Y&R: Episodes discussion., Week of July 6

[Juliajms]

And even if it was who cares? Nina being pissed is not a reason to kill yourself or fake your death. Especially since Nina was not exactly innocent. She basically tricked Phillip into getting her pregnant, even if he did fall for her later...or not. Few woman will hear the news that their husband is gay and be accepting of it. Personally I would be out for blood (at first) due to the betrayal aspect of it, but finding out that he faked his own death to get away from you and the son he admits to resenting is much, much worse. Sometimes you have to be honest with people and take the anger you have coming to you instead of wimping out.

[BadZoe]

I think it is more, "it seemed like a good idea at the time". It's a flimsy excuse for leaving town permanently let alone faking death and letting an impostor come in to illegitimize your son. The least they could have done is write that P3 left town with a lover. A lover who he saw come out to his family only to be rejected, and maybe even beaten, by members of his family. This would also make a lot more sense if they didn't have Cane and P3 working together, but rather that Cane saw P3 for who he was, drugged him, took his blood and stole his life. Something, anything to add some credibility to this ridiculous re-write.

[Juliajms]

I've accepted that nothing can do that (for me). The Cane/Delia aspect of it was completely unbelievable as well, but I'm just going to hold my nose at the rewrites and hope that some of the performances make watching this story worthwhile.

[sheilaforever]

Due to work overload - even during the weekend - I have barely entered into this week's episodes of Y&R and come only to the Phillip III return-reveal.

SOme comments on that: Thom Bierdz is not hlaf as bad as I thought he would be upon reading many posts here. Compared to his original stint on Y&R he's on par; his line delivery is kind of stiff but this has become a trademark of "young" Phillip for me.

THis is a great twist and the concept why Phillip faked his death is growing on me. I understand that many find him being gay as the trigger moment appaling and everyone has his/her right for it but in the context that this happened not 5, not 10, not 15 but 20 years ago in a conservative midwestern town so I can totally buy it. It also completely fits Phillip, so had enough neurotocisms for a handfull of people, was so shy, so passive and completely thrown by decicision made by other people like Jill, Kay and especially NINA a flight from Genoa CIty would have seemed a logic and ONLY escape for him.

In a nutshell: I like the story so far but fear that MAB & team are gonna skip the beats and won't milk this HUGE (in a Y&R-historic context) story to what it's worth. Janice Ferri Esser though has so far excelled in fabulous scripts for the Chancellors. Same goes for Tricia Cast who has been beyond devine. Give her the Emmy STAT.

[brimike]

YES.

YES!!!!

I hope the answer to this is also "YES!!!!!"

[DRW50]

I think it would make more sense if they had just focused on Phillip faking his death because he couldn't take the rest of his life being micromanaged by domineering, feuding women. The part about being gay seems like an afterthought.

I don't know if they will have him say, "I should have come out, look how selfish I was," because that would make him seem like a drama queen and also deflate the idea that homosexuality is something shocking. If the focus turns to, "Why was this a big deal?" then the big grand scale the show wants may be lessened.

[brimike]

But it WAS a big deal back then.

It's amazing to me how many people aren't understanding 1989 vs. 2009. A LOT has changed in those twenty years. If the point of this story is to prove how much it ISN'T a big deal like it was then? Then WOW, that's an amazing point to make when all is said and done.

[DRW50]

Yes, but some of the posts have been saying, "It never would have mattered to Katherine, or to Jill, so he faked his own death for nothing."

If they play it this way then they will lessen the theme that it was a big deal back then.

I think it would have been something of a big deal to them, especially since Katherine's only experience with same-sex attraction had her deciding it was unnatural, but I still wish they hadn't had him leave for reasons of homosexuality. I think there was so much they could have explored in his history with Nina that now won't be. Of course for all I know if they hadn't had him come back as gay they would have said he faked his death because he couldn't be with Cricket.

[cara mia]

The show is being dishonest about the characters or (more likely) making plot more important than character. Would Jill or Kay care that P3 was gay? No. Only Nina would, and you can't blame her because she was married to P3 and the mother of his child. Having P3 hide because of Nina, and Nina alone, makes sense. Jill or Kay? Not so much.

You know who *should* be irate & horrible to his child if they were gay? Victor. No way, no how, will I ever believe that Victor would be genuinely tolerant of a gay child. If anything Adam should know that, and should flaunt his relationship with Rafe (sincere or not) in front of Victor just to get his goat.

[BadZoe]

Victoria said the same thing herself, he expects his children to be married and have at least two children and one preferably being male.

[Cashton]

i do hope Phillip calls out Nina for trapping him into marriage. Nina got Phillip PASSED OUT DRUNK - and sexed him up on a chair. She had to do nasty, dirty things to him while PASSED OUT to get Phillip to...well you know. That's pretty sick too. All the women used Phillip in some way - Jill used Phillip to gain status, Kay used Phillip as a weapon against Jill and Nina used Phillip - period.

I wish they'd bring some of this up, cause in reality - the women did deserve it, sorta. Chance should hate his mother just as much as he'll hate his father. Pinning it all on Phillip being gay and unhappy is PART of the reason. These women did some horrible stuff to Phillip. Hope they plan to shed some light on that angle.

[DRW50]

He'll probably never hate her as much as he hates Phillip, because she was always there for him. Phillip wasn't. Even worse, although I don't know if this will be dwelled on, he singled out Katherine and Jill as the two people he wanted to make happy by bringing Cane to them. He didn't think of Nina or his son.

[lmfan]

But none of that equals what Philip III put them through pretending to be dead. And the biggest victim of all was his own child. It doesn't matter how he was conceived, he was an innocent and deserved better. The women in his life may have deserved to lose Philip for awhile, but he was still a coward because he waited 20 years of his son's life to become part of it and probably would have still let him believe his father was dead and he was not a true Chancellor if Nina has not pushed the issue about Cane. Homosexual or not, Philip is a deadbeat father and there is no excuse for that. And Chance will never hate his mother because she was there for him for those two decades. Sure Nina made mistakes in the past just like Philip that can be blamed on youth, but unlike his father, Nina stepped up and took responsibility for her son.

Philip would be a major jerk if he called out Nina about what she did as a teen after leaving her to raise their son alone. He should be apologizing to her and their son. I don't think there is an excuse that I would accept for Philip doing what he did. He was a conflicted, emotionally messed up teen under pressure from his family but at some point he had to grow up and come to terms with who he was and yet he did not try to fix things until he was forced to surface again. Philip is nearly 40 now, so those old excuses from when he was a teen don't fly anymore. And he had other choices. He could have walked away from his life without faking his own death.

[DRW50]

Cashton, I wanted to say even though I think Nina more than proved herself to her son later on, I agree with you about Nina's past with Phillip and I hope the characters discuss this. She did manipulate him into marriage, even though she genuinely loved him and he cared for her. With all the original actors still there, there's no reason not to have some flashbacks.

[lmfan]

Yep and they haven't even tried to retcon that part of the story. That part of the story makes no sense because by supposedly trying to make Katherine and Jill happy he would be hurting his child the most in the process and I still don't get why, after 17 years he would think his family would need Cane to enter their lives. Yes, they would still be sad about losing Philip but they would likely not be still mouning. I lost a close friend, who was 19 in 1987 as well as a nephew who was just a baby in 1989, and I think of them occassionally but don't still mourn them. People, even family, move on and heal and learn to be happy again. If he thought they were so devastated after 17 years that he needed to send Cane to them, then why did he set up his death in the first place. I guess I just don't understand what Philip was thinking then or now.