Even on SB, my favorite storyline during JFP's tenure as sole EP was foisted on her by the network (the Cruz/Robert/Eden triangle). If you looked at the other stories during that time, they were an absolute storytelling mess even if the dialogue were often first rate. I think she's overrated in terms of storytelling and plotting.  As someone said earlier in this thread said, she got a lot of credit for what Robert Calhoun had already set in motion at GL. I think JFP worked best as a director and editor. 

Pamela Long is just as odd and slippery when it comes to answering questions about her time on GL and SB. I was not there for most of her pre-1988 GL tenure, but even I know that some of her comments are ridiculous (particular about the Bauers). She also has the same selective amnesia that JFP suffers from. It would be nice if these producers/headwriters would admit mistakes and explain why they made the mistakes. Instead, they just double down or pretend they have no idea what the interviewer is asking.

 

I wonder if any of these incoming producers ,upon arrival, asked cast and crew for feedback on what had or had not been working. Surely a useful tool when trying to settle in to a new environment.

Obviously there would be varying opinions but there might be common concerns that could be acted upon.

The only time I have ever read of something like this was Pat Falken Smith, upon returning to Days after 5 or so years asked Bill Hayes (and possibly others) for feedback on what they thought of the show in her absence.

 

7 hours ago, bboy875 said:

She was not credited as HW in 1990, she was an associate headwriter under Pam Long. Near the end of 1990, James E. Reilly's name appeared under Long's, and then the soap mags announced that Long was gone as HW, and Curlee, Demorest and Reilly were named HW trio. Their first credited episode should have been the beginning of 1991

Btw, when Curlee and Demorest were promoted, I believe he was script editor, which he was listed as when the team won the writing Emmy in 1990 

Thank you for the correction about 1990. For the record IMDB.com has this correctly. Wikipedia does not. Not a shock, of course. Rife with errors & the dickens to try to get a correction made. 

5 hours ago, P.J. said:

LOL...too true. But in saying that Mo would have to have amnesia, I implied that you couldn't write Mo going along with it. OTOH, I thought it would be completely in character for Roger to allow Michelle to believe Mo had died, no matter what kind of "feeling" he had for the child.

It was hard enough for the writers to justify Reva and Vanessa allowing their families to believe they were dead. 

Yes, I knew what you meant at the time. I even wondered if this should be a topic, ONLY ON SOAPS, I mean. Another example instantly springs to mind. Truly no other place do you see, who would you most want to see brought back from the dead next.

19 hours ago, Contessa Donatella said:

HOLLYWOOD HEIGHTS was a limited release 80 episode, based on a telenova, that played on Nick at Night, I think, that she did after she was fired off of Y&R. June to Oct. 2012.

  No Y&R was after Hollywood Heights. She brought Melissa Ordway and Robert Adamson onto Y&R from HH.

7 minutes ago, Paul Raven said:

  No Y&R was after Hollywood Heights. She brought Melissa Ordway and Robert Adamson onto Y&R from HH.

Okay, thanks for that clarification. Got the order all mixed up. So Y&R was the last thing she's done. And, it's looking like it will remain her last swan song. Retirement, I imagine she hates it. Couldn't happen to a more deserving "suit". It's funny it seems to me that some people here have talked themselves into a place where they've softened on Jill. Before they were ready to ride her out on the rails. Now they're saying things like, she maybe wasn't so bad. Sorry but she was so bad.

It's not only that she is incapable of leaving the writing alone. More than that she makes poor decisions. You can't look at a Robt Calhoun & Jill with the same lens. He doesn't lie to himself. He sees things clearly. He of course could make a mistake, anyone could, but he is less likely to. She, whether it's ego or like Goutman it's hubris, decides wrong over & over again. The people who hire her like that she's ruthless. But, for whatever reasons, she begins & seems to be doing well but she can't maintain, never does. Starts out saving money but ends up she's spent far too much. 

One of the worst of our generation. Right up there with Brian Frons, Susan D. Lee, MADD, they have their not so tidy piles of destruction. When I saw her being compared to Conboy, Wheeler, Kobe, etc. I knew we had lost our way. If you look at her total path of destruction you see she is playing a high stakes game. Someone was questioning how she ended up at AW ... that, in 95 was when P&G played musical chairs with the EPs where Laurie Caso got left out in the cold.

16 hours ago, P.J. said:

*Sigh*  the show should've let Vanessa keep her dignity and let her walk out on Matt for x, y or z reason. Bill could've stayed with Josh and occasionally visited Mom in Europe.

Or do what ATWT did...give her a stroke and send her to rehab. Everyone knows she is alive and they could have played the same beats (Matt pining away, Nola trying to hook him up, Dinah lost without her punching bag, Bill angry) until they talked her into returning. At least we wouldn't have those dumb scenes of made up backstory like "Rember, Mother always said..." or the worst, "We would read poetry to each other every night," (uh, Matt, no one earth ever did that, least of all you and least of all  Vanessa..I can see her wanting her own space to read a historical biography but reading poety with her boring placid husband???) Even if they wanted to give her that stupid soap disease, she would have got everyone together, and said, "I am dying, and I am going off so you don't have to see me suffer, please don't look for me." She would have enough money to hide herself away.

 

12 hours ago, chrisml said:

Pamela Long is just as odd and slippery when it comes to answering questions about her time on GL and SB. I was not there for most of her pre-1988 GL tenure, but even I know that some of her comments are ridiculous (particular about the Bauers). She also has the same selective amnesia that JFP suffers from. It would be nice if these producers/headwriters would admit mistakes and explain why they made the mistakes. Instead, they just double down or pretend they have no idea what the interviewer is asking.

 

That interview she did years ago with that fawning fan boy was really bad..and I like her. When questioned about the Bauers she denies she did anything to obscure them and then said that if she did her coheadwriter whats his face who was terrible, would have stopped her as he was a "GL history expert."  This was the guy who wrote the crappy Bert memorial episodes. I would just love to hear a real version of what happened in 85, as she really did write well for the Bauers and the Reardons even as the show changed.

16 minutes ago, Mitch64 said:

Or do what ATWT did...give her a stroke and send her to rehab. Everyone knows she is alive and they could have played the same beats (Matt pining away, Nola trying to hook him up, Dinah lost without her punching bag, Bill angry) until they talked her into returning. At least we wouldn't have those dumb scenes of made up backstory like "Rember, Mother always said..." or the worst, "We would read poetry to each other every night," (uh, Matt, no one earth ever did that, least of all you and least of all  Vanessa..I can see her wanting her own space to read a historical biography but reading poety with her boring placid husband???) Even if they wanted to give her that stupid soap disease, she would have got everyone together, and said, "I am dying, and I am going off so you don't have to see me suffer, please don't look for me." She would have enough money to hide herself away.

 

That interview she did years ago with that fawning fan boy was really bad..and I like her. When questioned about the Bauers she denies she did anything to obscure them and then said that if she did her coheadwriter whats his face who was terrible, would have stopped her as he was a "GL history expert."  This was the guy who wrote the crappy Bert memorial episodes. I would just love to hear a real version of what happened in 85, as she really did write well for the Bauers and the Reardons even as the show changed.

I want to interject here that I am loving this discussion. Hooray for the constructive criticisms! And, some of the unintended humor is a real delight. Plus, some of these people did do good things. Pam Long, when Beverlee needed a job created Alexandra for her. How remarkable is it that we got to have that actress playing that character?!!!

20 hours ago, Mitch64 said:

What was the quote from JFP when Curlee left..."Now we can do things MY way!" That tells you all you need to know about where the quality came from.

 

When and where was that quote? It doesn't even make sense. I'm certain you can't dig that up because it never happened! lol I thought JFP dictated everything? That quote implies that Curlee was running the show. Which is it? 

So much misinformation posted the last few days. Even those who post the most contradict themselves and get confused between facts and gossip. It's entertaining but not factual.

I've heard that quote before too, although I don't feel like tracking it down, if I even could.

10 minutes ago, TEdgeofNight said:

When and where was that quote? It doesn't even make sense. I'm certain you can't dig that up because it never happened! lol I thought JFP dictated everything? That quote implies that Curlee was running the show. Which is it? 

Why the f*ck would I bother or care enough to make a quote up? 

Typically headwriters write..(with constant interference that is true) and execs produce.  Curlee I am sure had enough clout at that time to at least push back on somethings...maybe not big things (she lost out on saving Maureen) but she had t totally different percpective the JFP, who wanted to move the show over as Deas as the lead, focus on the Coopers and 5ht Street, and over the top characters screaming, and away from kitchen scenes etc. Why do you think JFP hired that Douglas whatshisface as headwriter after Curlee, etc. Did you notice a change in the show then?

Now this person who is known for taking digs at me is referring to misinformation and we know that I made such a hideous error in reversing the order Jill did that stupid Hollywood Heights and the more substantial Y&R. Obviously an error of such huge proportions that soap opera history may need to stop today to be recalculated. 

Okay, I tried but it's just too funny. 

40 minutes ago, Mitch64 said:

Why the f*ck would I bother or care enough to make a quote up? 

Typically headwriters write..(with constant interference that is true) and execs produce.  Curlee I am sure had enough clout at that time to at least push back on somethings...maybe not big things (she lost out on saving Maureen) but she had t totally different percpective the JFP, who wanted to move the show over as Deas as the lead, focus on the Coopers and 5ht Street, and over the top characters screaming, and away from kitchen scenes etc. Why do you think JFP hired that Douglas whatshisface as headwriter after Curlee, etc. Did you notice a change in the show then?

I didn’t say you made up the quote. I asked for a source. 
For the record, JFP and Nancy Curlee are friends to this day. Facts matter.

16 hours ago, kalbir said:

@slick jones You forgot Joe Willmore and Michael Laibson in the EP list.

As far as I'm concerned the only good EPs GL had in its final 30 years were Allen Potter and Robert Calhoun.

I think Michael Laibson would've been good for the show, too, but by that time, PGP was just interfering too much with their shows.  (Plus, he didn't have the most inspired HW's.)

I apologize if this has been posted before, but it's always fun to see a Clarence promo. I'm also fascinated that it's catering to people who used to watch Santa Barbara at 3, as opposed to trying to pick up any General Hospital fans. I guess CBS figured one step at a time.