23 hours ago, I Am A Swede said:

Mr Edwards and Miss Beadle is bad enough, but the thought of Etta Plum(!) and Mr Edwards doing the nasty is.... nasty! 😱

I usually avoid the final season like the plague (while still committing to finishing the whole series), but I finally saw a big chunk of an episode where he has this big romance with a blind 19-year-old. VOMIT.

Miss Beadle should have been Walnut Grove's casually loose woman that was mysteriously accepted and encouraged by her contemporaries in the 1870s-1880s. Bring her back to have an affair with John Carter.

14 hours ago, Soaplovers said:

The Betty White Show where she played a Sue Ann Nivens like character and it showed that she couldn't lead a show playing such a vile character.

Man, I just get so frustrated when I think of what they decided to do as her post-MTM comeback. A show within a show where 55-year-old Betty plays an actress who plays a TV action star, and the whole thing is shot on videotape!?!?! Just foolish. I maintain that they should have just spun Sue Ann, softened the character, and made her the executive chef of a Stratford Inn type of country house in the Midwest or New England. It might not have endured as long as the MTM Show did, but it would have been a better showcase of Betty's comedic talent, plus you know there would have been a great ensemble. Betty White Show was just her, John Hillerman, and Georgia Engel. All three TV greats, but stuffed together in such a dumb premise?

11 hours ago, DRW50 said:

Rue also had a thankless role on Mama's Family for two seasons, which she did well with. I've sometimes wondered if there was any spite toward her for not returning when the show went into syndication, based on the way they killed Aunt Fran off.

It's possible there was some spite, but it would have been pretty silly on the producers part since Mama's Family was off a full two years before syndication revived it and Rue was starting the second season of The Golden Girls by then. Rue was asked about Mama's Family in an interview and she sort of waved off the question in a "don't remind me" sort of way. A check is a check, but from a creative standpoint Fran was such a pathetic, whiny character that Rue probably was not happy with playing.

11 hours ago, DRW50 said:

Rue also had a thankless role on Mama's Family for two seasons, which she did well with. I've sometimes wondered if there was any spite toward her for not returning when the show went into syndication, based on the way they killed Aunt Fran off.

30 minutes ago, ReddFoxx said:

It's possible there was some spite, but it would have been pretty silly on the producers part since Mama's Family was off a full two years before syndication revived it and Rue was starting the second season of The Golden Girls by then. Rue was asked about Mama's Family in an interview and she sort of waved off the question in a "don't remind me" sort of way. A check is a check, but from a creative standpoint Fran was such a pathetic, whiny character that Rue probably was not happy with playing.

In her Television Academy interview, Rue talks about her time on "Mama's Family." Initially, she says, she looked forward to working with Vicki Lawrence and Ken Berry (whom she had had a crush on), because Aunt Fran, as originally written, was supposed to be this force of nature who could go toe-to-toe with Thelma. By the time production began, however, the plan had changed, with Dorothy Lyman (or, "this actress on 'All My Children'," as Rue refers to her) added as Thelma's chief antagonist, and Aunt Fran being reduced to "this mousy little thing with the Peter Pan collars and the ringlets." So, yeah, Rue wasn't happy about that experience, because Fran was no longer the character she had envisioned portraying.

Edited 6 hours ago6 hr by Khan

Sara Gilbert, like her big sister Melissa Gilbert, had an interesting attempt trying to get lightening to strike twice post Roseanne.

Welcome To New York (2000) - She co-starred on a short live sitcom that starred Christine Baranski & Jim Gaffigan

After that, she had two recurring roles on ER & 24

Twins (2005) - She and Molly Stanton (Charity Passions) were fraternal twins working at their dad's lingerie company with their parents being played by Melanie Griffith & Mark Linn Baker. Cute show, got the axe due to the WB & UPN merger

Had two recurring roles on both Big Bang Theory & a short lived sitcom called The Class

She co-created The Talk (talk show)

Bad Teacher (2014) - Short lived tv version of the far superior 2011 classic

Living Biblically - Short-lived sitcom where she had a recurring role as a smart aleck work associate

Finally, she found long term success in the revival of Roseanne before it morphed into the inferior The Connors.

53 minutes ago, All My Shadows said:

Man, I just get so frustrated when I think of what they decided to do as her post-MTM comeback. A show within a show where 55-year-old Betty plays an actress who plays a TV action star, and the whole thing is shot on videotape!?!?! Just foolish. I maintain that they should have just spun Sue Ann, softened the character, and made her the executive chef of a Stratford Inn type of country house in the Midwest or New England. It might not have endured as long as the MTM Show did, but it would have been a better showcase of Betty's comedic talent, plus you know there would have been a great ensemble. Betty White Show was just her, John Hillerman, and Georgia Engel. All three TV greats, but stuffed together in such a dumb premise?

ICAM with everything you've said here, @All My Shadows! 

8 minutes ago, Khan said:

ICAM with everything you've said here, @All My Shadows! 

It might have worked better had Betty's TV character been a Waltons type mom so there would have been a contrast b/w the angelic character she played and the bitchy off screen persona.

16 minutes ago, Paul Raven said:

It might have worked better had Betty's TV character been a Waltons type mom so there would have been a contrast b/w the angelic character she played and the bitchy off screen persona.

I see where you're coming from, @Paul Raven , but I'm also inclined to agree with @All My Shadows . I think a spin off centered around Sue Ann (with Phyllis popping in occasionally, since I think Betty and Cloris always worked so well together) would've had a better chance at success post-MTMS.

The biggest issue I had with "The Betty White Show" - apart from the underwhelming supporting cast* and the videotape look that made the entire production look cheap and muddy - was that the BTS satire of '70's cop shows was so toothless, like a really bad "Carol Burnett Show" sketch. IMO, if you're going to do a satire of something, you've got to be razor sharp, or you'll look skittish, which will KILL the comedy but good.

(*If we ever compile an official "Actors They Tried SO Hard to Make Happen" list, I'm adding Caren Kaye's name to the top of that list).

Edited 3 hours ago3 hr by Khan

Betty White was too one note and limited as an actress to have given Sue Ann Nivens layers. Even her one role that was against type (Rose on Golden Girls eventually became passive aggressive and not as innocent/sweet as she was at the start of the show).

Betty White worked better as part of a cast of players and never as the sole lead. In fact, her Hot in Cleveland character was kind of the weak link on the show and I preferred the other three actresses over her (She was no Estelle Getty, who would have given Elka layers).

36 minutes ago, Khan said:

I see where you're coming from, @Paul Raven , but I'm also inclined to agree with @All My Shadows . I think a spin off centered around Sue Ann (with Phyllis popping in occasionally, since I think Betty and Cloris always worked so well together) would've had a better chance at success post-MTMS.

The biggest issue I had with "The Betty White Show" - apart from the underwhelming supporting cast* and the videotape look that made the entire production look cheap and muddy - was that the BTS satire of '70's cop shows was so toothless, like a really bad "Carol Burnett Show" sketch. IMO, if you're going to do a satire of something, you've got to be razor sharp, or you'll look skittish, which will KILL the comedy but good.

(*If we ever compile an official "Actors They Tried SO Hard to Make Happen" list, I'm adding Caren Kaye's name to the top of that list).

As it happens, I created that very thread!

35 minutes ago, Soaplovers said:

Betty White was too one note and limited as an actress to have given Sue Ann Nivens layers. Even her one role that was against type (Rose on Golden Girls eventually became passive aggressive and not as innocent/sweet as she was at the start of the show).

Betty White worked better as part of a cast of players and never as the sole lead. In fact, her Hot in Cleveland character was kind of the weak link on the show and I preferred the other three actresses over her (She was no Estelle Getty, who would have given Elka layers).

I think Betty did perfectly fine at giving Ellen Harper layers. I think that was her best role. Sue Ann was always a caricature, so it would have been difficult to make a caricature come to life. Still, they could have tried.

To me Hot in Cleveland was just a very false show - I could always see LAUGH NOW signs in the background. I don't think I ever laughed when I saw it, although my parents enjoyed it so I'm glad for that.

1 hour ago, Khan said:

I see where you're coming from, @Paul Raven , but I'm also inclined to agree with @All My Shadows . I think a spin off centered around Sue Ann (with Phyllis popping in occasionally, since I think Betty and Cloris always worked so well together) would've had a better chance at success post-MTMS.

The biggest issue I had with "The Betty White Show" - apart from the underwhelming supporting cast* and the videotape look that made the entire production look cheap and muddy - was that the BTS satire of '70's cop shows was so toothless, like a really bad "Carol Burnett Show" sketch. IMO, if you're going to do a satire of something, you've got to be razor sharp, or you'll look skittish, which will KILL the comedy but good.

(*If we ever compile an official "Actors They Tried SO Hard to Make Happen" list, I'm adding Caren Kaye's name to the top of that list).

I agree with your assessment of the cop show satire angle. I know there was a weariness for the genre by the time TBWS began, but by then, so many of those shows, especially the type TBWS was trying to lampoon, were winding down. By the 1977-1978 season, "Charlie's Angels" was the one and only crime drama pulling in big numbers, and outside of the Caren Kaye character, that's not really the kind of cop show TBWS was going for. Like you said, it might've been enough for a sketch on Carol's show (which was also at its end!), but to build a whole series around?

Edited 1 hour ago1 hr by All My Shadows

5 hours ago, ReddFoxx said:

It's possible there was some spite, but it would have been pretty silly on the producers part since Mama's Family was off a full two years before syndication revived it and Rue was starting the second season of The Golden Girls by then. Rue was asked about Mama's Family in an interview and she sort of waved off the question in a "don't remind me" sort of way. A check is a check, but from a creative standpoint Fran was such a pathetic, whiny character that Rue probably was not happy with playing.

4 hours ago, Khan said:

In her Television Academy interview, Rue talks about her time on "Mama's Family." Initially, she says, she looked forward to working with Vicki Lawrence and Ken Berry (whom she had had a crush on), because Aunt Fran, as originally written, was supposed to be this force of nature who could go toe-to-toe with Thelma. By the time production began, however, the plan had changed, with Dorothy Lyman (or, "this actress on 'All My Children'," as Rue refers to her) added as Thelma's chief antagonist, and Aunt Fran being reduced to "this mousy little thing with the Peter Pan collars and the ringlets." So, yeah, Rue wasn't happy about that experience, because Fran was no longer the character she had envisioned portraying.

Thanks. I suppose she must have been glad to see the syndicated years where Dorothy was completely defanged and just had to play an idiot (one of several reasons I think the syndicated years were inferior to the network version - and no, Bubba's ass wasn't enough compensation, as we already got that with Buzz on the network version anyway).

One of the problems with Fran was she was mousy but not in an interesting way. Iola, who was in some ways a Fran replacement, was mousy, but quirky.

The only thing I remember of Fran is when she once confessed to a crime - she had ripped the tag off of her mattress.

Wow lol how did I miss this thread and how quick it blew up? 😅

Some additional stars I hadn’t seen mentioned yet.…

@Khan Don’t forget about Larry Hagman. Of course I Dream of Jeannie and Dallas was his hits, but it seemed between the two shows he was just a working actor from guest role to guest role for much of the 70’s.

After Dallas In 1997 CBS and Hagman tried to arrange a comeback with a show called Orleans, a blend of legal and family drama set in New Orleans. It premiered decently but immediately lost steam, and CBS actually promoted the fact that they were moving the show to 9PM/8PM on Fridays to the old Dallas timeslot. Obviously that failed even worse and the show was cancelled.

Hagman had that brief recurring guest stint on Desperate Housewives but it didn’t go anywhere and that was right before the Dallas revival was announced.

Speaking of Desperate Housewives have any of the actresses starred in anything major since? I know Cross and Huffman (before her arrest) starred in a couple of dismally failed ABC series. I know for a while there like around 2000 or so between Lois & Clark and DH Hatcher was actually best known for her Radio Shack commercials lol.

Finally for now we’ve mentioned other stars like Robert Ulrich and Morgan Fairchild but what of other recurring stars like Valerie Mahaffey (may she RIP)?

Some more modern primetime stars I can think of that had their hits and misses are definitely Peter Krause, Emily Van Camp, Noah Galvin (what a disaster lol), Marcia Gay Harden, and Zachary Quinto.

6 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

Thanks. I suppose she must have been glad to see the syndicated years where Dorothy was completely defanged and just had to play an idiot (one of several reasons I think the syndicated years were inferior to the network version - and no, Bubba's ass wasn't enough compensation, as we already got that with Buzz on the network version anyway).

One of the problems with Fran was she was mousy but not in an interesting way. Iola, who was in some ways a Fran replacement, was mousy, but quirky.

The only thing I remember of Fran is when she once confessed to a crime - she had ripped the tag off of her mattress.

I think the problem for Fran is that the NBC run of Mama's Family had too large of a cast. Mama has three kids, two in-laws, two grandkids, and a sister. Even if you didn't have everyone present in every episode, it still had to be tough to develop a place for each character. IMO, the syndicated run tightened it up and yes, it was more cartoony, but the cast just seemed to gel better as you knew what role each character was meant to play.

Another actor who had more successes than failures: Lee Majors. You really forget just how busy he stayed over a 20 or so year period. The Big Valley, The Men from Shiloh (the final season of The Virginian), Owen Marsall: Counselor at Law, The Six Million Dollar Man, and The Fall Guy. After that many hits, you really don't need any others.

Edited 1 hour ago1 hr by All My Shadows

19 minutes ago, soapfan770 said:

Some more modern primetime stars I can think of that had their hits and misses are definitely Peter Krause

Peter Krause is an interesting one! I first saw him on Cybill as the older daughter’s husband. Then he popped up in Sport’s Night, which was beloved but not highly rated. Then Six Feet Under, Parenthood, and 911, which I kind of think was beneath his talents. But he’s been a series as a lead for over 20 years, a real fixture on TV.

Speaking of Cybill, I also think of Christine Baranski as a tv fixture, but she had a lot of roles between Maryanne and the Good Wife. And PK’s Parenthood costar Lauren Graham has so many failed shows before Gilmore Girls and after Parenthood.