25 minutes ago, EricMontreal22 said:

Yes, I think that's a fair way to look at it (and ridiculously to assume Nixon should have turned down the offer and told ABC they should focus on one of their low rated soaps instead.)

That's all well & good but it's not going to keep disenfranchised or even inconvenienced fans from holding a grudge, when it's their favorite soap on the short end of the stick. 

4 hours ago, EricMontreal22 said:

(and ridiculously to assume Nixon should have turned down the offer and told ABC they should focus on one of their low rated soaps instead.)

I agree.  I mean, if I had been in her shoes, and ABCD had come to me and said, "Please give us another show, we'll give you X amount of dollars and even let you own it," of course I'm going to say "Sure."

Frankly, ABCD would've been better off cancelling RH in 1983 (not that that would've guaranteed a successful run for LOVING).  RH was already on life support by then; it just took ABCD another six years for them to pull the plug.

Edited April 2Apr 2 by Khan

Thanks @EricMontreal22 for the links and thank you to @GymnastGuy and Mike Poirier for sharing them. I am glad to see anything new of this era, clips or episodes.

As for Agnes Nixon "stabbing Ryan's Hope in the back," I said my views on that at the time the video first went up and they haven't changed. I can see why a fan may feel that way, but Agnes did not owe Ryan's Hope anything. If anything, Ryan's Hope may never have gotten on the air if not for the successes of AMC and OLTL. 

Maybe as some form of collective apology we can write a new world where Agnes, clouded with guilt, returned to OLTL and helped the Labines manage to get better stories on when they wrote for the show in 1997.

 

Edited April 2Apr 2 by DRW50

1 hour ago, Khan said:

I agree.  I mean, if I had been in her shoes, and ABCD had come to me and said, "Please give us another show, we'll give you X amount of dollars and even let you own it," of course I'm going to say "Sure."

Frankly, ABCD would've been better off cancelling RH in 1983 (not that that would've guaranteed a successful run for LOVING).  RH was already on life support by then; it just took ABCD another six years for them to pull the plug.

I think this is what always gets me.  Don't get me wrong--I've stuck with a fave soap for YEARS of mediocre or even bad writing and still mourned when it was cancelled, so I get it.  But it's not like RH was at a creative high and ABC/Evil Aggie were sabotaging it (well maybe ABC was with some of the creatives they hired...)

@DRW50 I completely agree.

5 hours ago, DRW50 said:

As for Agnes Nixon "stabbing Ryan's Hope in the back," I said my views on that at the time the video first went up and they haven't changed. I can see why a fan may feel that way, but Agnes did not owe Ryan's Hope anything. 

Exactly. It was business and as even Megan McTavish noted in her memoir, Agnes was a consummate, laser-focused businesswoman.

14 hours ago, DRW50 said:

As for Agnes Nixon "stabbing Ryan's Hope in the back," I said my views on that at the time the video first went up and they haven't changed. I can see why a fan may feel that way, but Agnes did not owe Ryan's Hope anything. If anything, Ryan's Hope may never have gotten on the air if not for the successes of AMC and OLTL. 

 

13 hours ago, EricMontreal22 said:

Don't get me wrong--I've stuck with a fave soap for YEARS of mediocre or even bad writing and still mourned when it was cancelled, so I get it.  But it's not like RH was at a creative high and ABC/Evil Aggie were sabotaging it (well maybe ABC was with some of the creatives they hired...)

 

8 hours ago, Vee said:

It was business and as even Megan McTavish noted in her memoir, Agnes was a consummate, laser-focused businesswoman.

And I agree with all three of you!

Edited April 2Apr 2 by Khan

The first half of the Oct. 30, 1989, episode.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-jS3-gMgug

A couple of Michael Logan articles about Loving. One is when Downtown Julie Brown did a brief role on the show and the other is where Logan praises Dennis Parlato work as the permanent replacement for Larkin Malloy's Clay.

The issue is not the fact ABC asked Agnes Nixon to create another soap. The issue is that Agnes Nixon went to the network and threatened to bolt to NBC if they didn't give her Ryan's Hope timeslot

At the times Nixon was probably the second most powerful woman at ABC (after Gloria Monty) - and ABC could not afford to have Nixon go to the competition. Yes it is business, but Ryan's Hope felt thrown under the bus so Agnes Nixon could have her way. That is the issue. 

Thanks so much, @Franko . Always glad to see more of the '80s Loving. Interesting to see Sherrie again. If the show had gone on I might have brought her back, terminally ill, with Ava and Kate having to be there for her in her final months (and maybe her kids could have helped bolster a new teen scene with Stacey's kids among others).

@chrisml Thanks. I never knew Downtown Julie Brown was on Loving. And it doesn't even sound like the usual cameo situation - it sounds like she wanted a real gig. I wish someone would interview her about what happened. I can't say I'm surprised she didn't last, especially as this was at a time there were no black people on the canvas. 

(I wonder if Noelle may have been doing her a favor)

She would end up hosting The Gossip Show a few years later - probably a better fit. But she could have had fun on The City, as early on they had some comics pop in and out, like Judy Gold, before they lost the New York flavor.

 

Watching that October 1989 episode posted above...

I just saw on the Loving blog that this Sherrie appearance wasn't listed. I'm glad there was at least one more appearance between her 1987 and 1994 appearances.

@dc11786 you may enjoy this one too as Ava and Sherrie have a real argument over the horrible way Ava treated Sherrie when she was trying to get a baby. I'm glad they remembered even though several years (and writing regimes) had passed and the same Ava wasn't even in the role. I like how Sherrie is styled like Kate here. She does not have Kate's warmth, but then she wouldn't with Ava given their history. I wish they'd focused a little more on Ava mentioning that she too knows what it's like to lose a baby, but that small moment was where Lisa Peluso most tapped into the poignancy of the exchange.

I wish they had brought Sherrie back when Carly was around, as she might have been a middle ground - Carly was so incredibly depressing it was more difficult to invest in the Carly/Ava dynamic than it should have been.

Glad to see a little more of Jolie, who remains such a sad, twisted character. Trisha seems brain dead in following her out to that van, although at least she did not get into the van with her. 

Todd and Curtis being there made me hope some more of this episode might have been in the clips the actors put up a decade ago, but no dice.

This was very close to the end for Todd. I am trying to remember if the other hunks with Todd and Trucker were established characters or just extras. Was that Dale up there with them?

I just realized through the blog that Albers was the second longest Curtis. I do think he was a decent fit for the part, even if they never did anything of worth with him (a running theme with Curtis, sadly). 

Is that a real reporter with Egypt?

@slick jones There may be a new name or a few updates in this one for your lists.

Edited April 9Apr 9 by DRW50

6 hours ago, DRW50 said:

Thanks so much, @Franko . Always glad to see more of the '80s Loving.

You're welcome. I always forget to tag everybody. And I agree with you -- these new discoveries are a real treat. @Kane is going to have a lot to work with!

6 hours ago, DRW50 said:

Interesting to see Sherrie again. If the show had gone on I might have brought her back, terminally ill, with Ava and Kate having to be there for her in her final months (and maybe her kids could have helped bolster a new teen scene with Stacey's kids among others).

Loving had enough kids for at least two future teen scenes. First off, J.J. & Heather, Johnny Watley, Sandy & Alexis, Tommy, and Christopher. After that, Tyler, Patti, Steffi & Cooper's child, and Trucker & Dinah Lee's child.

6 hours ago, DRW50 said:

@chrisml Thanks. I never knew Downtown Julie Brown was on Loving. And it doesn't even sound like the usual cameo situation - it sounds like she wanted a real gig. I wish someone would interview her about what happened. I can't say I'm surprised she didn't last, especially as this was at a time there were no black people on the canvas. 

It sounds like Sam was meant as either a fill-in or tryout replacement for Maggie (Constance Shulman).

44 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

Todd and Curtis being there made me hope some more of this episode might have been in the clips the actors put up a decade ago, but no dice.

This was very close to the end for Todd. I am trying to remember if the other hunks with Todd and Trucker were established characters or just extras. Was that Dale up there with them?

I'm shallow. I just want to see more of the Perfect Man contest, particularly when they wore singlets.

44 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

Is that a real reporter with Egypt?

Googling didn't turn up a "Matt Hargrove" with ABC Sports, but he may have been from a local affiliate.

5 minutes ago, Franko said:

Loving had enough kids for at least two future teen scenes. First off, J.J. & Heather, Johnny Watley, Sandy & Alexis, Tommy, and Christopher. After that, Tyler, Patti, Steffi & Cooper's child, and Trucker & Dinah Lee's child.

It sounds like Sam was meant as either a fill-in or tryout replacement for Maggie (Constance Shulman).

I'm shallow. I just want to see more of the Perfect Man contest, particularly when they wore singlets.

Googling didn't turn up a "Matt Hargrove" with ABC Sports, but he may have been from a local affiliate.

Thanks. That makes sense about Maggie. 

There's so much you could do with the lost generations of Loving. ABC should have had a fic like P&G did for a few years (even if that was a mess).

Thanks for looking about the news guy. 

Was Clay trying to drug Trucker? I couldn't tell what he was doing.

5 hours ago, DRW50 said:

Watching that October 1989 episode posted above...

I just saw on the Loving blog that this Sherrie appearance wasn't listed. I'm glad there was at least one more appearance between her 1987 and 1994 appearances.

@dc11786 you may enjoy this one too as Ava and Sherrie have a real argument over the horrible way Ava treated Sherrie when she was trying to get a baby. I'm glad they remembered even though several years (and writing regimes) had passed and the same Ava wasn't even in the role. I like how Sherrie is styled like Kate here. She does not have Kate's warmth, but then she wouldn't with Ava given their history. I wish they'd focused a little more on Ava mentioning that she too knows what it's like to lose a baby, but that small moment was where Lisa Peluso most tapped into the poignancy of the exchange.

I wish they had brought Sherrie back when Carly was around, as she might have been a middle ground - Carly was so incredibly depressing it was more difficult to invest in the Carly/Ava dynamic than it should have been.

Glad to see a little more of Jolie, who remains such a sad, twisted character. Trisha seems brain dead in following her out to that van, although at least she did not get into the van with her. 

Todd and Curtis being there made me hope some more of this episode might have been in the clips the actors put up a decade ago, but no dice.

This was very close to the end for Todd. I am trying to remember if the other hunks with Todd and Trucker were established characters or just extras. Was that Dale up there with them?

I just realized through the blog that Albers was the second longest Curtis. I do think he was a decent fit for the part, even if they never did anything of worth with him (a running theme with Curtis, sadly). 

Is that a real reporter with Egypt?

@slick jones There may be a new name or a few updates in this one for your lists.

 

4 hours ago, Franko said:

You're welcome. I always forget to tag everybody. And I agree with you -- these new discoveries are a real treat. @Kane is going to have a lot to work with!

Loving had enough kids for at least two future teen scenes. First off, J.J. & Heather, Johnny Watley, Sandy & Alexis, Tommy, and Christopher. After that, Tyler, Patti, Steffi & Cooper's child, and Trucker & Dinah Lee's child.

It sounds like Sam was meant as either a fill-in or tryout replacement for Maggie (Constance Shulman).

I'm shallow. I just want to see more of the Perfect Man contest, particularly when they wore singlets.

Googling didn't turn up a "Matt Hargrove" with ABC Sports, but he may have been from a local affiliate.

Per the Loving Cast list I have Hargrove was played by Scott Clark. I don't have a year listed.

Per "Victoria Foxton", he was a NYC ABC Sports reporter.  Here's a link to him being honored by the N.A.T.A.S.

https://abc7ny.com/scott-clark-sports-anchor-director-honored/4789983/

 

 

Which actress is playing Sherrie at this point?

 

Edited April 9Apr 9 by slick jones

@slick jones Thank you (and victoria foxton) for finding the info about the reporter. 

I think this Sherrie is Shelley Rogers, who played her off and on from 86-94.