As The World Turns Discussion Thread

[vetsoapfan]

I do hope the writers chosen will be up to the task of adult, layered, nuanced writing.

Some of the names announced so far fill me with unease and/or foreboding, but I hope I am proven wrong and there ends up being quality writing involved.

[MarlandFan]

Every single character on YR and BB is either upper-middle class or filthy rich.  They are dressed to the nines and with not a hair out of place.  It's completely unrealistic and unrelatable.  Viewers don't want yet another soap that shows excess and corporate takeover storylines.  We want a soap about real people struggling with real problems.  I'll be tuning in to "The Gates" but I'm worried it will be more of the same.  Glam, Botox, and name brand clothes.  

[Mitch64]

Even the name sounds like its a "Real Housewives" show..not a soap.  It would have been interesting for them to center this in an urban neighborhood going through gentrification and show the push and pull with a multiethnic cast. 

[vetsoapfan]

From the promotional material available so far, BTG does appear to be focused on glam, high fashion, gaudy excess, and at least one petulant vixen with an attitude problem. It might be an advertising ploy, however, to attract a certain type of audience (fans of over-the-top 1980s' soaps and todays "Housewife" nightmares). TPTB tend to underestimate the intelligence of the audience, and dumb down everything to the lowest-common denominator.

The actual show may be much deeper than the shallow images we are being given so far.

I am hoping for the best, but if it ends up being slap-fights, tiaras, tantrums and glitz, without real and meaningful human characters and storylines, I think many people are weary of seeing that sort of show, and yet another one will be a hard sell.

I would prefer that as well: having a solid mixture of haves and have nots, with a multi-ethnic and realistic-looking group of actors, dealing with identifiable issues.

I guess we will soon see what the show turns out to be.

Fingers crossed.

The more successful this show is, the better it will bode for the future of daytime soaps.

I'm jaded from decades of mismanagement by the executives, but I really do want this show to be a winner.

[Reverend Ruthledge]

I think too much damage has been done to the genre and to the human race to ever have what we consider quality soap opera ever again. 

[vetsoapfan]

Intellectually and rationally, I have to agree.

What we HOPE for, and what we believe will actually happen, do not always align, alas.

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[DRW50]

I think there is a wallowing in unreality now that affects all forms of entertainment. You look at The Substance, which was hyped based on a cautionary tale of wanting to remain young and beautiful, but most of the talk ended up being about how hot the actresses were. You look at SNL, a show that for many years had a large number of "normal" looking cast members, but in the last 10-15 years increasingly is populated by attractive, slim figures. Then there's Ozempic and Ozempic brothers and sisters, which have dangerous side effects and are meant to be used with caution, being pushed on everyone to help "prove" that if you don't have six-pack abs and a nonexistent waist, you are just a lazy pig. 

The move to HD also seemed to put more of an end to a grittiness or reality anywhere on TV. 

ATWT always had its share of glamorous figures, even in its earliest years, but there was a sense of the everyday and an emotional weight.

I'm not really expecting anything out of Beyond the Gates - as soon as I heard Guza, Ron Carlivati, etc. were involved I checked out mentally - but I would like to believe the show can capture some of those elements and won't just end up choking on more camp or going the way of Tyler Perry's shows. 

[Vee]

BTG is Michele Val Jean's baby. Guza is a co-writer and Ron Carlivati is a staff writer. I don't really think it's fair to judge her brainchild according to the white men working under her, though I personally think Guza in particular has his merits.

Edited January 4 by Vee

[adrnyc]

This discussion probably best belongs in the Beyond the Gates thread but, since it's happening here...an article from Entertainment Weekly.

The most relevant quote from it as to what to expect: 

“We wanted to have a show on the air that spoke to a different side of the Black experience,” Val Jean tells Entertainment Weekly over a joint Zoom with Ducksworth. “Not the downtrodden, not the ghettoized. We wanted to show rich, Black people doing messy things.”

 

“I've long been fascinated with showing the side that we haven't seen a lot of,” says Ducksworth. “In these Maryland suburbs, there were some of the most affluent African American counties in all of America. So looking at that and the wealth of everything at Howard University, I felt that this was an area that was ripe for the picking. You get the upstairs, the downstairs of it all. It's true to life."

Personally, my best friend has family who lives in one of those suburban Maryland Black gated communities which I've visited many times. And it's something no soap has ever shown before. Sounds quite interesting to me!

 

 https://ew.com/beyond-the-gates-first-black-daytime-soap-preview-exclusive-8752814

[DRW50]

It may not be fair, but I see those names and I get a lot of soap PTSD, even if they are just driving cars. 

As said above, I know it's probably best left for another thread.

Edited January 4 by DRW50

[MarlandFan]

I'm all for showing previously unshown portions of the Black experience, but why can't we have a soap that focuses on several different classes at the same time?  I agree; I'm also not interested in seeing the "ghettoized" (Val Jean's term) -- but what about the middle class?  Educated, professional people who are struggling to make ends meet (like most of us) and who are dealing with relatable problems.  I remember when "The Bold and the Beautiful" began -- the show focused on a wealthy family and a lower middle class family.  It was far more interesting than the version we have today where EVERYONE has designer clothes and never worries about paying rent.

[adrnyc]

I completely understand your point of view. I haven't been reading the actual BTG thread yet because the show hasn't started and I'm sure many people feel similar. But, for me...I'm lower middle class and have trouble paying rent. I don't want to watch other people do the same.  

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 I want to see rich people in designer clothes slapping each other over being betrayed!

I can't remember who posted it on this forum...it was years ago...but their description of what they want from a soap explained to me what I loved about the genre: "OTT villains and women who wear hats to the office."

I've been watching B&B from the beginning on its official YouTube channel and they dropped the lower middle class people pretty quickly. Within 18 months, the mother, the father, the grandmother, and Katie and Storm Logan disappeared along with Rocco and Brooke's original boyfriend. Like Dynasty before it, the show realized people wanted to see the rich people in the mansion in gorgeous clothes. I joked to my husband, "It's like they finally realized the show was called 'The Bold and the Beautiful,' not 'The Hesitant and the Homely.'" 

[wonderwoman1951]

this OTT phenomenon began in the early 80s, with the ascent of primetime soaps — dallas, and in particular, dynasty — that coincided with the ‘luke and laura’ juggernaut. 

but soaps had already been around for 30+ years — something that get often gets lost in the shuffle. soap fans of a certain age:) remember  — and pine — the time when soaps focused on intimate interpersonal relationships between and among family and friends — rather ordinary people familiar to many viewers.

here and there some of that slack has been taken up in primetime and streaming. i’ll have a look at ‘behind the gates’ if only to see tamara tunie, but, and i’m paraphrasing here, i have to agree with the poster above who said that in daytime, that ship as sailed  

 

[adrnyc]

As I said to a poster above, I completely see and respect your point of view. I, myself, was born in '72 so grew up on the 80s daytime and nighttime soaps. That must be where I get my love of the OTT.

My best friend watches Emmerdale and loves how grounded and poor many of the characters are with just regular jobs. At the time he said that to me, I was re-watching Another World (was probably '89-'90 or somewhere in there,) and I said to him, "See, I'm the exact opposite. If Felicia Gallant wasn't a rich romance author, how could she possibly wear all those gorgeous hats and gloves, and own those fabulous purses??!!" 

[wonderwoman1951]

not so much about economic status or class, what i miss is soaps with characters grounded in reality and emotional authenticity.

apple tv+ opened their vault over the weekend and i watched ‘shrinking’. the characters were largely well-educated, extremely well-paid professionals. but the relationships between and among the characters were grounded in familiar and relatable emotional conflicts — parent and child, spouses, friends, colleagues. 

would be nice if ‘behind the gates’ is at least emotionally grounded, but i’m not holding my breath.