17 minutes ago, marceline said:

Spanaberger is right. Progressives keep pushing unpopular policies and hanging them around the necks of red and purple state Dems with lousy talking points. Then they turn around and claim Dems are bad at messaging. Stop using the word socialism. Don't try to explain it. Just stop using it. Stop using a word that makes it harder to get what we want. Why is that so hard?

 

"Defund the police" actually harmed the BLM movement. After George Floyd's murder the support for BLM hit a record high of 67 percent. Then came "defund the police" and that horrible scene of BLM protestors surrounding that woman outside a Georgetown restaurant and support dropped by 20 points. 

 

 

 

Yeah, Schumer isn't the right man for this moment.

I feel this way about abortion. I remember during 2016 Hilary basically said that abortion should be on demand at any time in the pregnancy and I just cringed. I think it's even in the platform, although I need to look that up.  Late term abortion is not preformed on demand anywhere in this country. Stop feeding the crazies with that talk.

 

16 minutes ago, Vee said:

Police de-escalation, demilitarization is a lot better to work with then acting like you want to abolish the cops.

 

Agree.  Plus, it's really stupid and impractical.  There's nothing wrong with HAVING a police force.  We just need the DOJ to be more diligent in holding them accountable whenever they've crossed the lines.

I think Democrats need to invest in some media interviewing techniques like Pete, he is like the conservative whisperer, and they seem to "get it", when he speaks to them.  

13 minutes ago, marceline said:

I can confirm that the backlash against Fox is real. I have a friend who married into a MAGA family and we were just talking today and he confirmed that they are all saying that Fox News has "gone over to the dark side."

 

Fox News is evil, but it ain't stupid.  They can read the tea leaves just like the rest of us.  They know a post-Trump future is coming, and they're preparing for it.

1 minute ago, Skin said:

I think Democrats need to invest in some media interviewing techniques like Pete, he is like the conservative whisperer, and they seem to "get it", when he speaks to them.  

 

Buttigieg has been a very pleasant surprise. I had issues with him during the campaign but he has clearly learned where his strengths lie. I think we'll see good things from him in the future.

22 minutes ago, marceline said:

Spanaberger is right. Progressives keep pushing unpopular policies and hanging them around the necks of red and purple state Dems with lousy talking points. Then they turn around and claim Dems are bad at messaging. Stop using the word socialism. Don't try to explain it. Just stop using it. Stop using a word that makes it harder to get what we want. Why is that so hard?

 

"Defund the police" actually harmed the BLM movement. After George Floyd's murder the support for BLM hit a record high of 67 percent. Then came "defund the police" and that horrible scene of BLM protestors surrounding that woman outside a Georgetown restaurant and support dropped by 20 points. 

 

I agree socialism is a terrible electoral strategy...the problem for me is that I think it doesn't really matter what Democrats do, it's still going to be hung over them, similar to how the word "liberal" was for many years. Due to hyperpartisanship and media bias, anything that anyone on the left does is thrown onto Democrats. There was breathless media hype that Minnesota and then Kenosha were 1968 moments. There were months of sustained attacks against BLM, disinformation campaigns everywhere online and on Fox News. The defunding the police suggestions were mostly from a minority of Democrats and activists and ignored or condemned by most of the party, and I think they managed to diffuse the issue overall, but it's an example of how something, somewhere, will always be used as a weapon against them - another version of death panels, Green New Deal, etc.

 

I think the party has a lot of hard questions ahead, but I also think what they should realize - but obviously can't say out loud - is many of these races were going to be lost anyway. They let polling get to their heads. They should have focused more defensively and not fallen for the same trap many fell for in 2016 - that Trump was going to be a drag on the ticket for the GOP.

4 minutes ago, Skin said:

I think Democrats need to invest in some media interviewing techniques like Pete, he is like the conservative whisperer, and they seem to "get it", when he speaks to them.  

 

A lot of Rose Twitter absolutely loathes Buttigieg. Generally that means the person is doing something right. 

Sorry, but I don't trust Pete Buttigieg.  To me, he's a conservative in moderate's clothing.

The New York Times is reporting that Trump filed another lawsuit to get Philadelphia to stop counting votes because his observers were denied access to watch them count. He has a hearing scheduled at 5:30, why is he getting these quick hearings? 

 

6 minutes ago, Khan said:

Sorry, but I don't trust Pete Buttigieg.  To me, he's a conservative in moderate's clothing.

 

I largely don't care for him either, but he has a talent for breaking through to them that other Dems could learn from. When he opens his mouth, conservatives don't hear sirens or a Charlie Brown sound, and it doesn't make them want to recoil and vote red. Democrats have a real voting problem if they can't turn out the Latinx vote going forward, those are keys to flipping Texas, Florida, Arizona and keeping Nevada and New Mexico. Democrats will eventually lose Minnesota, Michigan and Wisconsin due to socio-economic and cultural factors - the writing is on the wall. They need to prepare and invest in the future. 

Edited November 5, 20205 yr by Skin

16 minutes ago, marceline said:

I can confirm that the backlash against Fox is real. I have a friend who married into a MAGA family and we were just talking today and he confirmed that they are all saying that Fox News has "gone over to the dark side."

Meanwhile Fox news created the dark side. When someone who used to be normal joins the cult it's almost always Fox News at the root of it. At least some of these cultists are waking up. I think (ok hope) some of them can be rescued over the next couple of years.

5 minutes ago, Juliajms said:

Meanwhile Fox news created the dark side. When someone who used to be normal joins the cult it's almost always Fox News at the root of it. At least some of these cultists are waking up. I think (ok hope) some of them can be rescued over the next couple of years.

 

OANN is the new Fox News. That and insane conspiracy videos and grifting circuits on Youtube - stuff like Daily Wire, Prager U, Joe Rogan. Right now there are mostly just a handful of personalities who keep the crazies happy on Fox, like Laura Ingraham and Tucker Carlson (many of them don't care for Sean Hannity). Once they're gone the channel is probably going to end up in some type of rebranding, I guess depending on what the Murdochs want. Whether that will be good or bad, I don't know. I have a feeling their election guy is going to end up being a scapegoat though.

7 minutes ago, Khan said:

Sorry, but I don't trust Pete Buttigieg.  To me, he's a conservative in moderate's clothing.

 

I don't quite trust him either, but I think he's a pretty good strategist and television presence. He manages to get the language right, which is difficult for Democrats. 

Edited November 5, 20205 yr by DRW50

6 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

I agree socialism is a terrible electoral strategy...the problem for me is that I think it doesn't really matter what Democrats do, it's still going to be hung over them, similar to how the word "liberal" was for many years. Due to hyperpartisanship and media bias, anything that anyone on the left does is thrown onto Democrats. There was breathless media hype that Minnesota and then Kenosha were 1968 moments. There were months of sustained attacks against BLM, disinformation campaigns everywhere online and on Fox News. The defunding the police suggestions were mostly from a minority of Democrats and activists and ignored or condemned by most of the party, and I think they managed to diffuse the issue overall, but it's an example of how something, somewhere, will always be used as a weapon against them - another version of death panels, Green New Deal, etc.

 

I definitely believe "the 'S' word" is what killed Kendra Horn's chances for reelection in Oklahoma.  It was one thing to suggest that she had voted against the oil and gas industry and put 90,000 Oklahomans' jobs at risk in the process.  That was easily debunked.  But, once ads here suggested she was in deep with AOC and Nancy Pelosi...?  Forget it.

1 minute ago, Khan said:

 

I definitely believe "the 'S' word" is what killed Kendra Horn's chances for reelection in Oklahoma.  It was one thing to suggest that she had voted against the oil and gas industry and put 90,000 Oklahomans' jobs at risk in the process.  That was easily debunked.  But, once ads here suggested she was in deep with AOC and Nancy Pelosi...?  Forget it.

 

I agree, but then she won in 2018 with AOC and Pelosi both national figures. I think 2020 was just too much turnout. I hope she might run again.

10 minutes ago, Juliajms said:

When someone who used to be normal joins the cult it's almost always Fox News at the root of it.

 

Exhibit A: Mama Khan -- who, I swear, has fallen even further down the rabbit hole into QAnon.

7 minutes ago, Skin said:

The New York Times is reporting that Trump filed another lawsuit to get Philadelphia to stop counting votes because his observers were denied access to watch them count. He has a hearing scheduled at 5:30, why is he getting these quick hearings? 

 

 

I largely don't care for him either, but he has a talent for breaking through to them that other Dems could learn from. When he opens his mouth, conservatives don't hear sirens or a Charlie Brown sound, and it doesn't make them want to recoil and vote red. Democrats have a real voting problem if they can't turn out the Latinx vote going forward, those are keys to flipping Texas, Florida, Arizona and keeping Nevada and New Mexico. Democrats will eventually lose Minnesota, Michigan and Wisconsin due to socio-economic and cultural factors - the writing is on the wall. They need to prepare and invest in the future. 

I've been saying for ages that it's hubris to believe that demographics alone can save us. Latin America has a strong Catholic streak.  Not everyone thinks that their economic interest is the most important thing. Obviously that's true for white evangelicals as well. By now we all know that Cuban Americans hate the idea of socialism. Until we convince more of them that isn't what we stand for, it seems unlikely we will get their votes.

1 minute ago, Khan said:

 

Exhibit A: Mama Khan -- who, I swear, has fallen even further down the rabbit hole into QAnon.

Oh, no. I'm really sorry to hear it. It frightens me how many people have fallen for this conspiracy theory.  Part of me thinks it's that these older retired folks are lonely and QAnon/Fox gives them a sense of mission and community.