Welcome back Eric ! Missed ya.

Hopefully you'll hang around.

@EricMontreal22 Great to see you on here again. Welcome back! We definitely appreciate all this material being uploaded, especially in today's climate where you never know what tomorrow will be, if there is a tomorrow. 

I remember Joe Stuart mainly for all the stuff about Courtney, Slezak, etc. but I can also see where his changes may have moved the show into a direction it needed to go in. There are stories under his pen that are hard to imagine happening before him, like the tragedy of Lana. I'm just sorry for some of the changes that were made that probably didn't have to be, like getting rid of Nancy Pinkerton.

You're right about how different the P&G soaps were to ABC at this time, based on the material we now finally have available to watch. Even if the GL episodes were a tad stodgy in places, I think sticking to their traditional format worked for them. The attempts to ABC-ify both shows in the early '80s would be a big mistake, and ATWT only recovered when they managed to find the middle ground between modernizing and their roots (GL never really managed to fully recover).

1 hour ago, Paul Raven said:

Welcome back Eric ! Missed ya.

Hopefully you'll hang around.

I admit for a while there I was so down on the state of soaps (what else is new? ) and just sorta needed a break from even thinking about my old faves.  But I have a feeling I'll be sticking around for a while now.  And thank you!

1 hour ago, DRW50 said:

@EricMontreal22 Great to see you on here again. Welcome back! We definitely appreciate all this material being uploaded, especially in today's climate where you never know what tomorrow will be, if there is a tomorrow. 

I remember Joe Stuart mainly for all the stuff about Courtney, Slezak, etc. but I can also see where his changes may have moved the show into a direction it needed to go in. There are stories under his pen that are hard to imagine happening before him, like the tragedy of Lana. I'm just sorry for some of the changes that were made that probably didn't have to be, like getting rid of Nancy Pinkerton.

You're right about how different the P&G soaps were to ABC at this time, based on the material we now finally have available to watch. Even if the GL episodes were a tad stodgy in places, I think sticking to their traditional format worked for them. The attempts to ABC-ify both shows in the early '80s would be a big mistake, and ATWT only recovered when they managed to find the middle ground between modernizing and their roots (GL never really managed to fully recover).

Nice to see you and other fave posters still here! 

Yeah, I think ultimately Joe Stuart was good for the show--not just rating wise but also creatively.  Although in Llanview in the Afternoon Sam Hall certainly has nothing good to say about him (as expected.)  But I think he did push story and more often than not in the right direction, at least during the 70s.  It's funny, again in that book, he's quoted as realizing that what soaps should focus on is character and character based stories, but admits it took him a bit to realize that at OLTL.  And some of the early moves sure are baffling.  Did he not see what the show was doing and see that Nancy Pinkerton's Dorian was one of the most fascinating characters on screen?  Instead it seems he decided he needed to sex her up (I admit, I think that episode from May 1977 is the only one I've seen featuring Mallis' Dorian, so maybe they toned down her horniness later, though I get the impression, divorced from Pinkerton, the character became less distinctive and wasn't given much to do until Strasser.  Who of course unequivocally loved Stuart and he loved her.)

Side note--when I watch the Pinkerton episodes, she reminds me SOOO much of Carrie Coon's acting and characterization in The Gilded Age.  Everything about the performance--maybe I'm crazy.

I agree with you about the P&G soaps although from what I can tell this was especially true of ATWT and GL, or maybe the CBS ones in general.  The Another World stuff I've seen feels... well not like the ABC soaps but not quite as "classic/old fashioned soap opera" as this stuff (of course that includes things like the two 60s episodes from Agnes Nixon we have--so not a big surprise there--and of course, as well, Irna created AW with the desire to make it full out melodrama and less low key in style.) 

I hope I don't sound like I'm insulting the shows we see in those episodes by saying what I said--I just meant it really was striking how different they were.  And that's to their strength--it was smart for ABC to counterprogram the way they did--the problem is that even by the 80s (let alone the 90s,) as you say, as the P&G soaps tried to capture what ABC was having, it just made all of the soap operas more homogenized in style and feel (if not necessarily in actual quality.)  So something was lost there.  And obviously ATWT was still holding on to its audience...  (Those voice overs though...  I guess we know where JER got it from.)

I think Joe Stuart may have played hardball on contract renewals - I'm pretty sure that was the case with Doris Belack.

50 minutes ago, Paul Raven said:

I think Joe Stuart may have played hardball on contract renewals - I'm pretty sure that was the case with Doris Belack.

Have y'all seen "Tomorrow 1975 Looks at Soap Operas" the very late night talk show Tom Snyder hosted on NBC for years & this one night when he did a serious look at the soaps at that time with guests Mary Stuart, Joe Stuart, Agnes Nixon & a woman who ran a very early recapping service?

(I have it at my usual video hosting site if anyone has not.)

4 hours ago, EricMontreal22 said:

I admit for a while there I was so down on the state of soaps (what else is new? ) and just sorta needed a break from even thinking about my old faves.  But I have a feeling I'll be sticking around for a while now.  And thank you!

Nice to see you and other fave posters still here! 

I'm new here but I also want to say "Welcome Back" Eric - as I have read past posts by you and (as a fellow Canadian) wondered, where did you go?

Hey there!

I am glad you are enjoying my recent OLTL uploads.  The actor Vance was very generous to give out some of his episodes.

I also got from him ALOT of his original OLTL scripts from 1974-1980.

Enjoy!

 

oh my gosh, thank you to Mitch S!

Edited January 31Jan 31 by janea4old

I want to think @GymnastGuy as well for sharing so much hard-to-find material with others.  Watching these episodes has been a real treat - and a FANTASTIC way to kick off 2025!

Welcome back, as well, to @EricMontreal22!!  Many of us on this board have missed you and your love of all things Agnes Nixon.  Hope you'll stick around/post more often?

Edited January 31Jan 31 by Khan

2 hours ago, GymnastGuy said:

I am glad you are enjoying my recent OLTL uploads.  The actor Vance was very generous to give out some of his episodes.

I also got from him ALOT of his original OLTL scripts from 1974-1980.

The episodes you're uploading are sure to bring a lot of excitement to fans. 

Thank you for sharing.

@EricMontreal22, it is great to see you back posting again. I always enjoyed your commentary, and am pleased that we can all read more of it.👍

Edited January 31Jan 31 by vetsoapfan

I knew @EricMontreal22 would show up when I saw him on the uploads! It has been far too long.

And thank you @GymnastGuy for all you've shared. I hope you don't mind my highlighting some of your recent uploads; I won't plaster them across the forum going fwd.

9 hours ago, EricMontreal22 said:

I agree with you about the P&G soaps although from what I can tell this was especially true of ATWT and GL, or maybe the CBS ones in general.  The Another World stuff I've seen feels... well not like the ABC soaps but not quite as "classic/old fashioned soap opera" as this stuff (of course that includes things like the two 60s episodes from Agnes Nixon we have--so not a big surprise there--and of course, as well, Irna created AW with the desire to make it full out melodrama and less low key in style.) 

To be fair, I do think the production for DAYS in the 60's/70's was also quite cotemporary for the time (and much more than ABC actually) from what I've seen. 

And welcome back @EricMontreal22!

Edited January 31Jan 31 by BetterForgotten

@GymnastGuy Thank you SO MUCH for your priceless uploads and it says a lot that Vance let you have them. We talk so much about what actors have and often just assume this material leaves us when the actors leave us. And I am amazed at hearing of scripts too (I didn't even know he started on OLTL in 1974). 

@EricMontreal22 I definitely see what you mean about ATWT and GL (and I agree that the other P&G soaps don't seem quite as stuck in a theme from the scraps we have of them in that period). What's around of Search, AW, or Edge are a bit more current for the time period. 

 

3 hours ago, GymnastGuy said:

Hey there!

I am glad you are enjoying my recent OLTL uploads.  The actor Vance was very generous to give out some of his episodes

 

Mitch, they really are incredible, and have sparked a lot of talk on here!

It's just glorious to finally get to see Nancy Pinkerton after all these years and many anecdotal stories about her kind of Dorian. What a sinister, intellectual presence. I wouldn't give Robin's Dorian up, but it really is a huge what could have been.