5 hours ago, Soaplovers said:

@DeeVee The actress that played Peggy was on a Locher Room interview and she was asked if her leaving the show was her choice, or the show's choice. She said the first time she left in 1977 was her choice because she and her hubby moved out west.. but when things didn't work out, she was bought back full time in 1979 and given next to nothing to do before she was let go the second time.

I think had Fran M opted to stay beyond 1977, the whole Roger story would have gone in a totally different direction because the Roger/Peggy connection and marriage seemed to still have a lot more mileage left in it that probably would have been explored in 1978 especially with the whole Ed/Rita/Holly situation ongoing.

When she came back in 1979, it was an odd time on the show where new stories had developed since she had left in late 1977 (The Phillip story, The Amanda story, etc) that there wasn't a place to fit her in. Had the Dobson's stayed beyond December 1979.. maybe they would have figured out where to place her.. but who knows.

Thanks. I didn't know she was let go the second time. There were still many in Springfield she had ties to. I guess Roger being beyond redemption at this point did limit her.

2 hours ago, DeeVee said:

But what really drove Alan most of the time was having to cover up something he did that was underhanded, or not exactly legal, although he would tell himself he did it for good reasons, (i.e. doing the baby switch when Elizabeth's baby was born dead). He was usually busy hiding something he did in the past, and that would force him to do more bad things, that he would also have to hide.

I quoted just that part because it summarized what went wrong with many soaps over the years.

Alan was a little shady yes, but not to the point where he intentionally caused someone direct harm.

Later on soap villains did things that they should have been punished for and it was allowed to slide or they were considered punished because someone wouldn't talk to them for a short time.

The moral balance was out of whack.

I could see Tom Hallick (ex-Brad Elliot Y&R) as a potential re-cast for Mike Bauer in the 80's/90's.

Maybe Rod Arrants as Ed. He would have been better than Peter Simon in my opinion

I always felt Rick was miscast with Michael O'Leary.

28 minutes ago, SoapDope78 said:

I could see Tom Hallick (ex-Brad Elliot Y&R) as a potential re-cast for Mike Bauer in the 80's/90's.

Maybe Rod Arrants as Ed. He would have been better than Peter Simon in my opinion

I always felt Rick was miscast with Michael O'Leary.

Mmm...Rod Arrants is the same age as Peter Simon-that could work.

I'm trying to think of a NY soap actor who could have been a good Mike recast in the 80's.

Dan Hamilton? 10 years younger than Dan but could probably play a little older.

3 hours ago, Paul Raven said:

Later on soap villains did things that they should have been punished for and it was allowed to slide or they were considered punished because someone wouldn't talk to them for a short time.

The moral balance was out of whack.

True. There used to be short-term expendable villains who did the really heinous stuff. Then you had the Machiavellian style villains who were on the edge like Alan but who never did anything so bad they had to be killed off or permanently written out.

I believe a lot of people were put off by soaps when that changed.

1 hour ago, SoapDope78 said:

I could see Tom Hallick (ex-Brad Elliot Y&R) as a potential re-cast for Mike Bauer in the 80's/90's.

Hallick's a great choice! He would have been a very good Mike.

30 minutes ago, Paul Raven said:

Maybe Rod Arrants as Ed.

This is so funny.

When we were talking a while back about Holly's ex-husband Deitrich Lindsay and how great it would have been if they had brought him on the show, Arrants was the first actor I thought of.

But I could see him as Ed, too.

32 minutes ago, Paul Raven said:

Dan Hamilton? 10 years younger than Dan but could probably play a little older.

Another great pick.

I think he also would have been a good Alan. He played a lot of on the edge characters, he had the charisma and charm to play him, though he might have come across as a little too young.

My personal top pick for an Alan recast would be Jim Storm. He ticks a lot of the boxes.

Never liked Jim Storm much on Y&R or B&B. But I see him more as Mike.

Rod Arrants is fine from what I've seen of him, but I think he's a little generic leading man for Ed.

I know Peter Simon's Ed isn't well-received by many, but I do think he captured the self-loathing aspects. They just never had him as the patriarch he could have been (and presumably Simon wasn't thrilled with that aspect of Ed).

I always liked Jim Storm on B&B. He might not have the depths of Chris Bernau or of GL's stronger years, but I could see him as Alan over Ron Raines.

I'm not sure who I would choose.

I might have had Nicolas Coster play Alan instead of putting him on ATWT as Eduardo. I know Nic was in an older age group for daytime by then, but was he really any less viable than the younger Ron Raines?

As for Ed - if only Daniel Hugh Kelly hadn't been busy in primetime. For actors who were available - do you think Larkin Malloy might have made a better Ed than RvV was?

I also think John Reilly could have made a decent recast of Alan or, after Peter Simon left in 1996, of Ed.

Edited 11 hours ago11 hr by DRW50

Bill Spencer Sr on B & B was basically a Alan Spaulding type so Jim Storm could have worked as an Alan Spaulding type.

Ed Bauer in the 1970s and thereafter never seemed like he should have been played by someone with leading man looks. The reason Mart, and to a lesser extent Peter, worked as Ed was because they didn't have leading man looks and played up certain parts of Ed's personality that weren't perfect. The Mid 80s Ed (Chuck Tyler AMC) was all wrong for the part and seemed too much of a generic good guy instead of the more tortured Ed Bauer of the other Ed's.

When watching Peter Simon's Ed (the one I grew up with), I saw that his Ed was written a bit more balanced and with a bit of humor when Long was in charge. He had good chemistry with both Ellen Dolan and Ellen Parker as Maureen...and it helped make Ed and Mo a tentpole couple.. and I also admit he had decent chemistry with Hilard Edson as Eve as well. His chemistry with MG as Holly was more of a friendship chemistry than romantic. When Long and Curlee were head-writing, Ed/Mo were end game with even Holly telling Ed that he belonged to Mo and even telling Mo the same thing.

The scenes I've seen of Mart's Ed show that he had good chemistry with Lenore's Rita and MG's Holly. I know that Ed and Vanessa had a brief relationship post-Rita and pre-Maureen.. but was that when Mart was still playing Ed or was that when Peter Simon was playing Ed?

@DRW50 In regards to Peggy, I think had Fran Myers opted not to leave GL when she did.. that the whole Roger story would have been different since Peggy represented the good/light that Roger was striving to be like and be with. Once she had had enough and left him (due to the actress leaving the show), any hope of redemption in Roger was lost and it lead to the toxic/stormy marriage with Holly and the affair he had with a young Hilary Bauer and the flirtation he had with Diane.

When she came back in 1979, I'm sure the show had her at the nurses station and trying to figure out where to place her next.. but the writer change happened so she got lost in the shuffle.

4 hours ago, SoapDope78 said:

I could see Tom Hallick (ex-Brad Elliot Y&R) as a potential re-cast for Mike Bauer in the 80's/90's.

Maybe Rod Arrants as Ed. He would have been better than Peter Simon in my opinion

I always felt Rick was miscast with Michael O'Leary.

Actually, Tom Hallick and Rod Arrants are both viable contenders for Mike and Ed. Arrants may have been a tad too young, but we've lived with that situation before.

Michael O'Leary was never the greatest choice for Rick, IMHO, but he only got worse as he aged and his mugging increased.

I could see Ron Hale as Dr Ed Bauer in the 90s. I think he had the Bauer look, if that makes sense.

Brian Kerwin is also someone who looks like a Bauer to me.

I could also see Hugo Napier as Alan in the 90s.

Edited 3 hours ago3 hr by Sapounopera

7 hours ago, Soaplovers said:

When watching Peter Simon's Ed (the one I grew up with), I saw that his Ed was written a bit more balanced and with a bit of humor when Long was in charge. He had good chemistry with both Ellen Dolan and Ellen Parker as Maureen...and it helped make Ed and Mo a tentpole couple.. and I also admit he had decent chemistry with Hilard Edson as Eve as well. His chemistry with MG as Holly was more of a friendship chemistry than romantic. When Long and Curlee were head-writing, Ed/Mo were end game with even Holly telling Ed that he belonged to Mo and even telling Mo the same thing.

The scenes I've seen of Mart's Ed show that he had good chemistry with Lenore's Rita and MG's Holly. I know that Ed and Vanessa had a brief relationship post-Rita and pre-Maureen.. but was that when Mart was still playing Ed or was that when Peter Simon was playing Ed?

I bust on Simon for Ed's turning into a dour wet blanket, but he didn't start out that way. Even in his second stint, it's not until after he and Mo renew their vows that Ed seems to start sliding into a moroseness.

About half of Ed and Vanessa is with Mart Hulswit. They start interacting more after Vanessa's suicide attempt (it's not a serious attempt, she was trying to get Ross' attention and then couldn't get a hold of him) in March '81. Mart is replaced in September. It's a really weird set of circumstances: Ed and Maeve start the relationship, Maeve goes on maternity leave late August/early September and Anna Stuart replaces her, there's a few episodes with Mart and Anna, and then Peter takes over for Mart. Peter and Anna play out the final breakup sometime in December. Maeve returns in January '82.

Edited 3 hours ago3 hr by P.J.

18 hours ago, alwaysAMC said:

Yep, thanks @DRW50 :)

I bought the book on Amazon last year and posted summaries of each chapter. I found it to be a really interesting read. She didn't really hold back much at all.

Thanks. This sounds like my kind of book. A lot is said about Kim and Reva, but both tell it like it is.

58 minutes ago, CrazySexyQ said:

Thanks. This sounds like my kind of book. A lot is said about Kim and Reva, but both tell it like it is.

You're 100% right there :)

10 hours ago, DRW50 said:

I always liked Jim Storm on B&B. He might not have the depths of Chris Bernau or of GL's stronger years, but I could see him as Alan over Ron Raines.

He was on Y&R during a period I didn't watch it much. (I never really watched B&B). When he was on Dark Shadows he played a mute ghost for months. His performance was so intense that without saying a word he scared the crap out of the audience. When he played a human character later, he was a schemer and someone who easily manipulated women, and the audience just loved him. Perfect for Alan, IMO.

The only one more popular with the DS female audience at the time was David Selby. He also would have been a fantastic Alan, but he was eating it up on prime time from the 80s on.

Since all of this moot and time has long past, if I could pick ANYONE, even someone who would never do a soap, my ideal actor to play Alan during the 90s would have Chris Sarandon. He can play funny and charming, but also play villainous and dark. He's handsome without being pretty handsome, and believably play a powerful person. Those are the qualities that I believe an actor playing Alan needed to work.

I love fantasy casting. This is so much fun.

10 hours ago, DRW50 said:

I might have had Nicolas Coster play Alan instead of putting him on ATWT as Eduardo. I know Nic was in an older age group for daytime by then, but was he really any less viable than the younger Ron Raines?

As for Ed - if only Daniel Hugh Kelly hadn't been busy in primetime. For actors who were available - do you think Larkin Malloy might have made a better Ed than RvV was?

I also think John Reilly could have made a decent recast of Alan or, after Peter Simon left in 1996, of Ed.

Coster and Reilly would both have been good--they were not that much older than Bernau. I would lean a little bit in favor of Coster. He was really good at playing complex characters.

I believe Reilly left GH around the time Raines was cast. Maybe he even auditioned for the part, who knows.

During Bernau's first run, he was replaced briefly twice (he was ill or maybe he was holding out for more money during contract negotiations). First David Bailey, who played Russ Matthews on AW, replaced him for a few episodes, and then later on Wayne Tippit who played Ted on SFT. At least one of the episodes with Tippit is available on the German channel. I have to say it was EXTREMELY weird to see him play opposite Elvera. He just did not work for me as Alan. But I could see David as a permanent replacement for him.

DHK I think was a bit too young for the part of Ed. Larkin Malloy--again, too young, and he played rich snots almost his whole career, I think for a reason. Even though Kyle was brought up by a madam, I don't see him having the middle-class vibe Ed would need.

Age aside, Ed is not so easy to come up with a good recast. Yeah, he's the good guy, but he also has demons. Ron Hale--yeah, I could see it. If I just think of him as Roger on RH, I would think he suited Alan better, but he could play other kinds characters. He was only a little bit younger than Simon, so age-wise he would have worked.

Edited 43 minutes ago43 min by DeeVee

I can't see Larkin Malloy as Ed Bauer at all. While I liked Malloy in his roles on The Edge of Night, there was a sophistication in him and his acting that doesn't speak Bauer to me. Besides a decade-plus younger than the other actors who had played Ed, I can't picture Malloy as the father of Michael O'Leary's Rick, especially since Malloy was only four years older than O'Leary. Also, Malloy wasn't available when the recast happened. He was still on Edge, which didn't get word of its cancellation until late October/early November. Though a few years older than Gentry, Hulswit, and Simon, I can see David O'Brien from The Doctors as a possible Ed.