greenlee lied and found out he has a baby on the way

GreenBitch still hasn't revealed she covered up the baby, and is worried about her relationship and Emma hating her

Liza just slept with her dughter's boyfriend and is a disgrace and trying to get out of both, maybe with David's help

Binx is trying to hold on to her children, get a divorce and growing close to Marissa

dumbass Kendall Is getting over Zach, unsure about Griff and Ricky, and always in the hospital.

Again I didn't say they were brilliant stories, but to say there's no story is ridiculous, and indeed there have been more intertwining genuine stories on the show in the past year than in YEARS when this show has been ruled by having ONE story at a time hogging the airwaves.

What are thier s/ls, they use to have stories to tell, what is thier s/l?

Riiiight

Edited March 25, 201115 yr by EricMontreal22

Sounds good on paper, why is it coming off so boring on this screen?

I know you're not snarking me.

Yeah, I was kinda wondering where the hell you were going with that, CD...lol

Sounds good on paper, why is it coming off so boring on this screen?

I know you're not snarking me.

I'm not, but I really do disagree. I'm not gonna pretend the show's on fire by any means--but remember back during B/E when we had the CRASH Greenlee/Ryan/Kendall stuff 24/7 for about 10 months--or even the last year of McTavish? Pratt playe da lot of stories but he rushed through them so much there was little connection. For the first time it does feel like characters have their own stories and agendas--yet they interact with each other and talk about them to the other characters, don't exist in their little world. I know you DESPISE the writing right now--that's fair enough. But I think you're frankly reaching here to say none of them have story.

OMG, the gloves are off. RPG just called out Jamey.

rickygoldin Ricky Paull Goldin

@dcconfidential Jamey Giddens....if making a comment that our Executive Producer's next gig should be to disprove global warming isn't malicious, then I guess I wasn't raised very well and I just don't know the difference. Why don't we keep it professional and use actual facts. I'd be delighted to do an interview with you any time Jamey. You know where to find me.

RPG

I actually think Days will be safe for a very long time. On another site, can't remember which one, they showed the top 10 shows for online streaming and both Days and Y&R had a ton of viewers beating out many primetime hit shows.

I agree. Its not because I am a days fanboy, and realistically i am aware that it could go at anytime. However, I just do not see NBC getting rid of it anytime in the near future. They need it, and as long as they do not take a loss on it they will keep it. NBC has so much work to do in late night, primetime, news, and morning that daytime will just fall aside until all those are good again and then when they focus on daytime, if they do, they will need a established show to try and build an audience. They have some kind of faith in it as they did give it an early pickup with less than steller ratings. As for the poor demos they just got, i could be wrong but i do not think nbc looks at week to week as much as season.

I find the entire concept of "soap opera news and critique" utterly fascinating. The fact that it all boils down to a bunch of fans with titles who are bitchy bloggers or lucky enough to have their own magazines, by the grace of GOD salaried or blissfully entitled and unpaid, the fact that "hard news" goes unreported but dangled over fans' heads instead so "reporters" can delight themselves in "I know something youuuu don't" or pad their nests to prove that they knew all along when the news finally hits but thy were too afraid to tell it because they might lose their moles... I mean, soap opera "NEWS" is tabloid journalism's pimple faced bucktoothed little cousin sippin' on a Big Gulp. Somewhere, somebody bigger and more important should be looking down on soaps and laughing. Hard. But we fans can handle that ourselves.

So true. And i say this as someone who loosely works with a soap website and cover events and such. But i do not think it is anything more than it is. Its fun for me, so i do it when it fits in with my real life job and my college.

I hate the whole "i know something you dont know" thing. Blind items and that are just a way to stroke ones own ego. A few sites pull it off, like TV Line, but only because its done in more fun and they almost always end up following it up with the answer.

I'm not, but I really do disagree. I'm not gonna pretend the show's on fire by any means--but remember back during B/E when we had the CRASH Greenlee/Ryan/Kendall stuff 24/7 for about 10 months--or even the last year of McTavish? Pratt playe da lot of stories but he rushed through them so much there was little connection. For the first time it does feel like characters have their own stories and agendas--yet they interact with each other and talk about them to the other characters, don't exist in their little world. I know you DESPISE the writing right now--that's fair enough. But I think you're frankly reaching here to say none of them have story.

I agree with you.

I enjoy AMC right now, and have for a few months now. I has been far worse.

That said, I do not think it is great, and the demos suck, and i would not be surprised at all if DC is right and the show is getting the ax.

I enjoy AMC right now, and have for a few months now.

I'm sure Cara & Kendall are the main reasons!! ;'-).

I'm sure Cara & Kendall are the main reasons!! ;'-).

Actually, the DVR and being able to act as if those people do not exist is why.

Seriously. UGH! I forget they are a part of the show 90% of the time.

Erica is torn between Caleb and Jack

JR is trying to get his family back and be a new Adam, including going after Marissa

David is trying to redeem his image one citizen at a time and seems to have teamed up with Liza who he's interested in

Jackson was fed up with Erica but now foolishly thinks that she's ready to marry him

Amanda is jealous of Cara but trying to hide it, and is getting more and more insecure

Jake iis fighting feelings for Cara, trying to keep his marriage stable, and annoyed at Tad and Cara

Colby us starting a blog, hates her mom, is heartbroken

Asher is being JRs whipping boy, trying to suss out his dad and after Colby

Marissa is worried about her feelings for JR and becoming close with Binks while becoming a lawyer

Caleb has decided he wants Erica and is getting more agressive, and wants his son away from the Chandlers

Griffin feels guilt over Zach's death, attraction for Kendall, annoynace at his sister's issues and is trying to bring down the casino people

Cara just had to marry Tad to escape a potential death sentence, is fighting feelings for Jake, etc

Tad is havign a midlife crisis, married Cara, doesn' want Krystal to move out, etc

Jesse is worried about his wife, her pregnancy

Angie is blind and about to have a baby

Franklin is ummmmm.... lucky when he appears

Randi is useless

Scott is trying to get his life back on track, befriended Madi cuz Greenlee forced him to but has feelings for her

Madison is pregnant with her exes baby, doesn't want him around, and getting close to Ryan

Ryass still has a hero complex, just got his daughter back, doesn't know Greenlee lied and found out he has a baby on the way

GreenBitch still hasn't revealed she covered up the baby, and is worried about her relationship and Emma hating her

Liza just slept with her dughter's boyfriend and is a disgrace and trying to get out of both, maybe with David's help

Binx is trying to hold on to her children, get a divorce and growing close to Marissa

dumbass Kendall Is getting over Zach, unsure about Griff and Ricky, and always in the hospital.

Again I didn't say they were brilliant stories, but to say there's no story is ridiculous, and indeed there have been more intertwining genuine stories on the show in the past year than in YEARS when this show has been ruled by having ONE story at a time hogging the airwaves.

Leave it you to actually answer that question! Reading that list was watching a court show where the witness goes crazy on the stand. LOL!

My favorite: "Franklin is ummmmm.... lucky when he appears" Sad but true.