11 minutes ago, Tisy-Lish said:

Does anyone remember, in 1982 when David Canary and Linda Borgeson were playing Steve and Alice, there was a recreated flashback of the couple at Steve's house in St Croix?  And rather than shoot on location, they used the studio set and green-screen ocean in the background.  This was a couple of years after the big location shots with Mac, Janice, and Rachel on St Croix.  So although it was fun to see that flashback, it was a little off-putting to see the out-dated special effects, since we had not seen Steve's St Croix house since Mary Matthews died there in 1975.  

Every single thing about David Canary at AW #1 is a blur and #2 IMO was totally ineffective & #3 bored me to tears, so sorry to say that.  I adored him on AMC. 

1 hour ago, Contessa Donatella said:

Every single thing about David Canary at AW #1 is a blur and #2 IMO was totally ineffective & #3 bored me to tears, so sorry to say that.  I adored him on AMC. 

Canary was certainly capable of playing Steve. In fact, I can't imagine a better actor for the role, aside from Reinholt himself.  But he needed a good director to tell him to tone down his personality, to approximate the temperament of the Steve Frame the fans knew. Not to mention, the writing was pretty bad at that time. Frankly, Canary's Steve seemed like an entirely new character. But that was not Canary's fault.   Did those writers know anything about the Frame and Matthews family histories?  If so, it certainly did not show up in the scripts.  And that damaged the possibility that Canary and Borgeson might be successful recasts in those two iconic roles.   It was bad writing and absent/ineffective directing -- not the fault of the actors.

And I personally believe Borgeson was the best of all the Alice recasts.  But that's not saying much, because Jacquie Courtney was pretty-much irreplaceable. Just my opinion.  No interest in debating.  But other opinions are always interesting.   

Edited July 25Jul 25 by Tisy-Lish

1 hour ago, Tisy-Lish said:

And I personally believe Borgeson was the best of all the Alice recasts.  But that's not saying much, because Jacquie Courtney was pretty-much irreplaceable. Just my opinion.  No interest in debating.  But other opinions are always interesting.   

If Courtney was playing Alice this Alice/Steve/Rachel triangle might have worked. A recasted Alice and Steve, along with the bad writing doomed the storyline from the start.

9 minutes ago, watson71 said:

If Courtney was playing Alice this Alice/Steve/Rachel triangle might have worked. A recasted Alice and Steve, along with the bad writing doomed the storyline from the start.

Agreed.  Courtney (and decent writing) could have saved this mess.  But I think it was time for Rachel to leave Alice and Steve's orbit.  Rachel had matured and found real love with Mac. Why in the world would Rachel ever consider leaving Mac to pursue Steve in 1982?  Alice and Steve could have found other problems to create drama.  At this point, they really didn't need Rachel to make them interesting.  

4 hours ago, Tisy-Lish said:

Canary was certainly capable of playing Steve. In fact, I can't imagine a better actor for the role, aside from Reinholt himself.  But he needed a good director to tell him to tone down his personality, to approximate the temperament of the Steve Frame the fans knew. Not to mention, the writing was pretty bad at that time. Frankly, Canary's Steve seemed like an entirely new character. But that was not Canary's fault.   Did those writers know anything about the Frame and Matthews family histories?  If so, it certainly did not show up in the scripts.  And that damaged the possibility that Canary and Borgeson might be successful recasts in those two iconic roles.   It was bad writing and absent/ineffective directing -- not the fault of the actors.

And I personally believe Borgeson was the best of all the Alice recasts.  But that's not saying much, because Jacquie Courtney was pretty-much irreplaceable. Just my opinion.  No interest in debating.  But other opinions are always interesting.   

I can certainly see what it is that you are getting at. JC to me WAS Alice. To me no recast ever met the mark. In theory of course I believe a recast could have done the job  but ultimately I didn't feel that they were successful.

5 hours ago, Tisy-Lish said:

Why in the world would Rachel ever consider leaving Mac to pursue Steve in 1982? 

1982

What a year that was for AW 😂😂😂

7 hours ago, Tisy-Lish said:

And I personally believe Borgeson was the best of all the Alice recasts.  But that's not saying much, because Jacquie Courtney was pretty-much irreplaceable. Just my opinion.  No interest in debating.  But other opinions are always interesting.   

That's interesting. Was there a replacement actress in the role whom you felt was the most miscast?

Wesley Pfenning being hired baffled me. It was like seeing Grayson McCough as Dusty Donovan, Susan Batten as Connor Walsh, Roger Howarth as Paul Stenbeck and Jason Kinkaid as Tom Hughes on ATWT. I kept thinking, "Huh?!? What were TPTB thinking?"

To me, JC was the one and only Alice. Beverly Penberthy won me over 100% as the replacement Pat (she was excellent) and Barbara Rodell made Lee Randolph her own, but La Courtney could never truly be replaced.

Linda Borgeson's Alice is one of the worst performances I've ever seen.

The other recasts (except Harney, who was passable) were all weird but wow.

2 hours ago, vetsoapfan said:

Wesley Pfenning being hired baffled me. It was like seeing Grayson McCough as Dusty Donovan, Susan Batten as Connor Walsh, Roger Howarth as Paul Stenbeck and Jason Kinkaid as Tom Hughes on ATWT. I kept thinking, "Huh?!? What were TPTB thinking?"

To me, JC was the one and only Alice. Beverly Penberthy won me over 100% as the replacement Pat (she was excellent) and Barbara Rodell made Lee Randolph her own, but La Courtney could never truly be replaced.

Loved Penberthy & I actually liked Grayson in that role but as to the rest I am in total accord with you!!!

Vana T seemed to possess some of the same essence/aura of Courtney's Alice... who had an air of confidence and sarcasm in her line deliveries.   She also seemed to match up well in scenes opposite Rachel while Borgeson seemed almost timid and passive (so unlike Alice..imo).

34 minutes ago, Soaplovers said:

Vana T seemed to possess some of the same essence/aura of Courtney's Alice... who had an air of confidence and sarcasm in her line deliveries.   She also seemed to match up well in scenes opposite Rachel while Borgeson seemed almost timid and passive (so unlike Alice..imo).

I do wonder whether the original plan was always to put Rachel and Canary-Steve together or whether they changed the storyline based on audience response or behind-the-scenes factors. Vana Tribbey's Alice grew close to Mac while he was separated from Rachel in the aftermath of Janice/Mitch/St Croix. Tribbey was on only 6 months, which seems like she was fired and replaced quickly at short notice with Linda Borgeson. And Borgeson stayed for only a year.

Alice during this time period made very little impression on me so I would not have a strong sense of the character and who was better. But it seemed inappropriate to construe Rachel as Steve's True Love and also unhelpful story-wise to squeeze Alice out.

   

PROOF is a drama with a small cast that deals with family, genius & mental illness. A young woman, Katherine, is a mathematical genius & she acts as the caretaker to her father who is also a mathematical genius but is a very famous one because of unprovable proofs that he proved while he was a Professor of these advanced mathematics. At this point he's having a difficult time. There's a young adult male who is Katherine's beau & has been the assistant to the Professor. Both Katherine & the young man had been students of her father's. There are composition books that originally had attempted proofs in them but at some point had devolved to just jibberish on each page. In going through them the young man finds a perfect proof, complete & new & one that was thought to be impossible to solve. He, of course, assumes the Professor found mental clarity enough one day to do this, but Katherine says that she proved it. Of course, she faces serious doubt & has no way to prove her claim.

This play ran on Broadway from Oct. 2000 to Jan. 2003 except for a part of June 2002 when a whole new cast rehearsed & then reopened the first week in July. In the new cast Anne Heche played Katherine, Neil Patrick Harris played the young man & Len Cariou played the Professor. We saw it one day the first week & another day the 4th week. Our seats for this second time were first row, far stage left. At one point in the play Katherine sits on the edge of the porch & at that point we could have reached out & touched her. If anything she was more mesmerizing, alive, electric live than on Another World, which is probably the difference between live & televised.

That same summer we saw Alan Rickman in a revival of Noel Coward's PRIVATE LIVES & after our party went together to Joe Allan's for a late supper & to discuss the play, etc. Immediately after we were seated, Anne's party was seated right next to us. I spent the rest of that night pretending to pay attention to my table while I was really eavesdropping on Anne. At one point I looked over at my partner & winked at her & realized she was doing the same! 

I've been meaning to type this up & post it for ages but I was afraid it would be too long. Hope it wasn't. 

        

Edited July 26Jul 26 by Contessa Donatella

I actually saw her on Broadway in that. There was a talk back on stage after the show. She looked so beautiful. She also seemed to be in a good place. Shame how time just couldn't stand still. 

Edited July 27Jul 27 by Jdee43

40 minutes ago, Jdee43 said:

I actually saw her on Broadway in that. There was a talk back on stage after the show. She looked so beautiful. She also seemed to be a good place. Shame how time just couldn't stand still. 

So we both were really lucky, since I saw her in it on Broadway, too, but, then, sorry, that's obvious. I'm mad at myself though because I was too star struck & suddenly shy to go talk to her after.  This afternoon I listened to her last podcast, right before the wreck & it was just Anne, on an ordinary day, enjoying her & Heather talking to fans. It's hard for me that she's no longer in the same universe. 

On 7/25/2025 at 4:41 PM, Xanthe said:

I do wonder whether the original plan was always to put Rachel and Canary-Steve together or whether they changed the storyline based on audience response or behind-the-scenes factors. Vana Tribbey's Alice grew close to Mac while he was separated from Rachel in the aftermath of Janice/Mitch/St Croix. Tribbey was on only 6 months, which seems like she was fired and replaced quickly at short notice with Linda Borgeson. And Borgeson stayed for only a year.

I do not believe the original plan (in 1981-82) was for Steve to end-up with Rachel. The plan was for Steve and Alice to reunite, but not without plenty of difficulty -- and for Rachel to reunite with her true love, Mac.  But there were three major issues that lead to the Steve/Rachel ending.  #1.) Problems with the Alice recasts caused TPTB to give up on Alice, and just send her out of town.  #2) By 1982, "chemistry" had become the guiding force in writing romance in daytime on all three networks. So when Canary seemed to have a little more chemistry with Wyndham than he had with Borgeson, TPTB pushed Canary and Wyndham together, despite both characters' toxic history. This sort of madness was happening on nearly every soap on every network, with nearly all romance plots -- chemistry, chemistry, chemistry between actors is all that mattered. History be damned!  #3) 1982 was near the time that "good girls" (or ingenues) started to be considered boring, and "bad girls" were considered more interesting and dynamic. At least by the writers, if not the viewers.  So Rachel won Steve's heart in the end (what a pathetic insult to long term fans of AW!!). And later, on nearly every soap opera, whenever they wrote a love triangle, the bad-girl won the guy -- and the good girl either left town, or went crazy and became the "badder girl."  I could give many examples of this over recent decades, but I really don't have the energy.  Most of you will understand.  The ingenue became boring and the bad-girl became the star of the show. (Rachel, Erica, Reva, Vicky Hudson, Carly (GH), Carly (ATWT). In my opinion, that is weak writing and writing to the lowest common denominator.  

By the way, not suggesting either Alice nor Rachel were "girls" in 1982, as both would have been 40-ish, and Steve would have been around 43.   

Edited July 27Jul 27 by Tisy-Lish