Share your thoughts on this short-lived but fascinating soap opera. And thanks to saynotoursoap, you can enjoy a promo for the show as well as the finale - probably my favorite soap finale.

5 hours ago, wonderwoman1951 said:

but, when bill bell took over as headwriter after ted’s death, irna took that as a personal betrayal and, according to bell, the two never spoke again. 

She really could hold a grudge, couldn't she? Yikes.

Was Susan Sarandon on SFT before or after this show? I think it was after, but I've seen conflicting dates.

She was on  Search in 1972-73. Jane Manning was her mother and Audrey Landers was her sister Connie

1 hour ago, amybrickwallace said:

She really could hold a grudge, couldn't she? Yikes.

Was Susan Sarandon on SFT before or after this show? I think it was after, but I've seen conflicting dates.

 

42 minutes ago, slick jones said:

She was on  Search in 1972-73. Jane Manning was her mother and Audrey Landers was her sister Connie

 

Thanks. I had thought it was later.

4 hours ago, amybrickwallace said:

She really could hold a grudge, couldn't she? Yikes.

indeed! but her relationship with bill bell was complicated. unlike agnes nixon, who was in philadelphia and worked with irna from a distance, bell sat at the card table in irna’s living room for almost 10 years. so she likely missed his company. 

and over those 10 years, he had provided a lot of support for irna with her children, with whom she had a difficult relationship. i also think irna may have thought of bell as something of a surrogate son. 

16 minutes ago, wonderwoman1951 said:

indeed! but her relationship with bill bell was complicated. unlike agnes nixon, who was in philadelphia and worked with irna from a distance, bell sat at the card table in irna’s living room for almost 10 years. so she likely missed his company. 

and over those 10 years, he had provided a lot of support for irna with her children, with whom she had a difficult relationship. i also think irna may have thought of bell as something of a surrogate son. 

Good points. In any case, it's sad.

10 hours ago, wonderwoman1951 said:

it’s been a while since i read ken corday’s memoir, but from what i remember, he said that it was irna who encouraged his father to create his own show. she is credited as a co-creator of days… i know there were some lawsuits filed over this (one, i think by her daughter, after irna’s death). i believe irna’s son is still receiving royalties. 

i also recall that when ted was diagnosed with cancer shortly after days… premiered, irna helped to take up the slack. but, when bill bell took over as headwriter after ted’s death, irna took that as a personal betrayal and, according to bell, the two never spoke again. 

I thought Irna wanted Bell at DOOL? Why did she feel betrayed?

20 minutes ago, allmc2008 said:

I thought Irna wanted Bell at DOOL? Why did she feel betrayed?

she felt betrayed when bill decided he couldn’t continue writing both days… and ‘world turns and chose days… 

from then on, she saw him as competition. there’s even a school of thought that she agreed to do ‘love is a many splendored thing’ because it was airing opposite days… and she (and fred silverman) thought liamst would destroy days… in the ratings. when that didn’t happen, irna left the show. 

Bill had been working with Irna for years on ATWT,AW and Our Private world.

He was approached by Ted Corday to take over Days. I don't believe he ever wrote for both shows concurrently. If he did, it would only be to see out a contract.

Ted had also worked with Irna for years and I'm not sure if their parting was amicable?

So understandably Irna was upset that Bill was leaving a working relationship that was satisfying to her. However, holding a grudge seems petty and short sighted.

Irna had several co writers over the years. Might be fun to start a list...

Edited August 24, 20214 yr by Paul Raven

23 minutes ago, Paul Raven said:

Ted had also worked with Irna for years and I'm not sure if their parting was amicable?

So understandably Irna was upset that Bill was leaving a working relationship that was satisfying to her. However, holding a grudge seems petty and short sighted.

if it were only a working relationship that bell was leaving, yes, irna’s grudge would be petty. but, as i noted about, there was also a longstanding personal relationship between bill and irna, so i’ve always felt that puts a different spoon on irna’s grudge. 

23 minutes ago, Paul Raven said:

He was approached by Ted Corday to take over Days. I don't believe he ever wrote for both shows concurrently. If he did, it would only be to see out a contract.

i had forgotten the details. i just looked at his oral history of television interview, where he talked about ted corday approaching him about days… bell talks about not being able to do 2 shows, days.. and guiding light. but, by that time, he was working with irna on ‘world turns. 

have to keep in mind that interview took place in 1998, and it’s pretty clear that bell was already deep into the alziheimer’s that would kill him in 2005. also going to reread ken corday’s memoir to see what he has to say. 

Phillips was financially making Bell money by co-creating Another World with him.  The Another World Homepage details that during this time Phillips and Bill Bell, along with Phillips' secretary Rose Cooperman, and Phillips' brother Arno were owners of Another World until 1967.  Phillips and the others licensed Another World to P&G and their ad agency, Young & Rubicam, during that time. This may be the first time a creator owned their own soap, even if it was temporary and in P&G's hands from the beginning.  The show’s official and legal agreement (dated 5/4/64) established that P&G Productions and Young & Rubicam would acquire rights to AW from Phillips and the others after 268 consecutive weeks.  They were paid $1,000/week royalties for the term of the agreement. A purchase price of $500,000 (over $4,000,000 in 2021 value) dated 4/10/67, to be paid in 11 annual installments between 1967 and 1977. Distribution: Irna Phillips – 39%. William Bell – 31%. Rose Cooperman 5%. Arno Phillips 25%.  So Phillips and Bell were making money on a show that they were not even writing anymore .  Agnes Nixon who was writing Another World in 1967 and made it a success was not included in the ownership deal.  

 

 

Edited August 24, 20214 yr by watson71

I saw some of the last few weeks of AWA, which I did not think was very good. I began watching after Julie (Dorothy Lyman) had testified in court against Patrice's boyfriend Tony and was evidently instrumental in his conviction, or so I gathered from what was said. Dorothy Lyman and Tom Ligon then connected, both of whom I liked very much, and I decided they were the couple I would watch the show for. They were written off in about two weeks!

I don't recall much about Tom Ligon's character, just that I liked the actor a lot. Dorothy Lyman's Julie was serious, thoughtful, fascinating, someone I would want to know in real life even if I didn't know much about her. Of course I would later see her comic ability as Opal (AMC), and her earlier Elly Jo (EON) was like an evil Opal. I could never quite figure out what Gwen Parrish was supposed to be like on AW, although Lyman was interesting and had good chemistry with Leon Russom. Lemay said in his book that Gwen was supposed to be a 1930s screwball heiress, something I did not get from his writing.

In many ways, Lyman's Julie on AWA is the performance I like best from her, the most realistic, not broadly or sometimes over broadly played like Elly Jo and Opal. Because she was good at comedy, she didn't get an opportunity later on to play a serious, complex dramatic character for an extended period of time.

As for the rest, Stephen Elliott was clearly a good character actor, and I was not at all surprised when the gifted Susan Sullivan and Susan Sarandon went on to be cast again and again. Susan Sullivan, like Judith Barcroft and Maeve McGuire, seems born to wealth, poise, and sophistication, and she was the perfect choice to follow Barcroft as Lenore on AW. I don't remember her storyline on AWA except that Stephen Elliott and Susan Sullivan were good together as father and daughter.

Sarandon may have been too old to play 17, but she was quite convincing as a strong-willed but naive young college student. Patrice was basically the girl from good family who gets in trouble (in both senses). Having a boyfriend who's part of a radical group, but like an update of a Secret Storm vibe. I didn't care at all about Patrice and Tony as a couple, but then I got to the party quite late. Tony had been sent to prison, where he volunteered for a medical experiment and soon died. So did the show. I doubt that many viewers found the "nice girl dates student radical" theme very interesting.

The other actors did not make much impression on me.

Susan Sarandon had a short-term role on SFT toward the conclusion of the storyline about Jo's hysterical blindness. Sam (Roy Shuman) had taken Jo to a cabin in the woods. A young hippie-ish couple called George and Sarah stayed there (I think; details are hazy) and perhaps accidentally (?) George shot Sam. Previously to Sam's death, for a lark, Sarah had wiped the cabin for fingerprints as she and George got ready to leave. They fled after George was killed, and Jo was left alone in the woods, blindly (literally) seeking help and almost falling off a cliff, and once found, having a very fishy-sounding story about two people who had left no trace behind.

 

I only got to see the last few weeks - not as much as Nicholas Blair.

The performers I liked were Kathleen Maguire (later on One Life to Live), Clifton Davis,  Jane White (The Edge of Night, Search for Tomorrow), and James Noble (As the World Turns, The Doctors).

Edited October 2, 20214 yr by danfling

Reposting some AWA photos and adding some new ones also.

47 minutes ago, Paul Raven said:

Reposting some AWA photos and adding some new ones also.

This one gets the Andrea Zuckerman award for awkward adult trying to pass as a teenager.

 

Question: Is Susan Sarandon one of Those Performers that denies her Soap Roots? I'm Pretty sure no one new her Before her Stints on AWA and SFT