B&B: Bill Bell vs. Bradley Bell

[Sylph]

I am interested to know whether those of you who watched this show from the beginning noticed a definite turn (probably for the worse) after Bradley Bell took over as head writer in 1994. What has changed, what was missing, what were the differences between Bill's and Brad's? Little things, big things... Anything you noticed.

[CSF]

I don't think you even need to have watched B&B under Bill Bell to know that he was clearly better than Bradley.

[Sylph]

That was not the point of this thread. No one here is even remotely claiming that Brad is in the same universe as his father.

[Sylph]

I'm interested in sudden shifts in something, changes in this, in that... Something that made you feel it as a (somewhat/completely) different show.

[Cat]

The big turning point, I think, was That Letter. The one Ridge found which stated that Bridget was Eric's, not his.

I don't know what it was about that SL, but it felt different from the B&B that had come before it. Faster. It was the first of one of those out-of-the-blue SL turns that blindsided you. A modus operandi that Bradley considers his signature.

I remember big dénouements for major SLs. Like when KKL left the show briefly and the SL was Where is Brooke? It turned out she was living on a beach in the caribbean, cradling a doll she called "Bridget" and quietly going nuts. Or Taylor in Prince Omar's Harem. It was OTT, but it was also more... compulsive viewing. B&B had borrowed a page out of Days's hand-book on how to plot (Days was on an upward trajectory at the time -- and it was also B&B's rival, along with AMC, in most US markets).

I also noticed a concerted effort to bring some younger kids in order to balance out the show. They had Jessica Forrester and her love-bug Dylan playing out the Victoria-Ryan teen SL on B&B. And then they had Dylan's roomies Michael and the chick from Saved By the Bell and the slimeball Sly who owned the Bikini Bar and tried it on with all da laydeez. Usually with the help of a drugged drink. Some of it was hit-or-miss.

Later, Bradley revamped the youth canvas and SORASed Rick and CJ and brought on Amber and Kimberley. In some ways this worked, even though I grew fatigued of The Amber Show. She was on all the time! She was the New Brooke.

Sometime after that, I think Bradley started to lose the plot. Breacon was definitely Much-Talked About but it 1. premiered in September 2001 and 2. ruined a lot of characters. Bradley got high from the "naughtiness" of the SL and the way it got fans clucking. He's tried to replicate that "shock and awe" ever since. To the show's detriment. Seriously, a 12-year old with ADD could pace the show better.

Sorry. That was probably more than you wanted to know.

[LoyaltoAMC]

Honestly, the show has been utter [!@#$%^&*] since the beginning, with a few bright spots along the way. It started out as a pale carbon copy of early Y&R, right down the the uncoventional nicknames of the up and coming doctors from the struggling family (Snapper and Storm). The show was a joke under Bill Bell. I remember when Marcy Walker joined GL, she told one of the rags that she was offered a role on B&B too. The manner in which she phrased her decision to take the GL over the B&B gig implied that B&B was just a stupid show with absolutely no depth. I'm sure she wasn't the only one in the industry who thought that. It was almost a parody of soap operas, it was that bad. Bradley Bell actually attempted to make the characters less shallow and add some sexual and psychological depth, but his storytelling is more uneven than his dad's. The show has always suffered was horrible acting, and if Y&R hadn't been its lead-in and it hadn't exploded in the Europe the way it has, it wouldn't still be on the air.

[sheilaforever]

Actually the shift occured earlier and it was seamingless in the first few years.

Especially since Brad used the existing characters heavily and even brought back Brooke's family as Rick & Bridget's nannies.

The backburning of the Spectras occured for a first time by late 1996 and the ultra-fast pacing didn't happen until the new millenium, basically as long as Jack Smith was with the show. Over the years, Brad definitely has gotten more sloppy and burnt out - but it's not so much within his writing style rather than this absurd idea that the show has to be on an ultra-fast pacing.

[Cat]

True. I'm not going by what happened backstage -- just by my viewing of the show. That Letter seemed to signal a shift for me. Whereas the Battle for BeLieF felt like Bill Bell's story and pacing, you know?

[juniorz1]

The BeLief storyline is what got me hooked on B&B. KKL was mesmerizing when she lambasted the Forrester family. It's still my fave B&B tale to date.

[Sylph]

Actually, no. It's exactly what I wanted: yours, Loyal's etc. detailed, thought-provoking posts.

I think one of the things that killed this show was too many "Who is whose child?" stories. That was just... Awful. And there was a whole lot of it.

And too much incestuous stories.

[Cat]

LOL, true. The fact that Brooke has birthed about 80% of the show's "younger generation" and Eric about 70% and Ridge about 50% -- it makes for a headache-inducing Venn diagram. That incestuousness you talk about? Will consequently only get worse. I dread the day Owen or Deacon suddenly go "Daddy?" with either Ridge or Eric.

If they'd drawn the line after Brooke & Thorne became a couple, I think I could have handled it.

[Sapounopera]

The problem with Brad Bell is that he never managed to create a classic character. Amber, Deacon and Nick are the closest things to a long-lasting, classic character. Amber and Deacon are long gone and Nick has been ruined. That's not good for a 22-year old soap.

B&B was ruined after Thorne and Brooke divorced. For once I believed that my -then- beloved Brooke has found real love, despite the fact that I hated her getting involved with another Forrester. Then we had the scandalous affair with Deacon that was hot, but ruined Brooke for me. After that we had scandal after scandal and every single character was destroyed. (Sophisticated Stephanie Forrester turned into Stefano Dimera etc, every Forrester daughter-in-law died at least twice) So 1994 was not a turning point for me.

[CSF]

Well, in a more clearer description of my feelings toward this show, I think a lot of the drastic changes took place toward the end of the 1990s, like 1999 and the beginning of the 2000s.

Deacon for one, the fall of the Spectra Fashion House. Ridge not a Forrester. The introduction of Nick, Jackie M, Massamio. Bridget and Ridge Yuck! Rick and Steffy, Rick and Phoebe, Rick and Taylor. Logan sisters overload!

I didn't watch the early years but from what I know and from what I've seen, this show was meant to be about fashion. It doesn't matter if there is a Jackie M and her little rinky dink fashion house, the show lost it's main concept. It was all out Forrester/Spectra fashion wars.

It's never been bold, but the Bell soaps never strived for bold storylines anyway. Regardless, I think B&B could have shinned in it's own right. If they had Clark and CJ front and center to keep up Spectra Fashions and their constant feud with Forrester Creations and introduced new characters heavily involved with fashion, with making names for themselves and filled the canvas with bitter backstabbing betrayal and unscrupulous scheming to outdo one another, B&B would be the s*hit, IMO.

So, I think that if Bradley Bell took the show in that direction from his father, B&B would be on the right track. Bill set the foundation for something like what I descried to take off, whether he was able to write that or not. IMO, if Bill was still alive and writing B&B, I don't think any of the crap that is taking place now would have occurred. There would be a strong and serious emphasis on the two main fashion houses. Also, like other's said in another thread a while back, Thorne and Brooke were good together.

Lastly, something else that just occurred to me, aside from Bradley's great production skills, IMO, B&B is very unrealistic and he pretty much made it that way. There isn't enough emphasis on fashion and a revolving door of a company president would make any fashion house fold in a second. If B&B was set in NYC where it should have been set to begin with, but I digress, with the current state Bradley has brought it too, the show would have been considered a laughing stock for the past 10 years, more so that what many already consider it to be.

[DaytimeFan]

I feel the shift started to happen in 1996 when Bill and Lee stepped down as EP's and Brad was promoted. Then, when Jack Smith came aboard in a more senior role, that was the real shift. Lighting fast pacing, the Marones...

[y&r_fan]

Jack Smith should never have left B&B.