They've made it difficult to be invested in most of the characters. Jack's been so unrecognizable since they took over.

I will never know what their plans were for the teens. Something obviously happened to make them very abruptly drop focus on Noah/Eden. I don't believe it was bad fan reaction, because other unpopular stories have kept going. And I still don't know the point of bringing Abby back, her relationship with Victor was superrushed (saying "DADDY!" and running into his arms in her first scene) and it's as if Brad never existed. They should have said Abby was in the Scotty Fenmore Boarding School.

Carl, I think they dropped Noah/Eden because once they got the sex part, they couldn't think of anything else to do with them. Eden is such a tacked on & useless character. There's no room on canvas for Michael, do we really need to give him a sister? PTB are terrible at long-term story. MAB made a huge mistake with Noah. He should have been gay (with a crush on Rafe) and MAB should have told a traditional coming out story in the vein of Bianca on AMC or Luke on ATWT. MAB really screwed herself and the show over by trying to compete against the other soaps with her "non-traditional" gay stories. All of her other stories, especially the romances where the women act like they're from the 1950s and the men are assholes, are stuck in the last century. But with the gay stories she wants be different and "modern"? On a show where they don't have the guts to show a gay kiss, MAB is going to be cutting edge? How can one person have so much stupid inside of them. You just have to shake her head at what a clueless chick this woman is. KS is a wonderful actor. Giving him something meaty like Noah coming to terms with his sexuality while dealing with disparate reactions from his family would have been great, not just for Noah but Nick, Sharon and Phyllis. Part of the reason why N/S/P are so unsympathetic is because it's all about them. Even Summer's coma is all about them. It would do a lot for Nick's character if he had to play supporting to Noah in a storyline and if Nick really learned to see his son as a man, separate from him. Making Nick someone who questions his own parenting and then learns to accept and celebrate his son for who he is would have gone a long way to making Nick likable. Nick's douchiness towards Sharon & Phyllis would have been mitigated somewhat by him being a real friend to Noah.

Eden just needs to go back to the Ashram or killed by Abby while that idiot texts and drives. Insta-PSA! If you're a blonde teen moron that was created in a test tube, don't text & drive, or you'll kill a wannabe hippie chick!

Poor Zapato. He was one of the few likable characters on the show.

Edited August 5, 200916 yr by cara mia

Today, MAN. What a study in contrasts. The scoobies were a flaming pile of dog dookie, while the Kay /Jill scenes at the end were WRENCHING.... and NO NO NO those two have never had any conversation where Kay portrayed Phillip as anyhting less than the love of her life. Between this and her admitting last week that she drove Phillip off the cliff on PURPOSE. Damn... did Kay's stroke finally remove all states of denial from her brain? Hendrickson lights up the screen every time she's on, her and Driscoll work well together. I love how she's been developed. What is it with the SHITTY background music today? Every fan in the UNIVERSE hates those cheap synthesizer pieces, and TPTB KNOW IT. What it their damn problem??!! Where's my RAFE? SH!T. This show is now reduced to good scenes here and there with no flow, and the most horrible pacing known to man. Who's fool ass idea was this? IT's the pacing that ruining everything.

I wish they'd done a storyline where Noah decided to save himself until marriage, and became a born-again Christian. I think there's a market to do this type of storyline without being heavy-handed. They also could have involved Brock, since Brock was the main religious force on the show in the 70s. Noah should have had more of a reaction to his parents than just yelling at them. I think he would desperately want to be the opposite of them.

Jill and Billy are two peas in the same pod. They love to lay blame and make themselves be the victim, the way Billy treats Jill is IDENTICAL To what Jill does with everyone else. That said he was out of line and she should have trounced him...

I LOVE LOVE LOVE Kay. She and JC are the North Star of this show and you can set your ships by them.

All in all, in spite of the ridiculousness of it all, I'm enjoying it holistically... I think at the very most, I find it more APPROACHABLE now. I always found Y&R had this "High horse" thing going on for a long time, where its viewers seemed to be from this club. I always watched DAYS and found it get-into-able but Y&R seemed on another plane. Maybe it was what good soap should be in contrast to craziness, but it never really was MY show (I've gotten much more into it)... Kinda silly, but I just feel I relate more with it (not the crazy stories), just in the dumbing down of it in general... though they took the dumbing-down much too far lol

I wish they'd done a storyline where Noah decided to save himself until marriage, and became a born-again Christian. I think there's a market to do this type of storyline without being heavy-handed. They also could have involved Brock, since Brock was the main religious force on the show in the 70s. Noah should have had more of a reaction to his parents than just yelling at them. I think he would desperately want to be the opposite of them.

ACTUALLY that would be perfect, you can give the crazy-right a voice on this show. Then when he pontificates against Gay people, the sane ones will pass him off as crazy and the crazies will think he's speaking their langugae. Everyone gets accounted for and opinions get the weight they deserve from people in order of impressionability.

"You're a virgin who can't drive."

CHER: Daddy's a litigator. Those are the scariest kinds of lawyers. Even Lucy, our maid, is terrified of him. He's so good he gets paid five hundred dollars an hour just to fight with people, but he fights with me for free 'cause I'm his daughter!

ABBY: Daddy's an a$$hole. Those are the scariest kinds of CEOs! Even Estella, our maid, is terrified of him. He's so good he gets paid five hundred dollars an hour just to mumble and ignore people, but he ignores me for free 'cause I'm his daughter!

-----

CHER: Isn't my house classic? The columns date all the way back to 1972. Wasn't my Mom a betty? She died when I was just a baby. A fluke accident during a routine liposuction.

ABBY: Isn't my house classic? The tiny, dark little sets date all the way back to 1973. Wasn't my Mom an ashley? She died when I was just a teenager. A fluke accident while being gaslighted by her half-blind, cross-dressing stepson.

Loves it!!! Many LOLz on the bus this morning.

OMG, I found Katherine's confession to be SINGULAR! Just out of the park. If this is true, and she believes it, what wisdom Kay has come to embody?

I also found Jill's reaction to be authentic. More with her face than her words, Jill admitted she had internalized all that loathing as self-loathing. If Kay now was pulling the plug out of the bathtub full of hate, what was left for Jill? Her whole adult life has been fashioned in reactive hate around Kay? For Kay NOW to admit maybe she was wrong....well...what does that do to Jill's whole identity?

A fascinating moment. I hope it is continued. It was the best ending to this show that I can remember seeing in ages. I also liked the whole attempt to deepen some of the Chancellor perspectives -- Chance's, Billy's.

Kudos to Lisa Connor and Theresa Zimmerman for a just-terrific episode!

I agree. Kay confessing that she hated Jill more than she loved Phillip has never been done before. EVER. That scene was so surrealistic by highlighting the magnanimous suffering the Kay and Jill 30 year feud has caused.

I adore Chloe and Chance.

But I hate Amber and Daniel. I have had enough of Amber and Daniel, and Jana and Kevin. I only want to see them support other characters in stories at this point. I liked Amber and Lauren living together ONLY if we actually get to see them do something with Lauren and Fenmore.

I don't know who invented the idea of female dominated reverse male rape but it needs to die and soon. No one wants to see rape. Period.

Watching Monday's (US) episode right now. Did I just hear Jack telling Billy that Sharon wasn't worthy and that he was kicking her to the curb? And that "sap Jack" was gone and the old Jack was back? Oh, happy day!

Peter Bergman did so well in that scene with Phyllis when she told him he must be thrilled about becoming a daddy.

I liked Amber and Lauren living together ONLY if we actually get to see them do something with Lauren and Fenmore.

Amber would be SO much more tolerable if Maria used her with Lauren.

If she does prefer Cane, it's because Cane has supported her and been kind to her

Impersonationg Jill's dead son is NOT supporting or being kind to her.

Frankly I think Billy Miller is somewhat overrated, he doesn't sell most of these emotional scenes very well for me.

Exactly.

Miller's problem is he's NOT sincere which works at times for Billy the character but not Billy the actor.

I'm glad Chance defended Jill.

I LOVE Chance defending Jill.

Billy & Chance as fighting family. Yes.

Billy & Cane as fighting family. No.

Exactly.

Miller's problem is he's NOT sincere which works at times for Billy the character but not Billy the actor.

That's the best description I've seen of this.

I decided not to watch today's show. I'm not going to go boycott or call PETA or anything but I've seen dogs put down, I don't need to see it on my soap.

Edited August 5, 200916 yr by CarlD2

Amber would be SO much more tolerable if Maria used her with Lauren.

I don't mind Lauren in scenes with Amber since they do have a long history this show likes to ignore, but you know with Maria it will be all about Lauren propping Amber just like they have Michael prop Daniel. It should be the other way around.

That's the best description I've seen of this.

I decided not to watch today's show. I'm not going to go boycott or call PETA or anything but I've seen dogs put down, I don't need to see it on my soap.

It was sad and so unnecessary. Anyway, I think Adan could have killed Zapato just as easily at MJ. MJ wanted to make Zapato pay, but after Ashley told Adam that Zapato gives her comfort, I could see the sick jerk killing Zapato to further torture Ashley and get a shot in at Victor at the same time.

As for Billy Miller, I don't mind the actor too much, but I do mind him being shoved down our throats and put into every storyline. Billy is not ready to replace Jack as Victor's rival and frankly I don't want to see that.

Edited August 5, 200916 yr by lmfan

but you know with Maria it will be all about Lauren propping Amber just like they have Michael prop Daniel. It should be the other way around.

Pretty much.

Amber should've NEVER written Katherine's book.

THAT should've been Mackenzie.

Lauren & Amber should have the relationship TPTB are trying to force with Katherine & Amber but that won't happen since TPTB don't see Lauren as anything but a Baldwin-Fisher prop.