Dallas 2.0: Discussion Thread

Nah, I refuse to believe VP never will come back under any circumstances. Everyone has a price. Just ask Lisa Rinna.

For one thing, it isn't Leonard Katzman's misogynistic version of DALLAS anymore, where the women (and everyone else) play second fiddle to Bobby and J.R. or else.

Edited June 15, 201213 yr by Khan

I don't think Dallas cam meet VP's price as she is quite wealthy. If she were to do it it would be for vanity. I wish she would because her departure was a crippling loss the show never recovered from.

Nah, I refuse to believe VP never will come back under any circumstances. Everyone has a price. Just ask Lisa Rinna.

For one thing, it isn't Leonard Katzman's misogynistic version of DALLAS anymore, where the women (and everyone else) play second fiddle to Bobby and J.R. or else.

I don'tknow the Dallas politics well enough,but in that same oral history Linda and Larry both went on and on about how Katzman *made* Dallas, and the tv movies suffered because of him. (Of course Linda also mentions how glad she is a woman is running the show now).

Years ago, I read an interview with Linda Gray (right around the time, I think, she was starting MODELS, INC.) where she stated (and I'm paraphrasing) how she fought hard to change the ingrained, "boys' club" mentality that pervaded, especially where her character was concerned; and how, to that end, Lenny Katzman was changing ever-so-slightly and allowing Sue Ellen to have more power on the show. Of course, this was after VP and Pam had left, so she never benefitted from any of this evolution.

Edited June 15, 201213 yr by Khan

The truth is, though, DALLAS was exceedingly male-driven, which is why I tended to prefer KNOTS LANDING, a show that I saw as being more equal in terms of attitudes toward male and female characters.

Just one of many reasons I prefered Knots. Dallas probably was though the most male-centric or "masculine" of the major primetime soaps--even in the way pretentious gender studies and media studies students use the terms masculine vs feminie storytelling, as well as literal.

What is so wrong with being male driven? Knots was female driven, Falcon Crest was female driven, Dynasty was male and female driven equally but probably more female..why must every show be female driven and why is it just assumed that female > male?

What is so wrong with being male driven? Knots was female driven, Falcon Crest was female driven, Dynasty was male and female driven equally but probably more female..why must every show be female driven and why is it just assumed that female > male?

I think the problem with "male driven" shows is that it tends to throw women under the bus, so to speak. On women driven shows, the men still hold their own and have the opportunity to shine and truly have "equal" status, but on shows like Dallas and today, General Hospital, they are treated as props and the whole nature of it comes off as rather misogynistic. I never really watched Dallas all that much, so forgive me if my assumption is baseless, but from shows that I've seen that have a male driven enviroment, that is how it has always come off to me.

Initially Dallas had JR and Pam as equals, but then it became all about JR's smirking and chuckling and how he kept women in their place. It's one of the reasons I didn't enjoy the show as much as many do...that and Larry Hagman is just too unsympathetic an actor for me to enjoy.

I think the problem with "male driven" shows is that it tends to throw women under the bus, so to speak. On women driven shows, the men still hold their own and have the opportunity to shine and truly have "equal" status, but on shows like Dallas and today, General Hospital, they are treated as props and the whole nature of it comes off as rather misogynistic. I never really watched Dallas all that much, so forgive me if my assumption is baseless, but from shows that I've seen that have a male driven enviroment, that is how it has always come off to me.

As male as Dallas was, no one outshined Sue Ellen and Pam. They were two of the most central figures on the show, the entire series was initially looking at the Ewings through Pam's eyes. i always see blather about strong women this and strong women that, but no one remembers really Sue Ellen from her so-called strong woman days because those days were deadly dull. She was a much more interesting character as a weak drunk than she was a lingerie mogul of some company nobody cared about. And the fact she was weak didn't take away from Donna being strong. Donna was rich and powerful in her own right, but for the most part was dull. Pam wasn't rich but she was powerful because she had moral integrity and could not be corrupted or conquered by any man on the show. They were not superior to Sue Ellen though, because her boozing and cheating were part of what made her great, not the shoulder pad wearing mini tycoon years.

I don't think it is a given that strong women are more interesting than weak women any more than strong men are more interesting than weak men. In Dracula, after Dracula the marquee role is his slave, Renfield. Soaps had enough Alexises and shows starring female JRs, Dallas was the one show where the guys got equal time.

What is so wrong with being male driven? Knots was female driven, Falcon Crest was female driven, Dynasty was male and female driven equally but probably more female..why must every show be female driven and why is it just assumed that female > male?

Did I say there was anything particularly wrong with it? It was an observation....

There are a few false notes, notably Jesse Metcalf and whoever the bland actress is whose playing his wife...Metcalf is just so weak and fake and terrible in every role he does. There are scores of actors who would have done better in the role, although it takes a lot of charisma to take a 'good guy' character places. See Duffy, Patrick. He wrote the book on it.

I like Jordana Brewster and Josh Henderson, I buy them as 'Pam' and 'JR' like characters.

See i don't get this given that JH & JB were awful, and Metcalfe was the better of the younger cast. JH tried way too hard and it showed

Ha we'll just have to disagree. I thought JM was harmless at best, and embarassing when he was meant to be angry.

See i don't get this given that JH & JB were awful, and Metcalfe was the better of the younger cast. JH tried way too hard and it showed

I only saw the first episode and thought JM did well. I didnt think anyone was awful

This show needs a bigger cast. Cant beleive there's only 4 characters in the younger set and then a huge gap to the 50/60s crowd. I wish there was representation in the 30s/40s group and possibly more outside just the Ewing clan.

How many episodes is season 1 or "Year 14"?

Agree with the complaints about the opening. I wish they had put some cast shots in there bc as it stands, it looks rather bland. Dallas had such an iconic opening so Im glad they at least kept the music

Edited June 15, 201213 yr by Cheap21

See, as a woman who is positively sick over what Daytime has done to female characters, Dallas doesn't bother me AT ALL. We are talking Texas and oil...exactly what power were the women going to have? Pam held her own just fine against JR and Sue Ellen had a fork for a tongue. Miss Ellie held it down! I would not have wanted a thing to change.

ANDREA