The reason that Billy's "tell it like it is" approach doesn't impress me is that he was not "telling it like it is" until after Victor screwed him over. Billy had ZERO problem with Victor hurting anyone in the Abbott family when he thought Victor was on his side. He even went to Victor for advice and support. Then suddenly, when he learned the truth about Victor using and discarding him, what do we get? Gnashing and huffing and puffing which doesn't do Colleen a bit of good, and didn't do Ashley a bit of good. The damage was already done. Even Billy Miller himself said he didn't think Billy cared about Ashley, that he was motivated only by Victor screwing him over. Then he went off to obsess over his feelings for his harem yet again, and did nothing while Colleen's life was falling apart and she was left brain dead. Nor has he been there for Ashley while she was at the end of her "pregnancy" or giving birth with only Adam there at her side.

Billy's "tell it like it is" approach makes HIM feel good, but does it ever help anyone in his family? Billy berating nurses didn't make Colleen wake up. Billy whining to Traci about things Traci already knew did nothing to help Traci, or to make anyone's pain any better.

It's very cheap writing. They spent most of the year with Billy ignoring his family, or treating them like dirt. We were invited to think he was perfectly fine to hurt Jack, because Jack's a loser anyway. We were supposed to be happy for him as he had no other purpose in life other than his penis and his Mac obsession.

Then, when they suddenly need to generate sympathy for him, he barges in and spouts some "no sh!t Sherlock" moments that do absolutely NO good whatsoever?

Billy is like one of those distant relatives who spends years and years away from the family, and then return when the patriarch or matriarch is very old and let's say, hacking up tar or a full blown alcoholic. And then this relative says, "He's addicted! This is awful! Who did this? Why why why? We need to do something!"

It's very selfish, pointless involvement, and it bothers me that the show wants us to be so impressed by his memememeing and not focus as much on the others in the family. It's all just much belated, desperate propping for their horrible writing for the character and his poorly defined, forced relationships with most characters on the show. It's the new version of having Billy remind us of mean, mean Jill, the worst mother ever, to try to generate symapthy for him.

And having him plan Colleen's funeral as Traci is pushed even further to the background just makes me resent him even more.

The bottom line for me is I feel absolutely zero connection between Billy and any of his family, or most of the characters on the show. For all the endless "new Jack Abbott" hype, Jack always had much stronger connections to everyone around him, and both Lester and Bergman have/had more of a rapport with other actors. I haven't seen that with Miller. I always see him acting, and ticing the day away. Along with the writing, it's tanked a number of relationships that were supposed to be important and often takes me out of his scenes.

Exactly!

TPTB & Miller have made his Billy so self involved it's almost impossible to support his righteous indignation.

In all that earlier today, I forgot to say that I DO see why people would like Billy, and if I ever cause ANYONE here to hesitate in talking about loving Billy or talking about his stories, then I 100% apologize.

I love Billy and I'm not hesitant to talk about it. Not that I think he's been written perfectly, but I think some of the estrangement from his family makes sense given his gambling problems and the way it was dealt with. Right or wrong I understand his resentment. Jill was pretty damn quick to choose Cain over Billy and to go to Victor herself when she thought it would suit her agenda. I also have no problem having him learn his lesson about Victor and come running back to his family. I do think they should have written more bonding scenes with Billy and the other Abbotts, but this Ashley story never would have worked if she wasn't isolated on that damn ranch. They really couldn't do that much more with Colleen and Billy given the time constraints. I think it would have been a lot different if Billy had been on the show a few more years and Colleen had been on more consistently.

My biggest problem with the Billy character is that I think he's been overexposed and stretched too thin for only being back for a year. He also bares very little resemblance to the character that David Tom and Ryan Brown played. While I can understand people can change with time, there's very little connection to the Billy of the past to the Billy we have now. It's like a new sleazy/man-whorish version of the character. Not to mention, his reunion with Mac has been completely forced, and they've yet to spark anything resembling chemistry.

And yeah, Billy Miller can't pull off emotional scenes or cry very well...

Edited October 5, 200916 yr by Y&RWorldTurner

I want to vomit everytime I hear Billy say "CeCe." Like this insta-nickname is going to make this story have more emotional weight.

Though he has come charisma, there's something very over the top and lacking about Billy Miller's acting. I don't think he quite understands how to play the more human side of his character.

My biggest problem with the Billy character is that I think he's been overexposed and stretched too thin for only being back for a year. He also bares very little resemblance to the character that David Tom and Ryan Brown played. While I can understand people can change with time, there's very little connection to the Billy of the past to the Billy we have now. It's like a new sleazy/man-whorish version of the character. Not to mention, his reunion with Mac has been completely forced, and they've yet to spark anything resembling chemistry.

And yeah, Billy Miller can't pull off emotional scenes or cry very well...

I agree Billy has been overexposed, but that doesn't stop me from loving the character, it just makes me wish they would stop using him quite so much. I'm very much OK with the change they've made in the character. I like him much more this way and when change is good I embrace it. He was gone long enough so that the change was not jarring. I don't see him as sleazy at all. A playboy and a jerk at times, but soaps need those.

I agree that Billy and Mac aren't working, but I have some hope the show knows that too. I think we may get more Chloe/Billy again down the road. That's my hope anyhow.

They need to put Mac back with JT. She seems to have more sparks with him

They need to put Mac back with JT. She seems to have more sparks with him

As long as it doesn't start as an affair, I think that's a good idea. It makes me mourn would could have been though. Victoria and Colleen fighting it out for JT could have been such a good story once upon a time.

I don't mind change in characters, but every time I see Billy, I can't help but feel like it's a completely different character from what David Tom portrayed. As I said before, people can change with time, but somehow I don't see the connection between this Billy and the Billy we knew when Tom was in the role, if that makes sense. I think the old Billy had a softer and more vulnerable side that made me like and sympathize with him more, this new version leaves me a bit cold. He's completely unsympathetic and forced, IMO.

At this point, I think they've completely ruined Chloe and Billy. Chloe seems desperate and loses all her self-worth when she's around Billy or trying to break him and Mac up. Chloe and Chance have no chemistry and are better off as friends, but I don't like who Chloe is when she's trying to "win" Billy. I think she degrades herself. I find the overall writing for women on Y&R already problematic.

Edited October 5, 200916 yr by Y&RWorldTurner

At this point, I think they've completely ruined Chloe and Billy. Chloe seems desperate and loses all her self-worth when she's around Billy or trying to break him and Mac up. Chloe and Chance have no chemistry and are better off as friends, but I don't like who Chloe is when she's trying to "win" Billy. I think she degrades herself. I find the overall writing for women on Y&R already problematic.

I think they could easily do Billy and Chloe again as a push pull relationship. I don't see Chloe as being overly desperate. She's a soap schemer, she's doing what those type characters do. And I think it's only right that she has to scheme and plot a little bit to get Billy. She is the bitch in this situation. It wouldn't make sense if Billy just fell into her arms after the things she's done. Neither of them are innocents, but I think eventually they are going to turn into a push/pull couple.

Chloe/Chance isn't working for me because Chance looks like he's nearly 30 and he's a virgin...that is not a turn on to me. At all. I just can't help thinking there is something wrong with him.

I agree about Chloe and Billy being degrading. Chloe started out as his stalker and he avoided accepting responsibility for Delia for months. Then when he did accept responsibility, he palmed her off on Chloe because he wanted Sharon, then Mackenzie. I don't believe he has any feelings for Chloe beyond wanting what he can't have, and I think her feelings for him are based on self-loathing. She even wanted to give him Delia to raise with Mac, so Delia wouldn't turn out to be a loser like her. That's just plain sad, and a cry for help.

I think they crossed a big line with Billy when they had him sleep with Sharon over and over, even before his wedding night. She was married to his brother, and she was clearly not well mentally. Yet he went for it anyway. Even worse, aside from some blink and you'll miss it anger from Jack, this was all swept under the rug, so it just sits there, peeking out from the carpet. This all seemed like a very sleazy way to show us what a "man with balls" Billy was, as Hogan Sheffer would say, and to once again emasculate Jack. And then, it was over. He got away with it in pure Victor Newman style.

I think I would be more accepting of his Victor bashing if Victor had been loyal to Billy and THEN Billy turned against Victor. As it is now, I have no reason to believe that if Victor had not screwed Billy over, Billy would not be shaking Traci down to give Victor Colleen's heart.

I need to see more of Billy actually supporting his family, not dropping in on them and using them to make himself feel better. I need to see more of Billy not in any sexual storyline. I need to see more of Billy not whining about other people and using them to make himself seem like a victim. Then I think the character would be more balanced.

Edited October 5, 200916 yr by CarlD2

I think they could easily do Billy and Chloe again as a push pull relationship. I don't see Chloe as being overly desperate. She's a soap schemer, she's doing what those type characters do. And I think it's only right that she has to scheme and plot a little bit to get Billy. She is the bitch in this situation. It wouldn't make sense if Billy just fell into her arms after the things she's done. Neither of them are innocents, but I think eventually they are going to turn into a push/pull couple.

Billy seems to think she's some nutjob obsessed with him. I think he's attacked to her somewhat, but I think he sees her as a stalker-type. Also, from what we've seen of their meeting via those flashbacks, we've been told that Chloe purposely set out to trap Billy and she stalked him until they got together as a couple. From that set-up alone, I found her to be completely desperate and pathetic, as well as someone who degrades herself for a man.

Chloe/Chance isn't working for me because Chance looks like he's nearly 30 and he's a virgin...that is not a turn on to me. At all. I just can't help thinking there is something wrong with him.

I agree, and really, I think Chloe feels more like Chance's shopping buddy than anything else. LOL!

Billy seems to think she's some nutjob obsessed with him. I think he's attacked to her somewhat, but I think he sees her as a stalker-type. Also, from what we've seen of their meeting via those flashbacks, we've been told that Chloe purposely set out to trap Billy and she stalked him until they got together as a couple. From that set-up alone, I found her to be completely desperate and pathetic, as well as someone who degrades herself for a man.

She was. But if we didn't have soap females doing these kinds of things then they would all be Mac. Who wants to watch a bunch of emotionally healthy people interacting? Soaps are based on dysfunctional, desperate people. That doesn't mean the character can't change, as I think Chloe has to some extent. I have no idea what Y&R has planned. Maybe Billy and Mac will stay together and have 10 kids, but it wouldn't surprise me if Billy keeps having thoughts of Chloe the more he sees her move on. If Billy and Chloe are ruined for all time, then pretty much every soap super couple is too because most of them have been through much worse and treated each other far worse at some point in the story.

She was. But if we didn't have soap females doing these kinds of things then they would all be Mac. Who wants to watch a bunch of emotionally healthy people interacting? Soaps are based on dysfunctional, desperate people. That doesn't mean the character can't change, as I think Chloe has to some extent. I have no idea what Y&R has planned. Maybe Billy and Mac will stay together and have 10 kids, but it wouldn't surprise me if Billy keeps having thoughts of Chloe the more he sees her move on. If Billy and Chloe are ruined for all time, then pretty much every soap super couple is too because most of them have been through much worse and treated each other far worse at some point in the story.

I think there's a line between being a soap schemer and a stalker. Chloe comes off as a desperate stalker that's always being treated like crap by Billy, and it causes her to get more obsessed. Billy has rarely ever shown any affection for her, and he's always treated her horribly, IMO. I've never sensed that he really loved her the way she loves him.

I agree with Carl in that I think Chloe being happy with someone else makes Billy upset, since that means he isn't #1 to her anymore, not necessarily that he loves her or anything.

I think there's a line between being a soap schemer and a stalker. Chloe comes off as a desperate stalker that's always being treated like crap by Billy, and it causes her to get more obsessed. Billy has rarely ever shown any affection for her, and he's always treated her horribly, IMO. I've never sensed that he really loved her the way she loves him.

I agree with Carl in that I think Chloe being happy with someone else makes Billy upset, since that means he isn't #1 to her anymore, not necessarily that he loves her or anything.

And up to this point, that's exactly what she deserves. Look at everything she's done! She's no one's victim, except her own and again, that's typical soap. I don't see Chloe as a real stalker so much as a determined goldigger. Talk about a soap staple. I'm not saying that I think Billy is in love with her right now. I'm saying that I think it's good the show destroyed them and that I think they can be rebuilt if the show chooses to go in that direction, which I hope they do. Chloe/Billy are much more interesting to me than Chloe/Chance or Mac/Billy. They've shown us a few little signs that maybe Billy does have some feelings for her, but whether the show goes in that direction is anyone's guess.