Guiding Light discussion thread

[prefab1]

Kobe and Long deservedly get a lot of flack for the cast turnover that happened from 1983-85, but honestly the problem started much earlier, as earlier eras didn't leave them with many beloved older actors/characters who could really serve as tentpoles for the show. I guess they could have brought back people like Barbara Berjer (Barbara Norris), Robert Milli (Adam Thorpe), or Millette Alexander (Sara McIntyre), but none of them had very deep relationships with the characters driving story in the mid-80s. 

[Mitch64]

The problem was when those fans dictate story decisions when they write in en masse to support a certain actor...and when that actor has them on speed dial to whip up a frenzy, as Kimmer was known to do.

However, I think the real problem is that the TPTB gave into the Jevas.the Mattessas ,.the Mannys the Brad Coles. Everyone disses Gautman for saying he didnt care what the fan letters say, we needed more people like that (not that I agreed with any choices he made!)

[Contessa Donatella]

Now, here you go, trying to turn a negative into a positive. When Goutman said that, he was being incredibly arrogant. He even said he KNEW better what the show needed better than any fan ever did. Later he tried to walk that back & say what he meant was the soap press & not the real fans but that was a lie. When he said it, the journalist even gave him a chance to take it back. She literally asked him if he was SURE he wanted to say that & IN THOSE WORDS. (I know this because I was in a group of a few people she talked to immediately after the Q&A. It was totally fresh in her mind. Plus, of course, it was on tape.)

I agree with you that there have been times & people who did know what was needed. It's not my intent to argue with you about Goutman at the end of AW or the end of ATWT. But, without the fans, there's no show. Far be it from me to ever take up for the Mannys or Reva's Army. 

[kalbir]

Robert Calhoun era was June 1989 to July 1991. Those who have seen Soap Opera Digest Best and Worst of 1989 recall that GL was Most Improved show that year, and it was thanks to Robert Calhoun.

[Mitch64]

We could have a whole thread on this topic..However, I think that there is an in between...reading and listening to the audience (which I put in a different category then the fans) and parsing out what they want...(meaning, dumping the crazy Jeva/Manny/Mattessa's input...you know they knew who the same people writing in were.)

I think they really listened to a really dumbed down portion of the audience "I could watch Pharley everyday having cute scenes, dont ever break them up" which made a dumbed down show.

[Contessa Donatella]

Robert Calhoun is one of the daytime people who fascinates me. Worked on AW, Texas, ATWT & GL, great start there! He & his male partner Farley Granger were out before anyone else had yet thought of being out. He made a statement to Maureen Garrett about the rape that flabbergasts me. 

If you've not seen it, you might enjoy this interview. 

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I do so agree. 

Yes, I definitely think that there are people who are audience who should be listened to & there also are people who should NOT!!! 

Personally, and this is a criticism, I think that they started it, dumbing down the shows & then when they got a dumbed down audience for their trouble, just let it become a vicious cycle. 

[BetterForgotten]

Calhoun was the one who suggested Marland for ATWT, and the one who saw something impressive in Nancy Curlee and Stephen Demorest's work to promote them to HW's at GL. 

He was an EP that understood that there was no show without functional and thoughtful stories. 

Edited August 22, 2024 by BetterForgotten

[kalbir]

Totally agree. Calhoun/Marland era As the World Turns was that show's creative peak, and Calhoun/Long/Curlee era was GL's last golden era.

[Mona Kane Croft]

Was Calhoun at ATWT for only two years?  That's an amazingly short amount of time.  What years was he there? 

[BetterForgotten]

He was EP at ATWT for about 4 years from 1984-1988. He then left/took a break and became EP of GL from 1989-1991. 

[P.J.]

Well, at this point, Ross is the only lawyer in town. I did find his comment that Billy tried making him an errand boy at Lewis a little strange, but I haven't watched much of the brainwashing part of the story. Billy and Ross were usually ok with each other. 

Imagine what the Dobsons could've done with Mary Kay Adams. Wasting her on Flock of Seagulls guy---oy vey.

LOL---I enjoyed Sally dishing out hard truth to Reva. FYI in about six weeks, Reva forces Sally and HB to tell to Billy that he is their son. Sally's right, Reva's out for Reva.

[Contessa Donatella]

When I imagine what the Dobsons could have done, it is about Jan. 1993 when they & P&G  had agreed that they would head to Brooklyn & HW Another World. Unfortunately NBC blocked it. They wanted P&G to sell AW to them. Like that was really gonna happen. 

[P.J.]

ATWT in particular was blessed to keep a core of characters for so long, and in some cases (like Susan) welcome them back. You always felt connected because of Bob/Kim/Lisa/Babs/Nancy/John. Sometimes it's just good to be lucky. What might've changed had Chris Bernau and Michael Zaslow lived? The what ifs are endless.

[DRW50]

Others here have watched more than I have, but I do think Long is a better basic writer than any who take over after her in the '80s. I think the show she wrote by 1984 and especially 1985 was already very alien to what GL had once been, but as others have said, that may be down to Gail Kobe, as her writing felt more in tune with GL when she returned. 

There are some positives - Chris Bernau's return, and the Dinah story, which was very important for Vanessa as a character (and likely helped keep JvD on the show in some lean years). 

Charita Bauer also died at only 62. When you think of Helen Wagner, her compatriot, she lived to 91 and was still working until very near the end. That hurt GL a great deal. 

[Mitch64]

It really was the best of Marland during those years. I don't know if it was Calhoun or generally the show being kind of all over the place when Marland got there, but after Calhoun left the worst of Marland showed itself, depressing stories, stilted conversations, overly seriousness ruled the day...(I still can't believe that Lilith and Shannon's scraggily shrunken head made it in to give the show a break from conversations about "honesty in a relationship" and "What will Lily think of this!"

 

Okay, I did spit my coffee out on that! What DID India see in that boring guy (besides it be plot dictated..) things did take a turn when Alan came back but they didn't really put them together that way...an India/Alan/Hope triangle would have been fun.

 

Agreed, that really hurt the show and was the first nail in the coffin...I would choose Bert over Nancy as my go to grandma any day..she really was GL...sweet, funny, kinda corny, self aware, but could get all up in your face when she had it!