I remember the early and late seasons of Dallas but not so much the middle ones. That may be why I'm somewhat fuzzy on Donna. That's a great scene, and feels very real. I love that she punches her, no slaps or hair-pulling. Also very real.

I did like early nympho Lucy. I thought when they brought her back she had some good one-liners but they seemed to have no idea why she was there, and she just left again. Those last few seasons were generally good but sometimes felt empty.

I don't remember all that much about Donna, although most people who do remember her thought she was a strong character. Did she just sort of vanish?

Donna started out as the politically connected widow of a senator who it was implied was as great and powerful as he. She would appear sporadically because Cliff wanted her backing, and she fell in love with Ray. They would tease now and then that if she wanted she could go toe to toe with JR and had the clout to do it, but they never really followed through. When she married Ray, she became pretty domesticated and because Ellie's BFF. I think even though her character was fairly marginalized, it was another loss for the show because Donna had been there almost from the very beginning--maybe even the first mini series or season 1 the latest, and then she was gone, like Lucy. I guess the closest real life equivalent to Donna would be someone like Hillary Clinton, only Bill didn't die.

I think Jenna came out best in the dream season.

I hate what happened with her and Bobby.

I personally really enjoyed both the 1986-87 and 1988-89 seasons. The 1987-88 season was pretty bad, while the 1989-90 season was horrifyingly horrible. I'm a bit neutral on the final season although killing off April was completely pointless.

The thing that mystifies me the most: why didn't Lucy ever become a regular on Knots Landing? It would have better for her there than those last 3 seasons she did for nothing.

Edited January 10, 201015 yr by soapfan770

Lucy on KL would have been cool.But they didn't even bother with Karen's daughter Diana.

Lucy could have been remarried into a family that came up against the Ewings.She was totally wasted.

Both Dallas and KL faced restrictions because the same core characters had to be front burner year after year.As they aged so did the viewership.I'm sure.

Introducing a son for JR was a great way of revitalising the show and the JR character,but it should have happened many seasons before.Sacha Mitchell was OK ,but the character and actor could have been stronger.His mother should have been a regular,maybe a new Sue Ellen type character.

I loved Callie.Whatever happened to Cathy Podewell?

Joan van Ark was (is to this day) adamant about the fact that she didn't want Lucy on Knots, she felt that Lucy aged Valene (even though we all knew that she had Lucy in her early teens, so what was the big deal??). But they could have made Lucy pregnant, and therefore Val a grandmother, and JVA wasn't havin' that. She was more comfortable with forgetting Lucy and focusing on the much younger twins.

Edited January 10, 201015 yr by SFK

Joan van Ark was (is to this day) adamant about the fact that she didn't want Lucy on Knots, she felt that Lucy aged Valene (even though we all knew that she had Lucy in her early teens, so what was the big deal??). But they could have made Lucy pregnant, and therefore Val a grandmother, and JVA wasn't havin' that. She was more comfortanle with forgetting Lucy and focusing on the much younger twins.

How odd, and almost a cliche outlook. I liked Joan Van Ark on Dallas and thought Val worked well with Lucy. In light of her morphing face during Knots Landing, I think the Lucy character was the least of her problems. She really was pretty once upon a time.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o6nP4y_zOHw

I don't think JVA had the power to keep Lucy off Dallas. Remember when LML and her husband were writing, JVA said she felt they were making fun of her. What did she do after that? She left the show. Didn't say she wouldn't do their crazy stories, she just left. I think Charlene Tilton's limitations hurt her on Knots. Her one episode didn't really show her in a positive light, lol, but I do wish Lucy had joined the cast for the later years.

Yeah, JVA didn't have the *power* per se to keep Lucy off, but she didn't lose any sleep over the fact that Lucy wasn't permanently crossed over. Michele and (less vocally) Donna felt the same way, they did not want their characters becoming grandmothers for the sake of their careers (once a grandmother, always a grandmother, or so was commonly believed). It all seems pretty old-fashioned now, but I'm sure a lot of actresses still feel that way. Probably less so in this current climate of television where everyone just wants to work, period.

I agree that Lucy/Charlene wouldn't have been the best match for Knots, she is much more of a Dallas character, not subtle enough for Knots in the way they probably would have wanted to use her as Val and Gary's daughter.

I thought Lucy was OK in the one Knots episode she was in, but I think her stories might have become tiresome in that setting. I loathed Diana and perpetually wanted someone to smack her in the face (which Eric finally did, in one of my favorite KL scenes ever!), and while some of that was down to Claudia Lonow's limitations as an actress, I think it was also based on how annoying the whole rebellious/bitter teen story was. It almost had to be that way, since we were supposed to empathize with the mother.

The only time I really enjoyed this was with Karen Allen in the first episode, because back then Karen was Ubermother, the gorgon wife of Sid, and she had this insane camp appeal which she didn't have after he died. That scene where Karen Allen called Karen a prostitute, and got a big smack in the face, was hilarious.

Gary blowing up his land was such a WTF moment, but entertaining.

Basically, though, the writers had Gary blow up Empire Valley, b/c the story behind it (that Greg and others were developing it into an inter-global communications nexus...disguised as a suburban housing complex) turned out to be even more convoluted and absurd than the Wolfbridge Group story (which I happened to love, but David Jacobs still cannot explain to this day).

What I'm noticing as I rewatch the series is how wasted Lucy was. She only had one good story the entire time she was on Dallas. That would be the romance with Mickey. Even then they wasted so much of the season before putting them together. Then after a couple episodes he was in a coma then died. Such a waste!

Truth is, DALLAS' writers were never as good at storytelling as KNOTS' were - although, DALLAS was friggin' Shakespeare compared to DYNASTY.

The thing that mystifies me the most: why didn't Lucy ever become a regular on Knots Landing? It would have better for her there than those last 3 seasons she did for nothing.

You have to remember, though, that once Leonard Katzman decided an entire season had been the figment of Pam Ewing's imagination, David Jacobs effectively cut all ties between DALLAS and KNOTS. That's why, in KNOTS' universe, Bobby Ewing remains dead. Plus, as was mentioned upthread, when they tried to integrate Lucy into KNOTS for that one episode, Jacobs felt her presence upset the balance on KNOTS, just as he's always maintained that the episodes where Larry Hagman's J.R. appear are among the worst of that entire series.

Edited January 10, 201015 yr by Khan

Plus, as was mentioned upthread, when they tried to integrate Lucy into KNOTS for that one episode, Jacobs felt her presence upset the balance on KNOTS, just as he's always maintained that the episodes where Larry Hagman's J.R. appear are among the worst of that entire series.

And, God, was he right. Lucy would have been a disaster in KNOTS and J.R. was so utterly out of place in the show that it was painful!

I loathed Diana and perpetually wanted someone to smack her in the face (which Eric finally did, in one of my favorite KL scenes ever!), and while some of that was down to Claudia Lonow's limitations as an actress

Claudia Lonow and the character of Diana were fantastic! One of the best, most honest teens in TV shows ever, including her touching, evolving relationship with her mother.