Just now, SoapDope said:

I don't remember her saying she was a lesbian. She showed up at Val's house for Karen and Mac's 15th Anniversary party. Karen tells Val Ginger and Kenny are divorced. Val replies " I know"...Karen jokes how come you knew and I didn't and Ginger tells Karen "  Relax, I told Val when she called". 

Thanks. I remember some review at the time saying she was a lesbian. Maybe that was a misinterpretation.

23 hours ago, Khan said:

In a way, I wish KNOTS had remained the kind of show David Jacobs wanted it to be

What did you think when Knots Landing got more corporate and glamorous during season 5? I wonder if that was done in response to Dynasty blowing up and being a pop culture phenomenon.

20 hours ago, Khan said:

reduced the women 

19 hours ago, SoapDope said:

"It's a man's world mentality"....

We can say that to an extent about all three CBS primetime soaps. Knots Landing added Kevin Dobson and William Devane to the main cast to draw the male audience away from Hill Street Blues and that worked. As we all know, when the CBS primetime soaps went into budget mode it was mostly the long time female cast members that were salary dumped and not the males. Then there's the factor of Les Moonves moving up the ranks at Lorimar (1985 executive in the movie/mini-series division, 1988 Head of Creative Affairs, 1990 President).

Between Leonard Katzman, Michael Filerman, and Les Moonves, I don't know who was the worst of the worst at Lorimar.

3 hours ago, DRW50 said:

Thanks. I remember some review at the time saying she was a lesbian. Maybe that was a misinterpretation.

After I posted I went and pulled out the movie to be sure I was correct. Val and Karen asks if she's getting along and Ginger replies " Oh Yeah " and Val say's " A boyfriend huh"? and Ginger replies " A few and it's been educational"...she whispers to them about Kenny being a mediocre lover. 

It's hard to believe that reunion miniseries was 27 years ago. It aired in May 1997 and I remember watching it the 2 nights it aired. Too bad the script was blah, but it was nice revisiting the cul-de-sac again. 

20 hours ago, kalbir said:

What did you think when Knots Landing got more corporate and glamorous during season 5?

Don't get me wrong: I love how KNOTS evolved over the years.  (Well, for the most part, I love it, lol).  I didn't mind when the show became more glamorous and "corporate," because, to me, the essence of the show still was there.  

But I believe that David Jacobs' original vision for the show had value, too, even if it probably wouldn't have run for as long as KNOTS actually ran, had Jacobs been able to stick to that vision.  It's just - as I said before - the stars weren't aligned in the right way to make that happen.

Thank you for the reply @Khan

I take it Knots Landing was your favorite of the 1980s big four primetime soaps.

I'm know I'm in the minority, but I think all the 80s prime time soaps were the best in the beginning. Like the first and second seasons. All of them. Even Dynasty which people said was boring until Joan Collins came along. The first season of Dynasty was my favorite. I guess I just like things in their purest form with the original vision still intact. 

43 minutes ago, kalbir said:

I take it Knots Landing was your favorite of the 1980s big four primetime soaps.

KL was (and is) more than just my favorite of the big four '80's primetime soaps; it's also one of a handful of drama shows - along with "The Rockford Files," "Family," "Lou Grant," "Hill Street Blues," "St. Elsewhere," "Moonlighting," "thirtysomething" and "Northern Exposure"* - that define my sensibilities as a still-novice, still-unpaid storyteller.  On the rare occasions when I still write something (mostly for myself), the question I ask myself most often (other than "How would Douglas Marland/David Lloyd/Billy Wilder do it?") is how Peter Dunne or Richard Gollance would do it.

(*In case anyone was wondering, my other, most favorite drama shows include "Homefront," "Murder, She Wrote" and "Picket Fences").

25 minutes ago, Reverend Ruthledge said:

I'm know I'm in the minority, but I think all the 80s prime time soaps were the best in the beginning. Like the first and second seasons. All of them. 

I definitely agree that the first 1-2 seasons of DALLAS, DYNASTY and FC were their respective best.  DYNASTY hadn't given way fully to camp and excess yet; DALLAS is still able to give any character who isn't named J.R. a brain and a backbone; and FC still knows what it is and what it wants to be.

KL's first couple of seasons has its' moments, too, but I don't believe the show starts to gel until S3, when it's a hybrid of continuing storylines and standalone episodes.

Edited July 12, 20241 yr by Khan

I think the first 3 seasons of Knots kept focusing on the main storylines on " Which one of the spouses is going to cheat, be tempted to cheat or get cheated on tonight" ? That got old quick.

It's funny how in Season 1 Gary is so protective and caring towards Val ( hence like like a china doll).....then by Season 2 he acts like he can't stand her, talks down to her and then finally cheats on her. He blows her off when she needs him like when he doesn't show up when she asks for his help with the show featuring Karen and Diana. Then when she get's cancer he pretty much has the thought it would be better for her to die than to survive with a colostomy because "He can't handle it".

It's funny that Gary looked like a poor victim of Jock and J.R. the way he was written on Dallas as being weak....well turns out Jock was right about him. 

16 minutes ago, SoapDope said:

I think the first 3 seasons of Knots kept focusing on the main storylines on " Which one of the spouses is going to cheat, be tempted to cheat or get cheated on tonight" ? That got old quick.

In the beginning, KL's premise revolved around one, key question: Does marriage still mean anything in a society that promotes "free love" and infidelity without consequence or guilt?

Unfortunately, as David Jacobs learned, when married couples can cheat on each other, with no buildup and no consequences, you wind up with a show that has no drama and no stakes.

Edited July 12, 20241 yr by Khan

19 minutes ago, Khan said:

In the beginning, KL's premise revolved around one, key question: Does marriage still mean anything in a society that promotes "free love" and infidelity without consequence or guilt?

Unfortunately, as David Jacobs learned, when married couples can cheat on each other, with no buildup and no consequences, you wind up with a show that has no drama and no stakes.

That's true. In seasons 1 and 2 Ginger left Kenny for like 10 minutes and then got back with him after she discovered she was pregnant. Laura and Richard screwed around on each other and stayed together, Gary screwed around on Val and she took him back right after. Zzzzzzzzzzzzz. 

Season 2 really leaned into the fidelity vs infidelity question in a wierd mix of standalone and continuing stories.  There was no build up nor any long term fall out.

Once Abby set her signs on Gary in mid season 2.. then the concept of infidelity in a marriage became an interesting question.  It also helped that Val/Abby were friendly with one another and the build up to Gary and Abby cheating took over a season before it happened near the end of season 3.

Having Val discover it and leave Gary was an awesome way to end season 3.. with season 4 continuing their divorce with her becoming a writer and Gary trying to make a go with Abby.

 

There’s the classic unanswered question from Abby to Gary mid-Season 2 “Are you ready for me now Gary?” 😄🤣 which could have been interpreted multiple ways.

It took a season for that to pay off. Personally I liked the slow burn… whether intentional or not by the writers.

1 hour ago, yrfan1983 said:

Personally I liked the slow burn… whether intentional or not by the writers.

I agree.  Gary and Abby's affair held too many dramatic possibilities to squander it like they would have in S2, when practically everyone on the show was cheating or thinking about cheating, with no long term fall out, like @Soaplovers said upthread.

1 hour ago, SoapDope said:

That's true. In seasons 1 and 2 Ginger left Kenny for like 10 minutes and then got back with him after she discovered she was pregnant. Laura and Richard screwed around on each other and stayed together, Gary screwed around on Val and she took him back right after. Zzzzzzzzzzzzz. 

You know the writers were in trouble in S2 when they had the women of Seaview Circle being held hostage by some terrorists or something, lol.

Just now, Khan said:

I agree.  Gary and Abby's affair held too many dramatic possibilities to squander it like they would have in S2, when practically everyone on the show was cheating or thinking about cheating, with no long term fall out, like @Soaplovers said upthread.

You know the writers were in trouble in S2 when they had the women of Seaview Circle being held hostage by some terrorists or something, lol.

That episode was kind of a rehash of season 1  "Land Of The Free" with the thugs terrorizing ladies on the beach, now they are being terrorized by thugs in Val's living room and throwing her nice antique furniture that Miss Ellie gave her around. Maybe they thought viewers wouldn't notice. 

10 minutes ago, SoapDope said:

That episode was kind of a rehash of season 1  "Land Of The Free" with the thugs terrorizing ladies on the beach,

One of the most unintentionally funny things I'd ever seen on that show.  The pitch for that episode might have sounded great, but the episode itself was GOD. AWFUL.