Guiding Light Discussion Thread

[alwaysAMC]

LOL - my mind was looking for a 'Cole' in Reva's long name, and of course that's the actor's name instead. I guess 7 unique husbands, and a couple she married twice, which gets her to 9?  

Hahaha - true, could be. Hopefully/surely she somehow audited her beloved character's name before publishing.

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LOL - and good on Lucci for being smart there.   

Ahhh - what a teaser!  I'll be sure to let you know  

 Ugh, I hate to hear this!   

[DRW50]

There's a 1997 promo somewhere of Annie vs. Reva which ends with Reva throwing her purse across the room. IIRC, from what soap magazines at the time said, that was not an actual scene but was (allegedly) a real confrontation which somehow got into a promo. 

I do wish Wheeler had moved faster - maybe that was as fast as she could go, or maybe she took for granted that they would stay on. I know the show probably couldn't have improved drastically, but I do wish they'd had one year, and Irna's babies could have ended at the same time. 

I have already spent enough years comparing the GL and ATWT finales, but I agree. As someone who quit watching GL in disgust around the early/mid '00s the show did remind of its old self at the end. ATWT's ending was an extended Goutman ego trip. One show had a poignant death of a character whose passing was long overdue...one slaughtered a vibrant young man so we could get James Rehborn (wonderful as he was) playing chess for homophobes. 

The Grant Aleksander interview I posted a few weeks ago had him talking about learning GL was canceled because Ron Raines called him at Home Depot. He said they knew it was probably going to happen, but that believing something will happen and it actually happening are very different. 

Edited 14 hours ago by DRW50

[alwaysAMC]

Oh wow - I must see this promo!  Anyone have a copy/link to it? I can't believe they 'accidentally' did that, and if so, I wonder if someone got in trouble haha.

Kim did mention in Chapter 1 that the 'suits' dangled some hopeful carrots for a long time, saying they would pitch the show and try and get it on another network or online somehow where it would be cheaper. They even heard rumors that Lifetime would pick it up, so it gave some folks hope for a little while, but sadly nothing came of it. Kim said she was already resolved that it would never go anywhere and she had peace of mind about that shortly after the announcement.

[DRW50]

Forbes also likely got the primetime career Zimmer wanted - never a huge star, admittedly, but a stalwart, able to dip in and out when she saw fit and generally not paying an industry price. Zimmer felt extremely hurt by her lack of success after leaving GL and even more hurt when JFP made it clear GL had moved on from Reva. (JFP, self-sabotaging as ever, soon made it clear that was not actually the case, but with a stronger producer, GL could have genuinely moved on from Reva)

That's interesting. I suppose that's what they always say, and there was some precedent as Passions had moved to Direct TV. I guess Passions being canned so fast (faster than many expected, I think) put a big nail in the coffin. And we haven't had any revivals or moves since that have worked, even though Neighbours came close. 

I'll try to find that promo.

Edited 14 hours ago by DRW50

[chrisml]

And Kim Zimmer also gave interviews where she admitted to some of her behavior and she apologized for it. I give her credit for admitting her wrongdoing and taking responsibility because other actresses would not have done that. 

BTW, I will miss John Payne from your avatar.

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JFP's GL post-1993 may have needed Kim Zimmer to try to salvage the mess that was made of the show (and that turned out to be another disaster), but GL post Zimmer's departure was fantastic. Forbes showed GL didn't need Zimmer as well. I also think Santa Barbara didn't help her ego either since Sydney Penny got the attention, and most SB viewers loathed Zimmer's Jodie character. To be fair, I think a big part of the problem was the writing and the producing, but since Zimmer thinks Rauch is such a genius, that's on her.

Edited 14 hours ago by chrisml

[DRW50]

I posted this a few weeks ago but it's worth popping up again as Grant does get asked about return rumors, that Paul Rauch had tried to get the show revived for years but P&G just would not sell it.

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[DRW50]

I'll miss him too (still can't believe those were actual publicity photos - Joe Breen must have had a coronary), but he won't be gone forever. 

Rauch did well at making people feel they were important (as long as they were willing to play along). That's probably why Erika Slezak loved him (he also gave her better story than he gave Zimmer). I think Kim has a certain amount of self-awareness but also needed to feel like she was the big star and desperately needed by the show. Wheeler was clearly incapable of expressing that. 

[P.J.]

Wow...I did not realize Ellen Parker took over the role of Mo so soon after Bert's passing.

[alwaysAMC]

I’m up to September 4, 1996.

Roger paper mache’d and painted a creepy human head of himself, put it in his bed at the loony bin, and escaped! LOL - that was campy. But sadly he got caught and thrown back in. Then he escaped again, and so the merry go round goes.

Ok now another mysterious person showed up, without showing his face, to mentor Zachary and help him repair the lighthouse. Is this another angel? His voice sounds like the deeper one that was speaking to Phillip on the docks a month or two ago.  Zachary is becoming a pesky little fly, showing up everywhere and getting into everyone’s business haha.

Ugh, my girl Bridget is now getting way too desperate over Hart. Out of nowhere, she’s fallen back in love with him and now she’s working to split up Dinah/Hart, but in a very desperate way. She needs to find her confidence and backbone ASAP.

We’re starting to see more of Bill, finally. He’s being a typical teenager, beefing with Matt, now that he learned about his past with Amanda in Malibu. Michelle is being nice to Bill now that J pissed her off. Bill is a lifeguard now and it was very nice/cute of J to pretend like he’s drowning so Bill could rescue him and prove himself for the job. This new J is much better and more likable than Pilgrim’s version.

Griffin survived the assassination attempt, but is still in the hospital and someone is framing Vivian as the shooter by putting the gun in her car. Ok.

Beth has now decided to officially divorce Phillip since he won’t come home and quit his vendetta against the A. Spaulding in question. Beth being off camera (and me not knowing her) really makes this fall flat unfortunately. When writing Phillip’s return, I wonder if they tried to get the actress back but couldn’t?

Rick and Abby are just realizing they both are interested in each other and it’s very sweet. They just had their first picnic date in the park and Rick was very sweet to her. I’m nervous for how Abby will react to Rick being the father of one of Blake’s baby though - she doesn’t handle stress well haha. I do commend O’Leary and Budig for learning and using so much sign language throughout the year with Abby.

The Vanessa storyline - what a sucker punch. Be patient, but here are my running thoughts throughout this wild ride, and imagine me saying “Vanessa, what are you doing?” after each episode:

Oh noooo. Vanessa just had a secret MRI and oh my gosh, the results aren’t great. How sad this is to hear the news she will end up in a vegetative state within the next few weeks/months for years and not remember her family due to some incurable disease in the brain. This is devastating. Maeve is doing such a great job and I love how Nola is there first to console her. Great scenes between Vanessa and Nola throughout. Now she’s contemplating suicide and Zachary is talking her out of it.  So very sad. Ugh, now she’s starting to go blind and won’t tell Matt anything. This is all so quick! She’s being so stubborn not telling anyone or asking for help. Now she just wrecked her car (twice!), and is stranded unconscious in a ditch, but alas here is Zachary to help again. Now she wants to pretend like she died in the car fire!  Vanessa, what is wrong with you haha. Is she always this bullheaded and not willing to show weakness to her loved ones? Roger happened to stumble across the wreck too and hear Vanessa and Zachary talking, so I’m curious how he’ll use that against her or if he’ll be the one to spill the beans somehow.  Ugh, now her entire family has shown up to the wreck site devastated, agonizing over it and attempting/risking their lives to get into the fiery wreck to save her, all while Vanessa is watching on the sidelines. That’s a bit cruel, Vanessa!  Wait, now Aug 30 and everyone in Springfield is being told she died and they identified the body, which is heartbreaking, but Vanessa is still with Zachary… so did she really die and is an angel now or WTF is going on? Ok now Roger just saw the news in a newspaper and said to himself that Vanessa is actually alive, phew. And now she’s shown up at the airport dressed as a nun while Zachary confronts Roger, who is pretending to be a pilot while evading the loony bin wards/police.  Now Zachary magically convinced Roger to give up his gun and turn himself in, and just as he’s being taken out of the airport, with Dinah and Frank right there, he sees Vanessa amongst a gaggle of nuns, surprising everyone by saying that, but she is able to get on the plane unseen and now everyone thinks Roger is scum and even crazier than before. So Vanessa, what are you doing??

@P.J., I know you’re a huge Vanessa fan, what did you think of this storyline - and others, how did you and the audience feel about this storyline? How did Maeve feel about this storyline?

[DeeVee]

Not only that, I never realized they had ever shown Tony and Annabelle's kid. I assume those scenes were Bea's swan song.

Even though these episodes are now in a period when I had been watching the show regularly, I noticed this viewing a wildly obvious shift in tone from episodes broadcast a few months before. It puzzled me until I noticed Pam Long was no longer listed as head writer, only Jeff Ryder.

I gotta say, it's jarring how much certain characters--mostly women--have suddenly changed. It's like a demon took over Claire's body since she gave birth. Reva and Roxy are so manic it's hard to watch them. I think this is when Reva started to really annoy me. I could take her or leave her before. 

Don't even get me started on how stupid Alex has become. I don't think DNA tests were easily available quite yet, but that she accepted Simon without thoroughly investigating the story he told her about his mother is unbelievable, even though she is vulnerable because of Lujack's death.

Whatever flaws Long had, she did write women as much more complex and believable. 

[kalbir]

So Kim Zimmer had beef with a rookie in both her original run and her return run.

1987 Kim Zimmer was 32 and Michelle Forbes was 22. 1995 Kim Zimmer was 40 and Cynthia Watros was 27.

Aging star having her shine stolen by a rookie 10 years younger and a rookie 13 years younger, not surprised there was beef.

I wonder if there was any beef between Kim Zimmer and Beverlee McKinsey.

[P.J.]

Having skipped through it, I hadn't realized that was Tony and Annabelle's baby either.

I'm not fond of this Reva story either. Sorry, it's tough for me to believe Reva would jump into the river because Kyle left her. (Although, it was kind of ironic having her find out Hawk had been paid to come to town, much like she'd been paid to come to town and break up Billy and Vanessa.) 

1986 is suddenly revolving about strangers. Calla and Jessie, Simon, Maeve, Jackson. Yikes.

Whatever Kim's ego, I have to believe she respected vets. And they arrived at around the same time. Neither was taking the other's airtime.

[P.J.]

I rewatched these episodes---they broke my heart. Somehow, Nola had seen Vanessa leave the hospital, and follows her home, and Maeve just lets out this primal scream---chills went down my spine. And knowing the history between them---never quite liking the other and always getting on each other's nerves (to put it mildly)---makes it a much richer to have them put it all aside in the moment and be family to each other.

I've never seen/heard what Maeve thought of the story itself, but she did want a break, so it's not like she was fired and then brought back.

Yes, Vanessa could be this stubborn and unwilling to ask for help. She'd pretty much always been an "I can do this on my own" type of woman, although when she first came to town, she would still run to Henry. But after she met Billy, she stopped relying on her father. It's part of the reason she (briefly) got addicted to pills after Bill's birth---she was determined to take care of him all by herself and became obsessed with the idea she was the only one who could. Of course, nothing before to this extreme.

I should say, there's no way (IMO) they could've told this story---Vanessa letting her loved ones thinking she'd died---if her father Henry had still been alive. She never would've been able to do that to him. And it does chafe that she's letting Bill believe it, when her mantra had been all about protecting him since the day he was born.

I honestly don't recall what I thought about it at the time. But now I'm thrilled she's free of Matt at least. LOL.

Edited 5 hours ago by P.J.

[DRW50]

I can't fully remember, but I don't think they tried to get Beth Chamberlin back. I think Laibson/McTavish likely saw Beth as old news and wanted to move Philip on; either that or have her return only when Philip was closely tied to a new woman.

Thanks as always for these recaps. I think I had stopped watching around this time and mostly kept up by reading in the soap magazines.

Bridget's degradation was horrible to watch, as the character had grown so much over the years and was clearly regressed just to be a foil for a "hot" couple viewers had zero investment in. 

Edited 5 hours ago by DRW50

[DeeVee]

Beverlee was on a whole other level from Kim. It's not like they were in competition with each other.

I get the feeling that Kim had a slight problem with the super-professional, serious cast members who just wanted everyone to be prepared and do the work, as she seems to like having fun on set. (She's made a few cracks about Chris Bernau being like that). Bev was definitely one of those. But they didn't work together that much.

Yeah, they made her manic and also much weaker. She always had a vulnerability, but wanting to kill herself over that guy? No way. Not only that, he didn't leave her! She insisted he marry Maeve.

When they did the tribute to Bert/Charita, the compilation of scenes with her showed how much the cast had been almost totally turned over in a relatively short period of time. Nearly every shot was of her by herself because most people she had worked with had been fired, left or been replaced. I assume they couldn't show her with people who hadn't been replaced, like Don Stewart, Elvera Roussel, or Robert Newman because they would have had to pay them for using their clips.

It's dreadful to watch. Like she had no connection to the current show.

Edited 21 minutes ago by DeeVee