On 1/6/2023 at 5:42 AM, victoria foxton said:

It boggles the mind that Harry O'Neill couldn't tell that Nikki was Viki with a really good wig. 🦗

 

OK I've gotten further into the Harry/Nikki story and have a better handle on how well Harry and Viki supposedly knew each other.  It really is ridiculous.  There could have an added dimension with Harry working for Viki's family's but never having met her up-close, with near misses between the two serving as mini-cliffhangers. 

It could have also added a socioeconomic class element - at least, I thought the O'Neals were supposed to be working-class, although by this point Harry's the company president, so maybe not.  I think I'm also confusing Harry with what I've read about the stories involving his brother(?), Pete—whom Nikki has already mentioned—and the character Lee Patterson returned to play in the '80s.  (Wasn't that character also part of a short-lived family with one or more daughters introduced as ingenues?)

While I'm on the subject, was "Lord Manning" supposed to be named after Irene's (maiden?) name?  Didn't Viki ever wonder why Victor named his company after her college roommate?

Edited January 14, 20233 yr by DeliaIrisFan

I thought that the company had become "Lord Manning" following the awarding of Todd's fortune to him.

Oh right, Manning was Todd's father's name.  The company was definitely called that in the '80s episodes when Harry was around and working there.  So did Irene marry Ted Clayton first (Tina had to be her eldest, if Todd was a college frat boy 15 years or so after Tina arrived?) and then a partner in Victor's company?

My understanding has always been that Victor Lord partnered with Peter Manning's father to create the Lord/Manning manufacturing business (because Harry et al pre-date Todd). Which is how Victoria became childhood friends with siblings Irene and Peter.  Then, Victor either purchased or established the newspaper business which became Victoria's primary interest.  So, the Lord fortune was from a conglomeration of companies. 

Irene conceived Tina, Todd, and Victor Jr with Victor (her consent was questionable).  Todd was adopted by Peter, and Victor was secretly raised by Irene (after she faked her death while married to the not fake Ted Clayton, who Tina thought was her father). 

The lore is that the character of Todd was established without a surname, he was just Frat Boy #2.  The Manning name was at first just a coincidence created to give a Todd a last for his trial.  Later, when the character became popular, and the writers wanted to establish more backstory and sympathy for Todd, it was established that he was abused son of Peter who was angry over raising his nephew.

But, while later writers continued to base stories on the Lord media companies, the manufacturing business was rarely mentioned.
 

Edited January 14, 20233 yr by j swift

49 minutes ago, j swift said:

My understanding has always been that Victor Lord partnered with Peter Manning's father to create the Lord/Manning manufacturing business (because Harry et al pre-date Todd). Which is how Victoria became childhood friends with siblings Irene and Peter.  Then, Victor either purchased or established the newspaper business which became Victoria's primary interest.  So, the Lord fortune was from a conglomeration of companies. 

Irene conceived Tina, Todd, and Victor Jr with Victor (her consent was questionable).  Todd was adopted by Peter, and Victor was secretly raised by Irene (after she faked her death while married to the not fake Ted Clayton, who Tina thought was her father). 

The lore is that the character of Todd was established without a surname, he was just Frat Boy #2.  The Manning name was at first just a coincidence created to give a Todd a last for his trial.  Later, when the character became popular, and the writers wanted to establish more backstory and sympathy for Todd, it was established that he was abused son of Peter who was angry over raising his half-brother, because Todd had been the son of Victor.

But, while later writers continued to base stories on the Lord media companies, the manufacturing business was rarely mentioned.
 

Ah.  That makes sense - kind of.  All the revisions over the years/decades got to be a bit convoluted - of course, I forgot to qualify when I referred to Peter Manning as Todd's "father."  Thanks.

Peter Manning was a cousin of Irene's. That she gave Todd too.

IIRC Peter was shown on screen around the time of Todd's trial and again during the Powell Lord III serial rapist story. 

So, I guess, it makes sense to write him as Tina's first cousin once removed because it skirts the issue of why Irene asked Vicky, (and not Peter and Bitsy) to care for Tina after her death. 

Either way, I always thought it was awfully nice of Victoria to be so welcoming and supportive of the Mannings and their children. I appreciate the ongoing character trait that on the heels of her Vicky/Niki mess she didn't stand in judgement of Todd and Tina.

Edited January 15, 20233 yr by j swift

Just as Tina and Todd were taken care of by others, Todd also had a sense of taking care of a less fortunate when he began caring for Eil and later (when he was leaving Llanview) asked Carlotta to care for Eli in his absence.

5 hours ago, danfling said:

Just as Tina and Todd were taken care of by others, Todd also had a sense of taking care of a less fortunate when he began caring for Eil and later (when he was leaving Llanview) asked Carlotta to care for Eli in his absence.

I thought Eli was one of those characters who disappeared before Todd left in 1998.

I do not know the year, but, as I remember, it was when Todd left the show for the first time.  He went to Ireland.    Eli had not been dropped from the cast yet, and Carlotta was asked by Todd to care for him in her home.

12 minutes ago, danfling said:

I do not know the year, but, as I remember, it was when Todd left the show for the first time.  He went to Ireland.    Eli had not been dropped from the cast yet, and Carlotta was asked by Todd to care for him in her home.

I'm pretty sure Eli was not on the show then; IIRC he was introduced by Claire Labine In '97, two years later. You may be thinking of Paloma.

Jon Hensley and Lara Parker appear in this episode. Tina's trial hearing began.

🦗

Edited January 20, 20233 yr by victoria foxton

Tina really shined and had chemistry with everyone. Looks like the writers were chem testing Brad and Tina. Ivan comparing Karen and Laurel to Holden Snyder. Interesting reveal with Guiletta. I wasn't expecting that. 

 

On 1/21/2023 at 4:23 PM, victoria foxton said:

Tina really shined and had chemistry with everyone. Looks like the writers were chem testing Brad and Tina. Ivan comparing Karen and Laurel to Holden Snyder. Interesting reveal with Guiletta. I wasn't expecting that. 

I think it was more than chem testing with Tina and Brad - from passing references in the scenes that have been posted, it sounds like Brad had been Tina's confidant since before Mitch showed up.  Supposedly Brad saw Tina going into the secret room months before anyone else discovered it.  Too bad those scenes seem to be lost.  I wonder if Brad was originally meant to be more involved in Tina's story and the direction changed because Roscoe Born was available and/or it was decided they couldn't go as far as to have Brad commit premeditated murder on-screen (let alone everything that followed with Mitch).

The two most recent episodes have to be out of sequence, at least I think?  Viki was being hypnotized at the end of the show on Thursday the 18th, and then she didn't even appear in what was ostensibly the next day's episode.  Unless it was a fakeout cliffhanger and the next time she appeared viewers learned that the hypnosis didn't take the first time and she's going to try again.

The Ivan story is so weird, and seemingly out of place in this (comparatively) grounded interlude of the Rauch era.  Jon Hensley was beautiful circa 1985 (and 2010, and probably now), so I can't really complain about him being scantily clad, or Rob in just those cutoff shorts.  But the shirtlessness for no reason just added another layer of silliness: like Passions had an '80s flashback episode featuring all the parents in town when they were teens.

Edited January 23, 20233 yr by DeliaIrisFan