Santa Barbara Discussion Thread

[sungrey]

I haven't posted here in a long time, but I thought I'd post here with my knowledge of Santa Barbara and my love for the show.

While SB was one of the must-watch shows in 1984-1989 (its last years were good, but by 1992 you could tell the quality was going downhill), it could be one of the maddening shows when it came to characters leaving or being recast.

It's no secret that I LOVED Hayley. Like Juniorz1 pointed out, the character wasn't supposed to be the villainess or the victimizer, but Stacy Edwards had an effective acting style. They threw so much at the character and during the rape story she was just so damn good. Then several months later they killed the character and I almost flipped to Guiding Light five years early. Not only did Hayley's death effectively kill Todd McKee's screen time on SB, it almost brought down Gina. Bridget Dobson said she never would have killed Hayley because Hayley anchored Gina and Gina wasn't as fun to watch when she was a pure bitch. Still, NBC/New World prevailed. It's interesting that when they brought Lily Light back in 1991 with Paula Devine playing the role, they dropped the minister angle and she was essentially filling the Hayley role. As for Stacy, like a lot of good soap actors she found work (and a LOT of it) in prime time. She's still around today.

Lenore Kasdorf being let go was disgusting. Lenore was a great actress and given time I think her relationship with Lionel could have taken off. Instead, Caroline died and Lionel was reduced to window dressing (and subsequently left the show for two years).

I know we never would have gotten Lane Davies' marvelous chemistry with Nancy Grahn, but Harley Kozak being written out of SB was an all-time screwup as well. Mason as tragic hero was more interesting, but when he was in love the character was quite sweet.

Edited October 20, 2010 by sungrey

[DRW50]

Why did NBC/New World want Hayley dead?

So of all the dumb decisions at SB, the only one the Dobsons were responsible for was Mary's death? And then I guess some would say the Kelly recast?

[juniorz1]

Actually, from what I've read, the straw that broke the camel's back was the casting of a very pivotal role, Pamela Capwell. The Dobsons wanted Marj Dusay, while Bailey & I believe Pratt, fought for Samantha Eggar. Eggar was cast but never made it to air- she couldn't handle the amount of lines and work that went into a daytime drama. But then they went with Shirley Anne Field, who I personally really liked in the role. She was what I always imagined Pamela to be.

Ironically enough, Field also had problems with the workload & memorization of the lines so after all that, Marj Dusay was brought on to play Pamela. And, I may be wrong here, but I believe the Dobsons were already gone by that point.

[sungrey]

Carl, it wasn't that they didn't want the character dead. I think they were looking for something dramatic, pulled a name out of a hat and voila, instant character death. To be fair, it wasn't just Hayley. They did it with a few other characters... Amado in 1991, Sasha in 1990, Andrea in 1988, Mary in 1986, etc.

[juniorz1]

GREAT post sungrey. Please, post in this thread more often!

If I'm not mistaken, Stacey Edwards (Hayley) was one of the early victims of focus groups. She was never my favorite character, but she easily could have been a run of the mill milquetoast victim. But Edwards gave her some strength that wasn't necessarily in the writing so the credit solely belongs to her. She wasn't my fave, but I was very sad the day she was hit by that car. And she was AWESOME in that rape storyline.

I also agree that killing off Harley Jane Kozak's Mary was a HUGE blunder. She was a fabulous actress and for my money (and this says ALOT coming from me), she rivaled Marcy's Eden as one of the great heroines on the show at the time. However, I truly think Mason still may have ended up paired with Julia and I think it would have been a DYNAMITE triangle that could have played out for years. It's probably why I'm currently writing that triangle in my SON blog, Return to Santa Barbara (shameless plug). Much unlike the sh!t Julia/Mason/Tori triangle we ended up with. It cracks me up to this day when I see in print that that triangle was one of the greats because the there was no clear choice & both had rooting value. Um, no, not in this viewer's (and I believe MANY others') eyes. Tori was a terrible character, always so desperate & clingy, first with Cruz and then with Mason. It didn't help that Kristen Meadows was just an okay actresss. One other thing I always found unbelievable is how many mags rated her as one of the most beautiful actresses in soaps. She even made it over Marcy, Judith, Nancy, Jane Rogers, and many other classic SB beauties in SOD's (formerly) annual Soaps Most Beautiful Actresses issue.

Check out Harley Jane's powerhouse final performance. One of the great classic death scenes of all time

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[sungrey]

Thanks, Juniorz. SB was one of my all-time favorite shows and it always pissed me off when they would have the periodic housecleaning of characters because a lot of times they swept characters away that never should have been dismissed. The Elena story was one of my all time favorites, and I wonder how much more Sherilyn Wolter could have done with the role, but she was introduced by April and gone by September 1987. Guess we'll never know.

John Allen Nelson was a fantastic Warren... he looked like he could be Nick Coster's SON, for crying out loud... and they gave him absolutely nothing to do.

[juniorz1]

And he ACTED like Coster's son. His voice, his inflections, his mannersims, My GOD! He was perfectly cast & I cannot fathom why they let him go. Jack Wagner was utter sh!t when he came on. I sort of liked him initially- the rivalry with Mason, his pairing with Angela (Nina Arveson WAS & IS a goddess- why is she not on soaps today!?!). But then, they put him with BJ & it all went to hell.

[Soaplovers]

Didn't Stacy Edward's character accidently kill another character named Amy Perkins? What was that character like?

My mom, to this day, swears SB's fall started with Mary's death and that the final nail in the coffin was when Eden went bye-bye circa 1991.

What was everyone's impressions of Flame? I think she was in cahoots with Quinn then reformed and vanished?

[juniorz1]

Yes, Hayley accidentally caused the explosion at Brick's restaurant, Johnny's Place, that caused Amy Perkins death. Amy was never too prominently featured a character and, while I first got started watching SB in 1985, by 1986, Amy was barely seen so I didn't know her very well before she died. IIRC, though, she was the last surviving member of the Perkins family, one of SB's original core family. Since then, I have received DVDs from readers of "Return to Santa Barbara" and listeners to my old BTR talk show, "Talkin Santa Barbara!" that featured Amy. She was a pretty strong character and a played by a good actress too. She had that Demi Moore-esque raspy voice that I rather enjoy in many actresses.

I'd have to sort of agree with your mom, as those were two of my favorite heroines on the soap. Eden's death was without a doubt, undeniably the final nail in SB's coffin. I'll never forgive the writers & producers for not even giving our Eden an exit. Marcy's last storyline was the split personality- we were treated to mostly Lisa in the end, with Eden struggling to come through. I believe Eden fell off the cliff in May 1991. Marcy came back in June with a God-awful brown wig as another personality, Suzanne Collier. It was ridiculous that neither Cruz nor Sophia recognized her when it was so clearly Eden. Her final scenes were played as another personality, that of her brother Channing, as she recreated Channing's shooting, the storyline that SB was founded on. It was just awful that what we thought at the time were her final scenes were her shooting her mother as Channing. No Eden resurfacing, no good bye to Cruz, nothing.

They did have a scene of her about a month later- it was uncredited & not in the soap mags that she'd be back. Cruz had found the real Suzanne & Eden was seen in the window watching them. Tears running down her face, she lipped the words "Good bye Cruz. I love you." She proceeded to leave her wedding ring on the window sill, which Cruz found & went after her. It wasn't much, but I was thankful for that one final glimpse of my beloved Eden & for her sorta good bye to Cruz.

Flame was the hotness. Her leather dominatrix wardrobe was the bomb as was her outta control hair. Roberta Bizeau just oozed sex & the character wasn't the same when she was recast (can't even remember the other actress's name). She was a true original. I remember Michael Logan suggested Bizeau when Y&R was recasting Phyllis. She would have been perfect, far better than the AWFUL Sandra Nelson. Who knows if fans would have even wanted Stafford back had Bizeau been cast.

[DRW50]

Weren't Born and Bideaux married in real life for a while?

[Bright Eyes]

What was the connection SB had to Sunset Beach?

[DRW50]

Pratt. Both popular in Europe.

[Bright Eyes]

I meant onscreen. Did Sunset Beach not have some sort of connection to SB that way?

[dm.]

Well, Sunset Beach character did often reference going to Santa Barbara for some stuff.

Other than that, no. There are a few actors that they have in common... Gordon Thomson, Margarita Cordova, Sydney Penny, Jack Wagner... but I guess that's all... I do remember there being a list of connections somewhere on the net a few years ago.

[Y&RWorldTurner]

Many of the old Santa Barbara sets were recycled on Sunset Beach.