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2009: The Directors and Writers Thread


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What I like about historical references in scripts is that it says that the scriptwriter has attempted to learn the history of the show and doesn't forget what the show was and hopefully still is about.

I like that Melissa Salmons appears to have paid attention to the show and is doing her best to really get into the fabric and history of what makes Y&R Y&R.

Janice Ferri Esser, from all accounts, is a writer people either love or hate. I love her!

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With a script, in the abstract, I can fully agree that history is a non-criterion.

With a SOAP script, using characters who have had a long past in your narrative, use of history is essential. It need not be explicit...that is, history can inform the motivations and personality of the character in the present without being spelled out. But it can also be explicit when needed, in the ways that Y&RWorldTurner has pointed out. Sometimes, history is just entertaining nostalgia for fans, and that also has value.

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Good point, although I'd think Smith, with his years with the Bells and being a former co-HW on the show, makes more than Shannon, too. I'd guess there's some loyalty factor in there where B&B would still go to Smith for multiple scripts, even at a higher cost, but they'd balance with the 3-1 ratio of Shannon v Mulcahey because Mulcahey, even his years in the business, doesn't have the "member of the family" status that Smith has.

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Very true.

In that sense, I was going to say that soaps should be par excellance examples of Ibsenesque dramaturgy. Meaning: how the past of characters shapes their present (e.g. Ghosts). That is one thing, but mentioning a name is not all that.

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And this is why you still adore GH's writers which just don't cut it for me anymore. Even if the general tune (Guza) is far too bad, good script writers would make sth. out of it by irony and, well yes, nods to history.

I consider acknoledgments to history is extremely. It appreciates you as longtime viewer, puts character's actions into perspective and truly distinguishes soaps from primetime series. Here you can relate to things which happened in the past and milk it...

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No. You are just saying that just to say something. I don't think you mean that. :P Because one thing are stories, the other dialogue, meaning purely the sentences these people exchange. And GH people know how to make those sentences sound — real. Too much irony is a bad thing and soap operas are really not a place for that. Irony is good in stories — e.g. Fate laughing at you at one point in time, making her revenge after you've done something bad in the past. But too much sarcastic/ironic comments are tiring. And Guza is clever — he will know if you're laughing at him in your script.

That's another non-truth. Meaning, one of those phrases people spread from one to another, repeat it ad nauseam and think it means something. After gazillion repeats, they start beliving in it. So, yes, I can accept, albeit hardly, that you truly believe this, but I don't. I think history should be used in an Ibsenesque way - your past coming back to haunt you etc., but not in a sense "mentioning Chantal" (sorry, A :P).

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Then I think you may not truly be a fan of the genre.

Chantal is a trivial character. She's appeared what? Five times? Nobody cares about Chantal, and nobody missed her. That said, her mention would speak volumes about Michael, and that is why we care.

Chantal exists in the Y&R universe as Michael's secretary, and those who work with him know about Chantal.

Thus, for him to say "call Chantal and get an appointment", or whatever he said, gives the moment a verisimilitude. This is what he would say in real life. At the process, it says to the audience "there is a continuity...Michael has maintained a stable office....though you have not seen that office in a long time, it remains as it was, and you can fill in the blanks of his quotidien days with what you once knew to be true."

All this, from the brief mention of Chantal. For those who have long watched, it helps them to visualize the tableau of Michael's life off the screen--it fills in the lines. (And yes, some of us like that). And for those who do not know Chantal, it nonetheless provides a naturalness. In real life, a lawyer like Michael would reference his Chantal to someone who knew her...or he would address his Chantal by name if he called her.

I see no losses, and only gains, from this type of "historical" mention. "Historical" almost seems like the wrong word. "Continuity-acknowledging" seems more precise.

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LMAO! I'm not THAT anal... No, what happened was that I was planning in late 2007 to do a blog about exactly why I detest Beall's writing... because people always seem to ask me that question. So, while writing it, I went in and did some research. As a lot of us do, I pay attention to who wrote that day's script, so I was able to roughly remember around what time something happened... cross referenced it with Toups' archive and TV Megasite's transcripts and the rest is history. But I got so busy with my off-board life (work, social and other activities) that I never got around to finishing the blog entry. I am no Elisabeth Hasslebeck. If I say something, I go in and find evidence to back it up. I don't just say "Amanda Beall's a hack!" because it's the thing to do and then have absolutely nothing to help show why I believe that.

But that 7/4/07 episode as absolutely dreadful. Addie Walsh wrote that breakdown and Beall wrote the script. Because of that, Addie's been on my shitlist. Again, it was HORRIBLE!

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Ah...that is the classic cognitive shortcut of one who relies on assumptions. That wasn't a personal criticism of you, but a subjective definition of fandom, which I tried to explain in the stuff you 'bammed'.

No matter. Soaps are evolving "living" narratives, and like all living things, they have a history. I think many of us are agreed that it should be referenced in some way, and we only quibble regarding the nature of the reference. You prefer "haunted by the past". I don't mind that...but I also don't mind "Remember the time when..."--just because reminiscence is an essential part of human nature.

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Honesty — I was too lazy to reply and more importantly unmotivated because I knew I wouldn't be able to convince you. You have a world of your own.

I receive lots of hate around here so I've become immune to people persecuting me, I didn't take your observation personally. ;)

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She was kind to him. He turned out, after months, to be the lady therapist’s thought-dead husband, and things were resolved. Such episodes do occur. But they are rare. They are too self-contained. Now the wife of the chief of all the doctors, having been kidnapped and returned some months ago, thinks she is going mad. Her paternal uncle was a schizophrenic in his time. There does not seem to be a single sense in which soap operas can be construed as an escapist form. There is unhappiness enough and time to occupy a real lifetime of afternoons. There is no release: not the scream, shudder, and return to real life that some people get from horror films; not the anxiety, violence, and satisfactory conclusion of detective, spy, or cowboy shows; certainly not the laughing chapters of fantasy home, like “Lucy,” “Bachelor Father,” or the “Mothers-in-law,” There is no escape except, either, from political realities. The allegations that the soaps avoid the topical are simply in error: Vietnam, psychosis, poverty, class, and generational problems—all are there. One thing that soap operas do not do is flinch. They simply bring things home, not as issues but as part of the manic-depressive cycle of the television set. And what they bring home is the most steady, open-ended sadness to be found outside life itself. No one can look forward to a soap unless he looks forward to the day, in which case he is not likely to be a watcher of soaps at all. Watchers resign themselves. There are seventeen soaps on television now [1972], some obviously less good than others ( a soap that fails is not simply dropped from the air; it is, for the audience’s sake, quickly wrapped up: The hero, for example is run over by a truck), and in their uncompromisingly funereal misery there is obviously some sort of key. Most sentimental or suspense forms —dog, horse, or spy stories, for instance—have a plotted curve. Things are briefly fine, then they’re down for a long time, then they rise for a brief finale. There is some reward. The soap line goes along almost straight, though inextricably tangled, down. The soaps are probably more true to the life of their own audience than they appear to be; certainly they are truer in pace, in content, and in subjects of concern than any other kind of television is. Not that there is much amnesia or that much insanity out here. Not that each woman’s secret fear, or hope, is that she is bearing the child of inappropriate member of her family. But the despair, the treachery, the being trapped in a community with people whom one hates and who mean one ill, the secrets one cannot expose—except once or twice — in the course of years when changes and revelations occur in sudden jumps: These must be the days of a lot of lives. This is not the evening’s entertainment, which one watches, presumably, with members of the family; not the shared family situation comedies, which (with the important exception of “All in the Family”) are comfortable distortions of what family life is like. Soap operas are watched in solitude. This is the daytime world of the Randolphs, the Matthewses, the Hortons, the Tates —a daily one-way encounter group, a mirror, an eavesdropping or the apparent depression of being just folks for more than twenty years. It is even entering the commercials now—the utter joylessness. There are still the cheery, inane commercials with white tornadoes and whiter wash. But there are beginning to be hopeless underdogs; unpretty, sarcastic Madge, who, as a manicurist, deals with actors who look as though they knew about life in cold-water flats. the emphasis on cold-water products. The view of life as a bitter, sad, dangerous ordeal, with a few seconds reprieve before the next long jolt to decent souls, cannot be confined to one side of the screen. Not on seventeen daytime serials. When, for millions, a credible villain is a suicide, dead, and well out of it. And, a hero is a man compelled to live his drama out, the daylight view of what life is like is far less sunny on television, anyway, than the view by night.
    • Heffa? Girl, bye? MONA!!!!!!!!!!! I'm rolling. 
    • It was just inexcusable. SMH. I'm surprised Lisa Brown didn't change it somehow. 
    • So many things would have had to be different for Mary to want to go back to Reginald. It could have been interesting if it had been handled completely differently but as it was we had a very black and white Mary good/Reginald bad. If she had been able to ignore his worldly crimes and how he treated his own children there was still the fact that he had separated her from her children. Maybe if they had shown us more intimacy and affection between them and had allowed him to have real vulnerabilities it could have worked but as it played out they didn't do much to present him with any sympathetic hook. There are a lot of ways to define wanting things to work. Fans are mostly thinking of preserving or restoring characters and an atmosphere that drew them to the show. The sponsor may only be thinking of the bottom line. When a producer or HW comes in and decides that their vision will deliver for the bottom line and they need to fire most of the cast in order to do it it can feel very much like not caring. 
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