Y&R: Gay SL's STILL are coming!

[Y&RWorldTurner]

God, Maria Arena Bell, has no damn shame with her lies and manipulations. This woman and her hack writing team need to be fired now.

5/27/09 http://tvguide.ca/Soaps/Features/Articles/090526_maria_arena_bell_NB

8/31/09 http://tvguide.ca/Soaps/Nelson_Ratings/Articles/090831_soapgeist_NB.htm

Yes, and we all saw the "multiple" gay stories they had planned and how they "explored" Phillip and Rafe as characters.

Lies, Lies, all Lies....

[DRW50]

These "stories" were very bad in several ways. They set up homosexuality as shock value, as weird, or damaged, yet, they never explored any of what it's like for someone who is gay, or what homophobia is like. Instead, everyone just cut that part of the story short by saying, "Oh we have no problem with you being gay," which made Phillip look like a loser, and which took away one of the few interesting story threads between Adam and Victor.

In this show's world, homosexuality only exists so we can see how it affects straight characters.

I don't know why they had to con viewers this way. They got so much hype from the press, telling us all about how Y&R was going to do what no other soap had done, and what do we get?

I'm just so tired of the cowardice, and of these shows wanting it both ways.

[bellcurve]

LOL. Are you for real?

"IF" we are going by Adam being straight, then why in the world would he talk about his fling with Rafe to anyone? That makes no sense to me.

And yes, alphanguy, I guess there will be no anointment for you, huh?

[DRW50]

[MarkH]

You are right. I think everyone on the planet realizes we were either hoodwinked, or the show is so poorly planned that they can't deliver on initial promises, or the execs are so heavy-handed that they're not allowed to complete any one their starts. (I know you'll roll your eyes at the last one, but I suspect there is an evil suit in the mix, somewhere).

My guess is that the ultimate truth is some combination of all three.

But why drag this out and pick at poor alphan's scabs? Even he realizes how sh!tty this regime is by now? Do you just need to hear him say it and admit he was wrong? And if he does, what then?

I mean, there is no joy in universal agreement that the Titanic has hit the iceberg, is there?

[DRW50]

I don't have a problem with alphanguy wanting to be optimistic about gay stories. I'm responding more to what Bierdz said, and then also because of some of the "This story never worked because Thom can't act!" defense I still see posted at some places like DC.

I don't really believe that network suits got to Y&R. I think they planned these stories all along to have no real impact other than shock value. The Phillip story was rushed through -- there really was nothing that was dropped. It was wrapped at breakneck speed. The Rafe/Adam story, from the very start, was extremely undeveloped, random, and treated Rafe as nothing other than a plot device.

I saw nothing in those stories that really suggested they were going to have legs. So much, like Chance being gay, or Phillip/Rafe being together, was wishful thinking.

[Y&RWorldTurner]

These storylines are written months in advance. And with the Otalia craze on GL, the Nuke craze on ATWT, and the Kish craze on OLTL, I find it very hard to believe Barbara Bloom or anyone at CBS or Sony vetoed this. Maria and her hack writing team obviously couldn't and didn't know how to deliver on their promises.

Hey, I believe in karma and after the "anointing" his feet comment, it was too juicy to pass up. I'm not going to lie.

But this thread needed to be followed up on (you know, like how the hack writing team DIDN'T followup on Phillip III's return story), and the potpourri thread or the episode thread was not going to do the failure of the "gay storyline" on this show any justice.

[bellcurve]

WHAAAAAT?!

Women in the midwest are not THAT cosmopolitan and open-minded. Even the ones who have went to college and have traveled. I'm sorry, but that's just not so.

Adam would be keeping this secret from her and from everyone else. If she asked him about it, he would flat out deny it. Adam would never VOLUNTEER that information.

God, are people who write this crap really THAT arrogant to assume that people would just buy this conversation as a reality? It's almost laughable.

Especially since the Episode Thread is ONLY about the Episode discussion, and never about how hot Scott Reeves was or how "daddy"-esque Doug Davidson is..

[DRW50]

I think that perhaps she is supposed to see him as struggling, or vulnerable, and that the whole thing was a mistake, and she's touched that he told her this secret. I don't really know. It makes no sense to me. The story is so ridiculous as it is, and chemistry-free, they should just go totally tasteless and have him work to get Sharon to "turn" him.

[MarkH]

LOL! Jokes aside, I'm really eager to hear from Caston and Alphanguy on this one. I mean, they're both reasonable guys, and I'm eager to see how they feel about this cumulative misrepresentation.

I NEVER believed (after Engen was recast) that Rafe and Adam was going anywhere. But I DID believe that they would slowly develop Rafe. I seriously thought maybe Rafe and Estella would move from recurring and anchor a new family.

Why go out in the press and claim you'll be doing gay stories? Why?

Oh, you thought so too, eh?

[alphanguy74]

I suppose not. God forbid I'd believe such a direct statement as "We are totally committed to telling gay stories". Now kiss my ass.

[DRW50]

Mark, why not go to the press and say this? It's part of the MAB pattern. She gets ALL the credit and NONE of the blame. Even those of us who don't think she's good at her job end up blaming other people more, although I put that down to her incompetence, not her being some crusader who is ignored by the suits.

I think they never had any real interest in developing these characters. I think they truly believed that they were being brave by not having the "typical coming out story", as they sneered at. I think they thought that having homosexuality as a plot device, as something glossed over, was much more bold.

[MarkH]

Wow, that smarts. Gosh, I wish she'd just be honest about what happened. Which picks up Carl's point:

I really get the feeling that something derailed. Why would she outright say "we will have gay stories" and then have none? It makes no sense.

She may not have had it planned out, but she must have had some idea where it was headed...or which individuals she'd chemistry test.

So, since that didn't happen, I'm guessing that something intervened. And I'm guessing it could also be a multi-causal thing: (1) Numbers started trending down, and they got scared; (2) Viewers HATED both the Adam thing and the P3 'I faked my death to hide my gayness--even though my mother and grandmother are tolerant gay divas'--so they got scared; (3) Thom did have acting limitations (that he himself has publically apologized for), and so they changed their minds about hanging a story on his back; and (4) CBS is definitely getting more gay-skittish...Nuke is pretty much chaste, Otalia was not allowed to kiss. Otalia was apparently a NETWORK (not P&G or EW thing).

I'd sure love to know. Sylph says (I paraphrase) "don't wonder...the important point is that it was always sh!t...", but I really see a disintegration here that I want to understand better.

The sad subtext in Alphanguy's response is that he no longer can trust MAB. That's a SERIOUS mistake for a regime to make.

[Vee]

I'm not defending Y&R's conduct but I fail to see the point of bumping all these threads solely to bully one another. That's why this one was bumped, after all.

[Y&RWorldTurner]

Mark, this was the same woman that told Nelson and the magazines in May that the summer would be filled with romance, characters that hadn't been used in forever, more balance, and more fun. Was it honestly any of those things? I don't think so...

This woman lies and then uses sh!t like "Bill Bell is watching over my shoulders" to try and calm her audience down. Also remember her claims that the outlandishness of the LML era would be gone? I honestly think the show has gotten more outlandish.