GH: Classic Thread

[carolineg]

Sorry I should have clarified I was happy the role was cast/brought on not the actor in particular.  But I was willing to give RS a chance because Scully used to talk about what a f*ck up his son was, so him looking like that didn't throw me off that badly.  The stories they gave him were way off, but I sort of pictured Joe Scully Jr. as some sort of New Jersey mafia guy that only had power and cred because of his dad and everyone knew he sucked lol. 

[Vee]

It was classic Carlivati that Joe Jr. was an admitted rapist, pusher and habitual abuser of women who basically came on saying 'yeah, but I feel bad about that stuff now, also I didn't rape the bitch!' Except he obviously did and there was no ambiguity about it, just his weak denials. Yet we were clearly expected for the bulk of his run to feel things for him, consider him to be a complicated character and take his potential pairing with Tracy seriously. They kept trying to play him as an actual older male consideration for Tracy, with his long-lost son, etc. despite his backstory. Tracy pining away at the mansion going 'oh, Joe.'

I don't know what made them drop it all, which they did not long before killing off Trey (a.k.a. Ford: The Sequel with the exact same introduction) too. The whole Scully family drama with them, the family pimp medallion and Connie was dumb as hell. Frank and Ron went from annoyingly invested in those characters to abandoning them all overnight. Their investment in Connie and Kelly Sullivan faded not too long after in 2013. (Remember when they did a 10-minute love triangle with Connie, Sonny and Olivia with Olivia positioned as his true love? That was weird af too.)

Edited April 26, 2023 by Vee

[carolineg]

You aren't wrong in at all in your view point.  I see it slightly differently.  I don't think the characterization of him was that far off from what it should have been with how Scully Sr. described him, but he should have been a straight up sleazy villian.

The pairing with a smart woman like Tracy was a big problem.  We've seen Tracy go down some unwise paths in love, but not one as obvious as this. 

I think the failure of Trey, NuKristina, NuConnie all at once was just too much. Scrap and move on.  Some of the loudest complaints from GH at the time were these characters and this story.   The Connie rape stuff was downright vulgar.  Pair that with subpar and at sometimes bizarrely crazy acting choices made all of this so distasteful.

In regards to Olivia/Kate we've had this conversation.  There wasn't a need for both.  Either make Olivia the first love or make Kate the mother of Dante (Megan Ward's version because KSu is probably actually younger than Dominic).  The flip flop of the entire Sonny's first love thing was weird because it was already a little sketch when Sonny came on as a man who had never been in love before Brenda and said so often.  You can allow Kate or Olivia, but not two huge loves Sonny just didn't mention the his first 15 years on the show.  I will always suspect Megan Ward made someone mad behind the scenes.

[Vee]

Oh, I agree, we've been over all that. What I'm referring to is when Ron briefly revisited the triangle in 2013. They quickly started downshifting away from his and Frank's love affair with Kelly Sullivan and Connie/Kate (I wonder why - maybe realizing Maura West wasn't going anywhere, and would cost a lot? or planning for Michelle Stafford?) in early '13 and started moving towards a story with Olivia as the humble wallflower in Connie's shadow pining for Sonny while he was still with her glamorous, newly-integrated cousin. Then Connie was killed and Sonny and Olivia got together for about ten minutes. It was like a B/C-plot at best and it was one of the clearest indications Ron was not interested in Sonny at that time.

[carolineg]

I got you.  I think it was just to bide time?  KSu and her story weren't getting awards and accolades, so dump her and move a pretty well received LLC/Olivia in temporarily to set up the conflict with Carly (and Olivia getting accidently shot) to move Sonny into his downward spiral of killing AJ, being on the outs with Carly, and hooking up with Ava.  I think it was just to give Sonny and Olivia something to do since Olivia didn't have a love interest either.  Ron obviously didn't care for Sonny, but I don't think he cared much for Olivia either and it was easy to just bring the two together to advance the next phase of the story, IMO, at least.  Ron had moved on to shinier projects like Maura West or getting Michelle Stafford, which on paper seem like smarter bets than "BROADWAY STAR" Kelly Sullivan.

[AdelaideCate007]

You're right. It did involve Scully somehow too. Lucy was the decoy and they snatched her for some reason. I'd forgotten about Scully being part of all that lol. I'd blocked all that out.

There was also some mess involving Damian faking his death and framing Katherine at one point. I think that was yet another story that ended in hijinks with Lucy, Mac, Kevin, and Luke going to some hacienda spa to find him and bringing him back to Port Charles. Something in that vein. This was right before he died I think.

Edited April 26, 2023 by AdelaideCate007

[carolineg]

For the life of me I can't tell you why Damian/Scully were screwing up Deception's shipments or why that was profitable for them.  I almost want to say it was Sonny/Luke trying to distract Scully away from the earnings from Luke's club that he thought he had a right to and I think Lucy was game because she wanted to help or a distraction.  The details escape me, but it was something like that. 

I think the Damian faking his death might all be part of the same story or at least the continuation of it.  

 

[Vee]

I honestly have no clear memory of Scully Sr. himself today. That was in the era that all Sonny's mob adversaries just blended together for me - Scully, Moreno, Rivera (who at least had the Lily connection), maybe some other guy, then Sorel. They were all the same in my mind. (I do remember that the rumor at the time when JFP took over was that Sorel was going to rape Tamara Braun's NuCarly while Sorel's daughter, Angel made love with Sonny.)

They at least began making Sonny's rotating adversaries a bit more unique later on - the Alcazars, Manny Ruiz (who returned way too many times and was literally just a Xerox of Robert LoSardo's nip/tuck character who Guza had clearly watched on FX), Faith*, the Zaccharas. Then came the Balkan, lol. I'm sure that was a decent idea on paper. But it's still essentially the same story over and over: Baddie comes to town, Sonny and Jason win. Ava changed that pattern for awhile merely by surviving, but again she and Sonny are practically besties today which is still insane.

As a kid I had no idea WTF ELQ did. I don't remember many boardroom scenes in the '90s but maybe I'm forgetting. I do find the discussions of the business much more interesting rewatching today than I did back then. But they still seem to do most of the business anywhere but at ELQ. I guess ELQ was deeply tied to a variety of local town stuff in '94 (whatever that project in the working-class neighborhood was or whatever), which is a smart thing bc I think it tied back to Mary Mae, but it often seemed so ephemeral when they would just talk about it. The use of ELQ when Frank and Ron took over changed - it closely resembled the stories and choices they often played with with Buchanan Enterprises from OLTL, complete with office sets, but that all worked for me. For the first time in my memory you could see Michael, A.J., Tracy, etc. doing material things with ELQ, putting it towards actual story stuff or ventures that wasn't totally vaporware or conceptual. And I thought Chad worked very well in that role and with Sean Kanan and Jane, until he completely gave up on life onscreen around 2015 or so lol. Neither Michael nor Dante nor most other males pre-FV have had any kind of inner life or dynamism since Frank taking over, because any man who is not a huge Frank favorite is just a spare part/stock hunk on the show today.

* - as incredibly crass and demeaning as some of the material with Faith was, Cynthia Preston was incredible and still works today. IIRC Faith pretty definitively died onscreen but that was a mistake, because if she lived and was out there I could believe she could wreak havoc.

Edited April 27, 2023 by Vee

[carolineg]

@VeeFor me Scully was a lot different than Sonny's mob rivals after.  Scully took him off the streets and was like a father figure to Sonny and there was a lot of Sonny trotting around his great relationship with Scully in front of Mike all the while knowing Scully was trying to screw him.   Sonny also did a lot of things to impress Scully like show off his model girlfriend, his successful club, his record label etc.  There was an actual familial bond and Sonny felt really torn about betraying him after Scully gave him so much (in his mind).  The swagger of Sonny being the boss wasn't there and the stakes seemed higher in a lot of ways. It was Sonny's make her break or make moment in the mob and we didn't know if he was going to come out on top culminating in the moment where Sonny killed Joe to save Mike (I think I mistakenly said Mike killed Joe which is wrong in a previous post)

Scully as an actual character outside the Sonny dynamic wasn't that interesting or far from a stereotype.  He flirted with the ladies, gambled, drank, but seemed pretty harmless.  Rivera used to actually seem scary and was.   

 

 

Edited April 27, 2023 by carolineg

[Kane]

If I recall correctly, Damian wasn't trying to make a profit, he was just doing it to mess with Lucy (and ELQ). I can't recall what Scully's motivation was, but afterwards Lucy was trying to get revenge against them by teaming up with Sonny and Luke against Scully, who had come into town and expected a piece of the action from everything Sonny was involved in, including the club. The story ended with Scully kidnapping Lucy, Luke and Sonny rescuing her but getting caught by Scully, and Mike coming along just in time to take a bullet meant for Sonny, who then shot and killed Scully.

[soapfave06]

I was listening to old DC podcasts out of boredom while traveling to work and was reminded of my absolute favorite plot in my actual GH watching time-Metro Court Hostage Crises.

I was very young when watching and even got me James/Jerry as the culprit didn’t work. Was there someone else who could have been revealed behind the mask? 
 

In my current poor memory of thinking, I was thinking it could have been Manny and Mateo?

As amazing as it was I am just not sure the fallout was worth it. 

[carolineg]

That all seems correct to me.  I think Sonny/Luke made it seem like Deception was profitable or skimming from them was normal operations in the territory to Joe, so he thought it was a good idea.  Plus I think Joe liked Lucy (and Bobbie, but not the point here). 

So I guess the point of the last few pages of this thread is that Damian really was everywhere-we just forgot about it.

[titan1978]

Only when someone was getting a divorce! Then it was all they could talk about.  That’s how Lucy got her tiny share.

That is what happened- the best way to describe it is just like you did- hijinks at the spa.  Was Luke undercover as an old man?  It was pretty stupid but lead right into Damian’s murder.

[Franko]

I don't know if it's canon, but over the years, I've read that the Quartermaines originally hailed from Southampton, New York. Supposedly that was where Herbert and kin remained.

Looking back, I think that ELQ never quite mattered on the scale of, say, Ewing Oil, was because it took a long(er) time for it to ever feel vulnerable/in flux. I wouldn't trade Alan and Monica as doctors, but watching them spar with Edward over some business McGuffin or another, I'm caring about the character actions rather than why they're fighting. (Which has its pluses.) Who knows how things might have gone had non-doctor Tracy stayed in 1980? Or on the flip side, if Edward had been in medicine rather than business.

[depboy]

Winter 1969:

Monday, February 3, 1969: After Polly calls Phil threatening to tell Jessie that he is the father of her unborn child, Jessie convinces Phil to go see Polly.

Tuesday, February 4: Iris cares for Meg, who has the flu.  Polly gives Phil an ultimatum, either help her obtain an abortion or she'll tell Jessie he's the baby's father.

Wednesday, February 5: Jane gets a call from Denise asking to see her alone.

Thursday, February 6: Phil tells Jessie that Polly seems to be getting desperate.  Denise visits Jane and blames herself for all the bad things that happened to Howie.

Friday, February 7: Audrey calls Steve from the airport on the way to Mexico.  Polly tells Jessie that Phil is the father.

Monday, February 10: Tracy tells Douglas Burke she hopes to be able to help with his hypertension. Jessie recounts to Phil that Polly claims he is the father; Phil doesn't deny it.

Tuesday, February 11: Phil confronts Polly.

Wednesday, February 12: Audrey returns from Mexico -- the divorce if final. Howie reads in the paper that Freddy Wilton is suing Denise for divorce and names Howie as correspondent.

Thursday, February 13: Denise tries to reassure Jane that there was never an affair between her and Howie.

Friday, February 14: Tom takes Audrey to see the chief of Pediatrics with the hopes that she'll return to nursing. Tracy and Doug find warmth in one another.

Monday, February 17: Phil and Jessie speculate about Polly's next move.

Tuesday, February 18: Tom tells Meg that Iris seems happy in her new waitressing job.

Wednesday, February 19: Doug touches Tracy's facing and comments on her beauty. Lawyer Tim Flannagan calls Lee before offering Iris a job as his secretary.

Thursday, February 20: Phil tries to persuade Polly not to tell the world that he is the father of her child, but she only laughs at him.

Friday, February 21: When Lee finds out that Polly is claiming Phil as the baby's father, he refuses to help her with a paternity suit. Audrey is jittery about starting work in Pediatrics.

Monday, February 24: Lee and Meg celebrate their anniversary; Lee is delighted when Iris calls to say she is turning down Flannagan's offer.

Tuesday, February 25: Polly goes to a lawyer. Audrey asks Steve if he has any objection to her working at the hospital.

Wednesday, February 26: Steve and Audrey meet in the coffee shop...it's their wedding anniversary.

Thursday, February 27: Denise is admitted to the hospital with bleeding ulcers.  Polly writes in her diary that Dennis Y. Dennison, a lawyer, is willing to take her case.

Friday, February 28: Steve talks to Denise, who tells him about her marriage to Freddy. Phil tells Polly exactly what he thinks of her, and will, under no circumstances, help her get an abortion; after he leaves, Polly takes a bottle of pills from the medicine cabinet.

Monday, March 3: Lee is brought to the hospital after hurting his back. Polly takes the pills, writes in her diary, then panics and calls the hospital trying to reach Phil.

Tuesday, March 4: Phil returns Polly's call; she asks for him to come to her because she is sick.

Wednesday, March 5: Dr. Overland tells Meg that Lee must have traction. Phil goes to see Polly, learns she has taken pills to induce an abortion, and insists she go to the hospital.

Thursday, March 6: Howie comes to visit Denise in the hospital and tells her he got a new job. Tracy tells Doug the dangers of renal surgery, but he decides to go ahead. Phil forcibly carries Polly out of the apartment, picking up her diary at her command.

Friday, March 7: As a frantic Jessie worries about Phil, the audience sees an auto accident has happened with Polly lying motionless on the pavement and Phil trying to rouse her.

Monday, March 10: Polly is pronounced dead.

Tuesday, March 11: Tracy admits to Meg that she has grown fond of Doug. Denise calls Howie with the news that Freddy is dropping the charge of infidelity.

Wednesday, March 12: Lt. Todd comes to see Phil and questions him about the accident. Douglas Burke's renal surgery is scheduled for tomorrow.

Thursday, March 13: Iris gives up her waitress job to help Lee run his office while he's in traction. Lt. Todd questions Steve about Polly's pregnancy. Doug's surgery is successful.

Friday, March 14: Howie meets a co-worker, Beverly Cleveland, at the water cooler at his job.  Phil and Jessie return from Polly's funeral as Lt. Todd shows the D.A. Polly's autopsy report; they speculate why Phil didn't tell Todd about Polly's overdose and the fact that she was pregnant.

Monday, March 17: Doug tells Tracy how much she has meant to him. Phil is forced to admit to Todd that he knew about the overdose and pregnancy.

Tuesday, March 18: Denise and Steve share some of their troubles.

Wednesday, March 19: Howie helps Beverly avoid trouble at work. Jessie tries to reassure Phil that it is impossible that Todd will find out that Polly was claiming Phil as the baby's father.

Thursday, March 20: Doug confesses his love for Tracy. The D.A. urges Todd to find out who the father of Polly's baby was.

Friday, March 21: Todd questions Jessie on if she has any idea who the father of Polly's child may be.

Monday, March 24: Jessie tells Todd that Polly was trying to blackmail Phil into helping her get an abortion by accusing him of being the baby's father.

Tuesday, March 25: Jane and Howie quarrel over his casual attitude towards work.

Wednesday, March 26: Lucille warns Audrey that Denise is interested in Steve.

Thursday, March 27: Tracy discusses with Tom her eagerness to consider surgery on Doug's eyes. Audrey and Denise meet, and Denise expresses her admiration for Steve.

Friday, March 28: Beverly volunteers to help Howie type his sales report.  The D.A. and Lt. Todd speculate as to where Polly might have obtained the pills she took to try to abort the child.

Monday March 31: Lee is released from the hospital; Lee urges Iris to continue working for him.

Tuesday, April 1: Phil tries to comfort Jessie.

Wednesday, April 2: Beverly pouts about being told her skirts are too short. Todd asks Steve if he knew Polly accused Phil of being the father.

Thursday, April 3: Steve and Tracy tell Douglas about the possibility of a corneal transplant.

Friday, April 4: At Phil's request, Steve urges Jessie to go visit her brother and rest; Phil loses his cool with Lt. Todd.