The Politics Thread

[Roman]

and you and I both know he didn't mean to do this. wonder if this will teach the whole ass about opening his mouth (unless a hooker wants to use the bathroom)?

[DRW50]

 

I doubt he cares. He had a fit and will again, rinse and repeat. If he didn't stop during the election he won't now. 

[Khan]

 

Yep, lol.  But you know what they say: "God will take your bad situation and turn it into good."  The "bad" was Trump insulting Rep. Lewis on Twitter, but the "good" will be people learning about a Civil Rights pioneer whom they probably didn't even know existed beforehand.

 

Agree. Trump didn't learn a damn thing and never will.  Chances are, too, before he's finished, he'll have alienated every person in the country and beyond.

 

I know y'all disagree (which is fine) but I still believe the government (save for those "ride or dies" who will follow Trump no matter what) will tire of the man eventually.  If they don't impeach him, then they'll just start doing whatever the hell they want to and ignore whatever Trump has to say about it.  IOW, Trump will be a leader who isn't really leading anyone.

Edited January 14, 2017 by Khan

[dragonflies]

 

[DRW50]

I thought this was interesting.

 

http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/01/philippe-reines-donald-trump-214630

[GMac]

 

I honestly hope you're right.  As much as I can't stand Ryan or Rubio, and I actually have a little respect for McCain, I don't think any of them have much patience for Trump.  And they each have their own political ambitions.  Trump is a liability to them.  Hopefully, that is the case for the majority of republicans.

 

I hold no hope of Democrats gaining a majority in both legislatures, thanks to gerrymandering.  The Senate, however, might give us something in 2018.

 

[Juliajms]

I do think it's possible some of Trump's supporters will turn on him once things get bad enough.  His approval ratings are already disastrously low. We're going to pay a terrible price for it, but I do think his election is waking people up (including myself).

[Vee]

Was it here that that NYT piece about white women who voted for Trump got posted? Interviewing a bunch of them?

Besides the longstanding grudge against Hillary being 'untrustworthy', which was very prevalent, it all basically boiled down to existential anxiety about a changing world - feeling displaced economically was a big talking point, but to me that is just a convenient cloak, I think it all still goes back to white privilege and the delusion (whether overt or subliminal) that everything only went to hell with the black guy in charge, and that putting a traditional white, male, business-oriented face back in place will right the paradigm. The overriding throughline was we'll get the factories that sustained our families back, we'll get the businesses back! No, we won't. Things have changed.

 

When those people see Trump tank things even worse, there will be a backlash among the confused, depressed middle-class whites. The question is just what kind of spiral it will be. I wish I could feel more sympathy, because someone in the DNC will have to as a profession.

Edited January 15, 2017 by Vee

[DRW50]

Politico also had a piece on that, interviewing blue-collar women.

 

The problem, as Obama said last year, is that the GOP says and does most of the same things Trump says and does, they're just less blatantly ugly about it. They may have a shinier face, one for the media to tear their hair for yet again, but most of the policies won't change. They may be more likely to not get us bombed to hell, but considering some of the insane things media darling Marco and other "moderate" and "reasonable" Republicans were saying during the primary, I have my doubts. 

[GMac]

 

So very true.  

 

A few years ago, my hubby and I were over at our neighbors house having some cocktails with them and their children when the subject of white privilege came up.  My neighbors love Duck Dynasty, and their children are in various careers in law enforcement.  One is a cop, the other is a lawyer with juvenile justice and another is a corrections officer at the county jail.

 

Long story short, they didn't, or couldn't, admit that white privilege exists, and that it's a very real contributing factor in how the lives of POC.  It was disheartening.

 

I no longer spend time with any of them.  I know they supported DJT and that was just icing on the cake for me to ghost them.  But it gets better.  

 

When we first moved here, the same neighbors said that she was surprised at how "conservative" we were, that she thought we would have parties all the time.  You know, because we are gay.  That's what we do, apparently.  FF 10 years, a redneck family moves next door to us.  Parties every weekend.  Four wheelers up and down the street everyday.  Always something going on at that house...and guess what?  They are thick as theives with them.  

 

Another reason I have nothing to do with them anymore.

 

My apologies for rambling, y'all.

 

[Skin]

 

I'm actually willing to play ball with some of the mid-west voters who feel that they are being displaced by the economy. But only very marginally, the great recession may have been a huge wake up call for them that they weren't as "solid" as they believe themselves to be. The reality of the situation is that wages have been stagnant since the 80's, and as such due to inflation the dollar doesn't stretch as it once did and everything is rising and their salaries are not -- this is all true, but it's been true since forever. I think what blew out a candle or made the light go off was the recession that was more or less a lot like the Great Depression. I think for a lot of them these past few years have been a major wake up call that whatever they have can be gone in a split second, and they are right. On average people are only 3 or 4 steps away from homelessness and that's a hard pill to swallow when you feel that you were artificially "safe" for decades before. However this demographic is not the manufactured working class worker that Donald is pitching too. This specific subset of people are those who are currently employed pulling upwards of 50k+ jobs and are somewhat educated and in the age bracket of 50 or older. These are the demographics who have more or less been "safe" from the worst effects of the recession and who don't have faith that their children will have a better life then they had it. These are the folks who are hosting their kids after they paid for their college or are currently paying college tuition. This is a problem, but it's also inherently capitalistic - this isn't going to get better with Regan lite policies. When you live in a capitalistic society you end up with winners or losers always, and this is the nature of our country. These are the same people who are profoundly afraid of socialism but then hem and haw about the ill effects of capitalism and not being able to build wealth, and being 3 or 4 bad moves away from losing everything and having nothing for their children. These concerns are valid but they keep voting for more of the same and they are a big portion of the electorate -- precisely 70% of it.

 

I have no sympathy for the working class whites who refuse to acknowledge the end of manufacturing and do not want to change fields. This same thing happened in the black community and no one blinked an eye at it, but now because it's happening to poorly educated whites everyone is supposed to care.  At least they don't have to put up with the added stigma of believing that they are just lazy, violent, people who wanted to live on the welfare state and nothing about them or their problems was ever worthwhile.

 

Largely these problems aren't anything new, it's just - just like with social security these problems are so reactionary that they are coming up late in big ways. What makes me a bit upset is that if we had strong leadership we probably could be talking about ways to make this better - but due to the electoral college these problems will never get solved. Obama wasn't able to break the Reagan footfold in the belief of trickled down economics - but maybe Trump will be able to get them to realize that none of this stuff is going to work. Republicans have been set on an agenda that will harm their constituents the most, and I can only hope for the backlash of what will happen when they realize all of their aid is cut off and they can't eat or pay bills in addition to slashed wages. I'm worried about what form this backlash will be as well the Bundy's just got away with holding government property at gun point just last year. That kind of extremism with guns is horrifying.

 

 

His approval ratings are a disaster and they keep getting lower and lower. He has already lost Democrats and Moderates, the only thing keeping his score from completely collapsing is Republicans which favor him nearly 90%. Democrats and Moderates have rated him so low that his score has fallen down to something like 44% which was down from 51-52% (when he won the election) and down again from 48% (Republican candidate). If Republicans collapse on him he won't have anything to buoy his score. So far they are the only ones who have faith in him. I can only imagine what the floor will be. I'm predicting record lows by 2018.  

 

Edited January 15, 2017 by Skin

[MissLlanviewPA]

 

My motto since last year's election has been "Don't assume anything." I feel like it's important to keep it alive throughout this administration, too. 

 

(Not that I always followed it myself, mind you--I still wound up blind sighted by Election Night  in a big way.) 

Edited January 15, 2017 by MissLlanviewPA

[Vee]

Here is the NYT piece with the interviews with female Trump voters, incidentally.

 

I do believe the economic issue is a real one, but I think it's so bound up and intertwined with white existential fear over a changing multicultural society - something that is psychologically paired with immigration and the loss of manufacturing - that it's dishonest to separate them entirely, at least when it comes to the Trump voter. Obama saved our economy, he didn't tank it. But a lot of confused middle American whites conflate his rise with the changing sociocultural tides. They're not realizing the cratering began with Bush, and Obama inherited the hangover.

[DRW50]

I did a double take when I saw Rob Morrow's name tied to Peter Thiel (famous for ridding the world of Gawker in probably about the most destructive way possible). Thankfully it is not the actor I've found attractive for 25 years (still not enough to make me watch the last years of Northern Exposure...), but instead some other person with the same moniker.

 

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/01/peter-thiel-california-governor-bid-233632

[DramatistDreamer]

ICYMI,

 

Trump to meet Putin in first foreign trip as president: report

 

Exclusive: The Trump Administration May Evict the Press from the White House