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DRW50

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20 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

Thank you again. 

 

Yes, seeing this reminds me how much I adored Jill in these years - more because of Jess Walton's presence, but also because Bill Bell tapped into all the layers of Jill.

Very true. I felt like Bill Bell did this with Brenda too, but at some point around 1986 Brenda just decided to play Jill in a certain way and lost a lot of the complexity of the character. Jess initially brought it all back, but then eventually after the second divorce from John, I feel like Jill just became mostly angry and bitter all the time.

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Your welcome guys! :) 

I miss Jill being front and center so much. I know Jess is enjoying  being "semi-retired", but I can probably write so much for Jill to do then any of the writers the show's had for the last decade....

13 minutes ago, Soaplovers said:

Pretty Ashley is in these... how I wish she would be Ashley again (would be less expensive).

Brenda Epperson was just at Eric Braeden's 40th party and made a video of her being there. You can tell she would return in a heartbeat if they asked....Unfortunately they are too fixated on Eileen....no offense to her....

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21 minutes ago, YRfan23 said:

Your welcome guys! :) 

I miss Jill being front and center so much. I know Jess is enjoying  being "semi-retired", but I can probably write so much for Jill to do then any of the writers the show's had for the last decade....

Brenda Epperson was just at Eric Braeden's 40th party and made a video of her being there. You can tell she would return in a heartbeat if they asked....Unfortunately they are too fixated on Eileen....no offense to her....

Yeah even though I have said I always liked/preferred Eileen in the role, and even though I am not watching the current show anymore. I would love Brenda Epperson returning. Eileen has made it pretty clear she isn't staying on full time, so why not? I would tune in at least to see Brenda again. 

 

I always felt Bill Bell was going to make Jill into Kay. Even back in 1983 when Dina would point out Jill had started drinking during the day, and Jill's heart getting harder and her demeanour getting colder, plus her hatred of Nina and her meddelling in her sons lives. It just feels like she was on her way there. It would have been great if that is where the show took her, especially after Jeanne Cooper's passing. Having a scene after that where Jill looked into the mirror like Kay had back in 1974 and seen what her life had become, the transformation being complete, then have an All About Eve style story that was reminiscent of Jill coming to work for Kay, would have been brilliant.

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1 minute ago, will81 said:

Yeah even though I have said I always liked/preferred Eileen in the role, and even though I am not watching the current show anymore. I would love Brenda Epperson returning. Eileen has made it pretty clear she isn't staying on full time, so why not? I would tune in at least to see Brenda again. 

 

I always felt Bill Bell was going to make Jill into Kay. Even back in 1983 when Dina would point out Jill had started drinking during the day, and Jill's heart getting harder and her demeanour getting colder, plus her hatred of Nina and her meddelling in her sons lives. It just feels like she was on her way there. It would have been great if that is where the show took her, especially after Jeanne Cooper's passing. Having a scene after that where Jill looked into the mirror like Kay had back in 1974 and seen what her life had become, the transformation being complete, then have an All About Eve style story that was reminiscent of Jill coming to work for Kay, would have been brilliant.

I think it's been ever since Eileen has done both Y&R and Days they consider her this "superwoman" who can do anything, and to not have her on their show would be a "big deal" to them...it's so stupid and I personally feel they could have Brenda back anytime they wanted...not that the writing for her would be good or anything.

They definitely were grooming Jill to eventually "takeover" Katherine's place as the "head" of the town, just as I think the show was grooming Nina to be the next Jill given Jill's hatred for her and their own battles....I think a lot of that was squashed in the early/mid 2000's when they decided the Newmans would unfortunately always be the main family...

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1 minute ago, YRfan23 said:

I think it's been ever since Eileen has done both Y&R and Days they consider her this "superwoman" who can do anything, and to not have her on their show would be a "big deal" to them...it's so stupid and I personally feel they could have Brenda back anytime they wanted...not that the writing for her would be good or anything.

They definitely were grooming Jill to eventually "takeover" Katherine's place as the "head" of the town, just as I think the show was grooming Nina to be the next Jill given Jill's hatred for her and their own battles....I think a lot of that was squashed in the early/mid 2000's when they decided the Newmans would unfortunately always be the main family...

True, which is a shame. I think much of the show was lost because after Bell left, Victor started eating the show up. Bell had always used Victor very sparing in the 80's, a little more so in the 90's, but never so much that it became the Newman Family Show. Jill really did get lost in the 2000's. As so many others did. 

 

Has anyone seen these German dubbed episodes. Unless you know German or are a good lip reader, it is difficult to fully know what is being said, but you can generally still make stuff out. I am surprised how Victor is sometimes only on a couple days a week or is on a few days but isn't the sole focus (La Dickson was more front and centre back then, and Lauren and Paul were being used heaps)

 

Here are the vids. Episodes start from around Jan 10, 1986 and go to around Aug 29, 1986 with a few missing eps here and there. I know they showed through to 1988 in Germany, but can't find those. At the very least you can see what the main focus was and who was on and who wasn't really being used (Amy, Tyrone, Nathan etc...)

 

https://5c8781a5aaab4.site123.me

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I love both Brenda and Eileen.  Brenda was Ashley when I started watching so I see her as the "real" Ashley, but as much as I'd love her back on, if Eileen as the original and an excellent actress is willing to play the role on and off, it's hard to justify dropping her.  It's not like if they brought Ashley back full time she would have a good storyline anyway.  Brenda would make a fabulous Kristen Forrester though.

 

I've been watching the German episodes.  I finally got to see the Shawn/Lauren story that way (which was disappointing other than the acting and production values). Currently up to where Jill has been shot.  I do understand the basics of the language, and I use the auto translate into English on YouTube which helps with the harder words, so I get the gist.  The woman who does Kay's voice is fabulous, lol.  She sounds so much like her.  I really wish that there were more.  I really want to see 1987.  

Edited by BoldRestless

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4 minutes ago, BoldRestless said:

I love both Brenda and Eileen.  Brenda was Ashley when I started watching so I see her as the "real" Ashley, but as much as I'd love her back on, if Eileen as the original and an excellent actress is willing to play the role on and off, it's hard to justify dropping her.  It's not like if they brought Ashley back full time she would have a good storyline anyway.  Brenda would make a fabulous Kristen Forrester though.

 

I've been watching the German episodes.  I finally got to see the Shawn/Lauren story that way (which was disappointing other than the acting and production values). Currently up to where Jill has been shot.  I do understand the basics of the language, and I use the auto translate into English on YouTube which helps with the harder words, so I get the gist.  The woman who does Kay's voice is fabulous, lol.  She sounds so much like her.  I really wish that there were more.  I really want to see 1987.  

Yeah I would love to get the 1987 eps as well, even the German dubs, they were online many years ago, but I couldn't save them. The production values for the Lauren/Shawn story were great. They really pumped some money into that story. I'll admit it wasn't as exciting as I think it was supposed to be, but I still enjoyed it.

 

It is quite frustrating though to see a triangle between Nathan/Amy/Tryone, but have those characters barely on together. They seem to get about one episode a month, even though Amy is featured, she is mostly supporting Lauren/Paul.

 

Also interesting how Dina and Lindsey disappeared once the Abbott Divorce story ended. Neither seemed to get a send off. In fact it feels like Bell only kept Lindsey on for that long to wrap up the divorce story. Brock also vanishes once Phillip goes to stay with Kay (which makes sense)

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1 minute ago, will81 said:

Yeah I would love to get the 1987 eps as well, even the German dubs, they were online many years ago, but I couldn't save them. The production values for the Lauren/Shawn story were great. They really pumped some money into that story. I'll admit it wasn't as exciting as I think it was supposed to be, but I still enjoyed it.

 

 

Lauren just kept doing so many stupid things.  Bill Bell usually wrote smarter than that.  And the climax with Andy and Paul finding them and then that story not even being on the next day was sooo irritating.   

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46 minutes ago, will81 said:

True, which is a shame. I think much of the show was lost because after Bell left, Victor started eating the show up. Bell had always used Victor very sparing in the 80's, a little more so in the 90's, but never so much that it became the Newman Family Show. Jill really did get lost in the 2000's. As so many others did. 

 

Has anyone seen these German dubbed episodes. Unless you know German or are a good lip reader, it is difficult to fully know what is being said, but you can generally still make stuff out. I am surprised how Victor is sometimes only on a couple days a week or is on a few days but isn't the sole focus (La Dickson was more front and centre back then, and Lauren and Paul were being used heaps)

 

Here are the vids. Episodes start from around Jan 10, 1986 and go to around Aug 29, 1986 with a few missing eps here and there. I know they showed through to 1988 in Germany, but can't find those. At the very least you can see what the main focus was and who was on and who wasn't really being used (Amy, Tyrone, Nathan etc...)

 

https://5c8781a5aaab4.site123.me

The Newmans definitely became more prominent in the 90's and led many stories, but they should not have taken over the show completely. I think the balance was pretty good up until the time Heather Tom left, and they decided that Nick and Sharon should be leading the next generation of Newman stories....of course we've had nothing but the same stories year after year of Nick being an overgrown frat boy, and them dismantling Sharon,  Nikki is mostly a glorified prop to support Victor, Victoria is a wet blanket,while Victor has been written OTT and OOC for over a decade....ok he's a little better now, but I can't forget all the terrible writing they forced upon us with the Newmans, while phasing out most of the other vets.

Edited by YRfan23

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6 minutes ago, BoldRestless said:

 

Lauren just kept doing so many stupid things.  Bill Bell usually wrote smarter than that.  And the climax with Andy and Paul finding them and then that story not even being on the next day was sooo irritating.   

True, I also wish the scene on the pier with Turk and Shawn hadn't been so quick. They find Shawn and then boom over within a few seconds. More of a fight and even chase would have been good. I will say though, the March episodes where we have a mix of the climax of both Lauren/Shawn and the Jill/John stories was pretty awesome to watch. Just from a production stand point. The fire sequence was great and I was surprised they went all the way with it.

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I might be wrong to say this, but I think Bill Bell was never all that great with the more "action" like events the show did....It's not a bad thing, but I can't argue other soaps did those type of scenes better. Bill was more of a psychological soap writer, playing out all the emotional beats until the climax,  which is why a lot of later writers ruined the show trying to make it like every other soap. 

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2 minutes ago, YRfan23 said:

The Newmans definitely became more prominent in the 90's and led many stories, but they should not have taken over the show completely. I think the balance was pretty good up until the time Heather Tom left, and they decided that Nick and Sharon should be leading the next generation of Newman stories....of course we've had nothing but the same stories year after year of Nick being an overgrown frat boy, and them dismantling Sharon, while Victor has been written OTT and OOC for over a decade....ok he's a little better now, but I can't forget all the terrible writing they forced upon us with the Newmans, while phasing out most of the other vets.

Agreed. There was much more balance in the 90's with the Newman's. I would say Nick being aged up was where things changed, but no too much. He did become more of a focal point, but not so much at the expense of the rest of the show. The fact that in the 90's you still had Sheila/Lauren and Nina/David as well as Jill having her stories and bringing in the Winters/Barbers. There was still a lot going on that had nothing or little to do with either The Abbott's or Newman's.

 

I always got the feeling Bill Bell learned his lesson from making JLB's Lorie too important and too much the star of the show. He seemed to never do that again, even if he did have favourite characters he liked front and centre.

1 minute ago, YRfan23 said:

I might be wrong to say this, but I think Bill Bell was never all that great with the more "action" like events the show did....It's not a bad thing, but I can't argue other soaps did those type of scenes better. Bill was more of a psychological soap writer, playing out all the emotional beats until the climax,  which is why a lot of later writers ruined the show trying to make it like every other soap. 

I do agree though. The mob stories in 83 and 85 were okay but not spectacular. The whole reason I love Y&R is the pscyhology of the characters, it was fascinating to see what they would do next, how they would react to certain situations etc...

 

There is a great scene when John had a heart attack after an arguement with Victor. Nikki rips through him for what has happened, but you can tell Nikki is really raging about so many other things under the surface that she hasn't been able to express. Add to that Victor refuses to back down, but you can tell Nikki is making him feel guilty, an emotion he would rarely if ever admit to. This was always the beauty of Y&R, so much going on beneath the surface.

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34 minutes ago, will81 said:

Agreed. There was much more balance in the 90's with the Newman's. I would say Nick being aged up was where things changed, but no too much. He did become more of a focal point, but not so much at the expense of the rest of the show. The fact that in the 90's you still had Sheila/Lauren and Nina/David as well as Jill having her stories and bringing in the Winters/Barbers. There was still a lot going on that had nothing or little to do with either The Abbott's or Newman's.

 

I always got the feeling Bill Bell learned his lesson from making JLB's Lorie too important and too much the star of the show. He seemed to never do that again, even if he did have favourite characters he liked front and centre.

I do agree though. The mob stories in 83 and 85 were okay but not spectacular. The whole reason I love Y&R is the pscyhology of the characters, it was fascinating to see what they would do next, how they would react to certain situations etc...

 

There is a great scene when John had a heart attack after an arguement with Victor. Nikki rips through him for what has happened, but you can tell Nikki is really raging about so many other things under the surface that she hasn't been able to express. Add to that Victor refuses to back down, but you can tell Nikki is making him feel guilty, an emotion he would rarely if ever admit to. This was always the beauty of Y&R, so much going on beneath the surface.


Yeah It always boiled down to the emotions of the characters and how they played off of one another...that seemed to build up the tension and bring it to the surface, then fizzle it out when needed, if that makes sense...it's part of the DNA of Bill Bell's Y&R!

Thanks for that @yrfan1983! I've never seen that promo! Man to actually see more of those episodes!

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