The Politics Thread

[NothinButAttitude]

Good. I figured Obama would have to be the one to get Bernie to come to his senses and concede. MSNBC even said that they got word that Jill, Bernie's wife, was trying to get him to accept reality and concede but he's being stubborn. He needs to accept that mathematically, he never had a shot since Super Tuesday. 

[Vee]

Based on that article, I think it's a toss-up as to whether anyone can get through to Sanders before the convention. But I'm hoping so. It's worth mentioning he is now 13 minutes behind schedule for speaking. Rachel Maddow is sinking her teeth into this article on MSNBC.

 

Edited June 8, 2016 by Vee

[Vee]

Oh, boy:

 

Aaand he's up. Entire family was onstage, he appears to be struggling. I think this is a concession, and I wonder how long it took him to finally relent. I bet it was down to the last hour.

Edited June 8, 2016 by Vee

[Vee]

He's pivoting to Trump and not allowing him to become President.

 

Aaaand now he's back to stump speech. He is drawing this out and looks sick.

 

He says it's not about Bernie but the people. No mention whatsoever of the Democratic Party or Clinton yet.

 

Oh, my [!@#$%^&*] God. He's not conceding.

 

I'm beginning to think he just decided this mid-speech.

 

He's vowing to take it to the convention. This is insane.

 

I would swear he decided this mid-speech. You don't bring the kids onstage and everyone and arrive 45 minutes late to not concede.

Edited June 8, 2016 by Vee

[cassadine1991]

Bernie isn't conceding, he's STILL going to fight. 

Also Bernie supporter booed when Hillary was mentioned but Hillary supporters didn't boo when he was mentioned

[DRW50]

The article Vee mentions above is a fascinating read, and very enlightening, in that it's all about grudges and "payback." For all the hype of Bernie not being like other politicians, he really, really is.

 

http://www.politico.com/story/2016/06/bernie-sanders-campaign-last-days-224041

[Vee]

I truly think he was at the HQ agonizing over conceding - which is likely what Obama ordered him to do in their recent call that evidently left Bernie and Jane Sanders sullen - in the wake of Hillary's win, the WH pointedly endorsing her nomination, and the new article where, indeed, his team is throwing him under the bus.

 

I think he brought the whole family onstage because he intended to do that, or told someone so. I think he was pivoting towards it for part of the speech. And then he went back to stump speech, and then he refused to concede.

 

Unbelievable. Other people think this is him laying the groundwork to begin to concede over the next week following his meeting with Obama on Thursday - I'm not so sure.

[marceline]

It's almost funny to see how Trump and Bernie have started running similar campaigns. Both of them have started disregarding their campaign staffs and making rash egocentric decisions. I'm trying to figure out if the DNC is going to cut him down or just let him flame out.

[Vee]

Wow.

 

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[Skin]

This might all be for the best, I think. I actually hope that Bernie doesn't fold, and moves to the green party and takes all of his voters with him. It's clear that the democrats never really gave him a chance, and that they never considered him an actual player compared to Hillary, and he pretty much surprised them all by getting as many votes as he did. Maybe if he goes to the green party, America will finally break out of it's two party system, and real change can be possible rather then swinging back and forth between an endless pendulum.

 

It's clear that there are a lot of people that do not want to vote for Hilary or are reluctant to, and need a real alternative to her. If they don't provide it I fear historically low turn outs come election day of voters who feel completely disenfranchised by the voting process. Never have I heard or seen so many stories about voter suppression, media bias blackouts, and closed primary controversies as I have this election season. I think denying the voters, that opportunity would be a drastic mistake at this juncture. Despite everything that went against Bernie this political race he still managed to match up to 80% of the votes Hilary received, once you take away super delegates which means Hillary won with only a fifth of the vote of the democratic party.

 

With that in mind, Bernie should stay in this race to give a voice to those people who feel the establishment is harming them. Hilary isn't that voice for them, and she doesn't share the same values, ideas and beliefs that Sander's voters do. In such they should be able to choose a candidate that will reflect their views. The party cannot be unified because the party has completely different thoughts on what it needs. Let the party split and let people vote their conscious.

[DRW50]

Like with Ralph Nader?

 

America will never break away from a two party system. The far right knows this. It's why the evangelicals and the Tea Party always supports the GOP, rather than splitting. Democrats never remember or care. It's why they lose and keep losing.

[Skin]

No I think people are becoming tired of things never really changing and things only getting worse. It might not happen now, but I think the more important thing is that it could, and maybe it should. I won't pretend that I know anything about Ralph Nader, but Bernie's 10 million votes account for more then just a minor/fringe voting population.

 

Also the Republican's shouldn't be looked at as a system of functional political strategy, they seem completely at odds with what today's America is moving toward, and seems perpetually ignorant to the rights and needs of women, gays, minorities and immigrants.

Edited June 10, 2016 by Skin

[cassadine1991]

Then you are giving the election to Trump

[Skin]

I think it's more important for people to vote their conscience, then to vote to stop someone else from winning. That fear is how things stay the same forever, and how progression dies. If people don't believe in Hillary, then it makes absolutely no sense for them to vote for her. If the Republican's are truly unhappy with Trump then they should do the same, instead of just following him for a win.

Edited June 10, 2016 by Skin

[DramatistDreamer]

Well, anyone who wants to open the gateway for a racist to get into the White House, that can be on their conscience as well.  

 

Some of us, who are people of color with lots to lose can't afford for this to happen-- I personally suffered greatly during the Bush years and don't want to see that happen again.  There was an article written, not by a person of color but by a White man, saying that it is usually white upper middle class liberals who when they don't get everything their way, decide that they can afford to risk having someone like a Trump (or a Bush) get in because they have nothing to lose, their wealth, their color, their privilege will completely insulate them from any negative consequences.  I have never believed it more than more than I do now.

 

If you want to talk about voter disenfranchisement, look how long Blacks in the U.S. have been disenfranchised, yet many of us, myself included, still participate in the voting process, often times volunteering for organizations that help improve the system.  Many Blacks have paid dearly, risking their lives to participate in this system, in spite of all its problems.  Where would we be if we whined and stamped our feet when things didn't go our way?  Probably happily ignored by the higher ups, the elites and the well heeled and well connected.  Thank God for people like MLK, Fanny Lou Hamer and Shirely Chisolm who pushed the officials.  They also acted on their conscience but they pushed elected officials who were in office as well as pushed for candidates to run, yes even within the confines of a two party system.  And they didn't pout and stamp their feet when  things didn't go precisely as they wanted and they didn't drop out and allow George Wallace or the likes of Strom Thurmond to get to the Oval Office because one or both parties weren't catering to their demands, as just as those demands were.

 

Edited June 10, 2016 by DramatistDreamer