Scott Hamner Says Y&R Is NOT Doing A Gay Story

[bellcurve]

Nope. They had their chance. There's no need to give them a chance to redeem themselves Brad Bell style and do three-six months a year of great, subpar, climaxing stories.

Yep. You have.

[Vee]

No, Maria Arena Bell is a proven coward. Or hypocrite, or executive, or politician. They backed out of gay material. That's cowardly, but it's not proof of lying all along. I think they'd planned to do some kind of big story with Phillip the Woolly Mammoth, they certainly had a big enough PR push. I also think they've backed away from it.

Who at Y&R sullied Chris Engen's reputation? You're alleging a conspiracy with Bell where none exists. No one at the show came out and said he left over the gay material, but no one came out and said he didn't either, or that it was not a major factor. I'm not excusing Y&R's lame storytelling with 'the gays' but that doesn't change that a 'phobe is a 'phobe is a 'phobe. I can be annoyed with both Bell and Engen at once. It is not an issue of taking sides with Chris Engen versus Maria Bell and bad storytelling, because I don't think he cared about "bad storytelling." People have built this kid up into some great social figurehead representing all the ills of the Maria Bell regime when in fact it seems he mostly left because he worried about having to get intimate with another guy. Chris Engen is the Manchurian Candidate for y'all. I'm saying, find someone else.

I've already called Y&R's "gay" storytelling bad, but cara mia's post is just as OTT and silly as anything in the Adam/Rafe story. These people may be incompetent, or they may be backbiting, or they may be both at once sometimes, but it's not like they're Darth Vader and his cronies. They're not that bright or devious or evil. It's just daytime television. They were stupid. They did not sit in the Death Star plotting to destroy Chris Engen's life and make over the show into a gay hive of scum and villainy.

You've never found me cheerleading the MAB regime. I gave the Y&R storylines with Phillip and Adam an open mind, and they flopped. They were lame. But blowing it up into a meta-issue with Chris Engen and 'refusing to play gay' as a symbol of creative freedom under a disliked regime offends me, and I will always object to that characterization of this situation.

[alphanguy74]

I don't think I'm asleep. Here's the reason I'm wondering about this: Hamner HAD to know about the interview that Maria gave Branco, and the amount of Pimping out to the gay press that Gellman, Muhney, and especially Bierdz did. This IS SOW wer'e talking about. If it were a news source that didn't take things out of context and twist semantics on a weekly basis to make things sound more dramatic and tittilating, then I wouldn't be wondering... but you can understand, can't you? Something isn't adding up here, after I think about it. Cause if Hamner truly KNEW what Maria said, and then she marched out Muhney, Gellman, and Bierdz to ramp up publicity.... then his statement would be tantamount to calling his boss a liar, wouldn't it? If he was referring to ONLY Adam/Rafe, then that WOULD mesh with what Maria said all along (That Adam/Rafe is not the gay story, not the endgame, etc.) That comment that Alvin posted that LED UP to Hamner's quote did NOT come out of Hamner's mouth... it came from someone at SOW. So here's the question... is this columnist at SOW making assumptions about Hamner's quote, reaching for stuff to cause controversy? It's possible. Something is just off here. Or else, Hamner is a moron and just got himself in trouble by making his boss look like a lying, manipulative bitch. If they changed their minds and backed out due to viewer outrage, then why didn't Hamner just SAY SO? Saying this really makes Maria look like a liar..... and most people who want to keep their jobs don't do such things to their boss.

[Y&RWorldTurner]

Hamner was giving fall previews, he knows about all of the upcoming storylines, and he clearly stated nothing involving a gay storyline was going to be explored, and nothing in the fall previews invovled any gay character or gay romance either.

Maria knows what she was doing, she's the one that sent Hamner to give previews and interviews to the press.

Maria clearly changed her mind about doing any gay storyline or she was just lying all along to get the attention of the gay media.

If there was any gay storyline coming up, surely Hamner would have stated it in the previews he gave the magazines...

You honestly think they would admit that?

And how do we know Maria isn't a liar? Have you seen any indication of a gay storyline being built up to on this show? I sure haven't.

[cara mia]

Vee are you Nelson Branco? Cause that's the only excuse I can come up with for your continued vilification of someone based on NO real evidence. The truth is no one knows for sure why Engen quit. All we know is that he said he's not a homophobe and ED & EB backed up that he left because the general dark nature of the character. Branco, clearly being fed spin by PR & MAB, painted CE as a homophobe on no real evidence. Branco admitted that he even lied about the kiss (so as not to ruin a plot point -- GMAFB at that malarkey) and MAB has been proven to be a liar many times over as well as a cheat (NP). My point is that people deserve the benefit of the doubt UNTIL it is proven that they don't deserve it. CE may or may not be a homophobe -- I don't know. But there is no clear evidence that he is and plenty of evidence that he was dismayed by the writing for Adam in general. My goodness -- the character burned a fetus in the fireplace! Why wouldn't he consider leaving? He said MAB only gave him one meeting. Isn't is possible that he wanted to understand what the hell was going on with the writing and the motivations for Adam and that MAB, being the hack that she is, could not answer his questions? KSJ is also on record about being unhappy about the writing. Why is it so hard to accept creative differences as the real crux of the problem? That's just as valid a theory as closet homophobia. People should not be accused of something as despicable as homophobia or racism without real evidence.

On the other hand, there is NO evidence that MAB "intended" to do a real gay story. There is plenty of evidence that she is a lying liar who lies. Who cares if TB is not a hit with the viewers? A gay story was promised. No one likes Tyra but she had TWO romances, including one with her f*cking nephew! Billy & Mac is made of epic fail but they got a romance. Even stupid Esther got a romance with David Leisure. And where is the great fanbase for Glo & Jeff? Folks hate them but they got a love story. And what about Deacon? He abuses Amber and we have to endure them getting intimate onscreen and now he is "rewarded" with a turn at Vicky! There is NO F*CKING EXCUSE for not giving P3 a romance. It could be lame and chaste and boring (like all the Y&R "romances") but it should still happen. I don't care if TB can't act. He's not the only lousy actor on this show!

[alphanguy74]

We don't know that, Alvin.... I realize that, believe me. It just makes no sense from a public relations standpoint to court the gay press, all the while never having ANY intention of coming up with the goods... and then ADMITTING in the press that "ha-ha we never had any intention of doing this, screw y'all!" It seems beyond the pale of fool-hardiness, don't you think? If they backed out due to viewer outrage, one would THINK Maria and Co. would rather been seen as cowards as opposed to manipulative liars, don't you think?

[Y&RWorldTurner]

I think this was their way of doing damage control, so they can say they didn't lead the audience into wanting the gay storyline they initially promised them. This way, they don't have to deliver on anything, since they came out and admitted to the press that they're not doing a gay storyline.

I think Kenny at DR summed it up nicely by saying this:

[Vee]

Would that I were for his salary. No, I am not Branco and I don't like Branco's brand of so-called "journalism." That doesn't change the fact that he's right sometimes. It killed me when he scooped Andrea Evans' exit from OLTL last year.

No real evidence? This story was not only picked up by Branco. It got out there from somewhere.

We can go around and around on conspiracy theories and valid complaints about the show, but I think there's room for those complaints, executive incompetence, and a bigoted actor in the middle of it all. Based on what I heard from a number of sources, I believe the Chris Engen story. Holding him and his supposed refusal to play the material as a banner in this endless debate over Y&R is what offends me, because I think it sends the wrong message and trivializes not only GLBT representation issues, but also the larger complaints about Y&R. The implication is if that you agree Y&R is a mess you must back Engen's quitting, and while I do think the show is a mess, I do not back him. And I think that there's just as much presumption in your tall tale of Chris Engen leaving as the leader of La Resistance as there is in my supposed 'presumption.'

As for Scott Hamner, he would never dare go out there and say "we backed off on the gays." No show is going to openly admit that. But he's all but done that by lying about their original intent. Bell practically got a tonguebath from Branco over the big re-introduction of Phillip III, and now there's nothing. They backed off because Y&R, the great "ornate couch" as I call it, is still behind the times and locked in a somewhat reactionary, '70s/'80s shock-value mindset when it comes to certain social issues.

[bellcurve]

Steve Kent and Barbara Bloom just need to take a page out of the New World "Book of Playing Dirty" and force the Bells(especially Maria) out of Y&R, or into a fancy co-EP title that means nothing.

Being Head-Writer of a TV Show is not a vehicle for your society luncheons or political career. She's a pathetic excuse of a "writer" and a woman. She wants to tout about her vision, but instead of taking responsibility for it when the time comes, she opts for the Barbara Walters Softballs while her equally talentless male Co-Heads take the heat in all the Diane Saywer-like interviews.

I hate this lady. I hate her story ideas, her ego, I hate what she's done to daytime's #1 show, and everything about her. Sylph has often accused Lethal of "hating" Y&R. I think Maria(and to a certain degree, Brad), hate daytime television, hence them undermining their audience and their inability to see beyond the two weeks they frantically and horribly plot before their tennis games and trips to Rodeo Drive. Why else do you explain the Bell Shows, both coming from a legacy of rich, interesting history, being trashed for the sake of cheap thrills and laughs?

Do they really believe their audience is a bunch of mindless, unemployed people? That's the only explanation for the inanity behind what's going on. Truly pathetic.

[Scryber96]

This regime can't remember what they write on their own show from day to day--do you really expect them to remember who said what to which press outlet?

[cara mia]

Where is the viewer outrage? People hated Rafe/Adam because of the recast, the bad writing and the general stupidity of the story. Adam can manipulate Victor easily but he has to resort to sex to trick Rafe? That's just stupid. Adam should have been playing on Rafe's feelings for him for a longtime and been genuinely trapped, i.e. caught red-handed before he felt that he had to sleep with Rafe. Anyway, what does that have to do with P3?! Just because Radam sank like the Titanic, doesn't mean that TPTB can't do a decent story for P3. First off, P3 is actually gay and not pretending! Second, he's not a psycho or a killer or the victim of being recasted beyond recognition. Even if Rafe is too young for him, why not bring on someone for P3? MAB brings on new characters every other day! Hell, steal from OLTL and bring on a gay cop investigating the "Art" thing and pair him with P3. It's not rocket science and it's not a big deal. One of the many reasons I refuse to drop the Engen issue is because MAB & Company refuse to see the failure of Radam is due to a revolt against NuAdam (the actor and the crazy writing) and NOT a revolt against a gay story. If TPTB had two licks of common sense they would have brought on Chance as a conflicted gay soldier (just like Fish on OLTL), paired him with a proudly out Rafe and thrown Adam in as the spoiler -- who led Rafe on for a good long while before (if ever) having sex with him. Chance & Rafe could have been HUGE! People want to see a good angsty gay love story between two actual gays. People also want to see young hot men (no offense to TB). How is that OLTL can do this so very well but TIIC at Y&R don't even know their asses from their elbows?

[Vee]

MARY! Seriously, did she kill your cat and rape your son? Or vice versa? I mean, the show is bad, but really now.

[cara mia]

If MAB wrote Jews the way she writes women, she would rightly be accused of anti-Semitism. The woman is a liar, a cheat and a misogynist.

[alphanguy74]

Vee... thanks, I NEEDED a laugh right about now. BADLY. Now... ALVIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I went over to daytime royalty and read for myself, seems both YOU and KENNY are reaching a bit. You came over here and posted Hamner's quote... and you conveniently left of the last sentence of his quote, which is making my theory look much more likely:

"And, at this point, I don't see a future for Rafe and Adam."

Now, when I read THAT... it makes me think he WAS referring specifically to Rafe/Adam when he said they never had any intention of a gay SL.

[DRW50]

Yes. I don't think LML hated Y&R so much as she was apathetic about anything which didn't go along with what she wanted. She certainly didn't seem to hate characters like Nikki, who are a cornerstone of Y&R.

I do sense a very strange hatred towards everything that made Y&R the #1 show. Vets, female characters, black people, business stories, respect for history, slow, intelligent pacing. On and on.