I guess it's just people's perspective. If Ron didn't know OLTL's history, he would be called out on that - like Dena was. If he brings up history (or too much history), he's called out on living in the past. The question for me is do I want a writer who knows OLTL's history or not? The answer is easy. Yes I want the writer who knows the history.

If I'm in the minority, that's fine. I can't do anything about it. All I can do is enjoy OLTL which I am immensely.

Just to be clear when I said you're in the minority I meant that I think most of the people watching have been watching longer and are therefore more interested in reliving the "good ole days." I think you're in the minority regarding your length of viewership. But even if you're in the minority you aren't alone.

She's coming. She can't resist.

Edited November 8, 200817 yr by marceline

Quoting part of your post

No you don't alienate fans, but what the heck do you think Pratt is doing? Name me 1 fanbase besides Adam/Erica fans that aren't getting crapped on? Bianca fans are PISSED about the stupidity of her return storyline/character assassination, Zendall fans are pissed at Zach's character assassination, Aidan/Greenlee fans are pissed at the character assassination of Aidan for Rylee, Jesse & Angie fans are pissed that Pratt has Jesse acting like an ass and Angie a stepford wife, and so on and so forth

They aren't going to learn to trust again when the show gives them NO reason to trust them, when they continually keep doing stuff to piss off alot of the fans

But you state the key thing - it is just certain fans that are mad.

The past few writers have concentrated on trying to make fan bases happy and not produce a well rounded show that is balanced. right now Pratt is writing for everyone and it is the general fans who are coming back. And it is those general fans who are liking it and even liking some of the couples they never liked before. There is not one couple on the show right now that I hate or am tired of. I even like Zendell right now.

Pratt is not trying to make fan bases happy. He is trying to produce a good show and it has gotten people talking again and people for the most part enjoying the whole show.

CBS shows like Y&R have know that for a long time. You work to cater to one group and you aren't going to move because as soon as you do something to anger that group then they are gone and where does that leave you. It leaves you with a bunch of fans who have watched out of loyalty but are angry because you have pissed on them to satisfy a certain aspect of your viewers.

I love this Zendell story and I cannot wait for Kendall to wake up and go apesh*t. I love that Bianca seems more real. I love Annie and am even enjoying the Ryan/Annie/Greenlee story for the first time in a long time. I love the anger that Frankie is feeling and that there is conflict in Angie and Jesse's relationship because it makes it all seem more real to me. For the last few months the few times I did tune in since the wedding I hated the robotic Stepford couple of Jesse and Angie. They were so boring. Now they seem real.

I hope that Pratt stays on this same trend. He is not going to split up all these couples but he is creating some angst in them and creating stories like of the old days where the fans of these couples if they will just sit back and chill they can enjoy the ride and wait for the big payoff in the end.

These are the kind of stories that made soaps and esp. made AMC the great soap it was in the 70's and the 80's.

If soaps are ever going to be successful again they have got to concentrate on the whole show and quit worrying about the fanbases. Just look around at the positive talk from the general fans of the show. And please general fans don't do like we have done in the past. Don't just sit back and not let your voices heard. Make sure that Pratt and ABC know how much we love this AMC. Please don't let it go back to the sextette from Hell. If it does AMC will never ever get me back again.

But you state the key thing - it is just certain fans that are mad.

The past few writers have concentrated on trying to make fan bases happy and not produce a well rounded show that is balanced. right now Pratt is writing for everyone and it is the general fans who are coming back. And it is those general fans who are liking it and even liking some of the couples they never liked before. There is not one couple on the show right now that I hate or am tired of. I even like Zendell right now.

Pratt is not trying to make fan bases happy. He is trying to produce a good show and it has gotten people talking again and people for the most part enjoying the whole show.

CBS shows like Y&R have know that for a long time. You work to cater to one group and you aren't going to move because as soon as you do something to anger that group then they are gone and where does that leave you. It leaves you with a bunch of fans who have watched out of loyalty but are angry because you have pissed on them to satisfy a certain aspect of your viewers.

I love this Zendell story and I cannot wait for Kendall to wake up and go apesh*t. I love that Bianca seems more real. I love Annie and am even enjoying the Ryan/Annie/Greenlee story for the first time in a long time. I love the anger that Frankie is feeling and that there is conflict in Angie and Jesse's relationship because it makes it all seem more real to me. For the last few months the few times I did tune in since the wedding I hated the robotic Stepford couple of Jesse and Angie. They were so boring. Now they seem real.

I hope that Pratt stays on this same trend. He is not going to split up all these couples but he is creating some angst in them and creating stories like of the old days where the fans of these couples if they will just sit back and chill they can enjoy the ride and wait for the big payoff in the end.

These are the kind of stories that made soaps and esp. made AMC the great soap it was in the 70's and the 80's.

If soaps are ever going to be successful again they have got to concentrate on the whole show and quit worrying about the fanbases. Just look around at the positive talk from the general fans of the show. And please general fans don't do like we have done in the past. Don't just sit back and not let your voices heard. Make sure that Pratt and ABC know how much we love this AMC. Please don't let it go back to the sextette from Hell. If it does AMC will never ever get me back again.

AMEN!

Also its a postive that AMC rose from last year when B&E had their time.

But you state the key thing - it is just certain fans that are mad.

The past few writers have concentrated on trying to make fan bases happy and not produce a well rounded show that is balanced. right now Pratt is writing for everyone and it is the general fans who are coming back. And it is those general fans who are liking it and even liking some of the couples they never liked before. There is not one couple on the show right now that I hate or am tired of. I even like Zendell right now.

Pratt is not trying to make fan bases happy. He is trying to produce a good show and it has gotten people talking again and people for the most part enjoying the whole show.

CBS shows like Y&R have know that for a long time. You work to cater to one group and you aren't going to move because as soon as you do something to anger that group then they are gone and where does that leave you. It leaves you with a bunch of fans who have watched out of loyalty but are angry because you have pissed on them to satisfy a certain aspect of your viewers.

I love this Zendell story and I cannot wait for Kendall to wake up and go apesh*t. I love that Bianca seems more real. I love Annie and am even enjoying the Ryan/Annie/Greenlee story for the first time in a long time. I love the anger that Frankie is feeling and that there is conflict in Angie and Jesse's relationship because it makes it all seem more real to me. For the last few months the few times I did tune in since the wedding I hated the robotic Stepford couple of Jesse and Angie. They were so boring. Now they seem real.

I hope that Pratt stays on this same trend. He is not going to split up all these couples but he is creating some angst in them and creating stories like of the old days where the fans of these couples if they will just sit back and chill they can enjoy the ride and wait for the big payoff in the end.

These are the kind of stories that made soaps and esp. made AMC the great soap it was in the 70's and the 80's.

If soaps are ever going to be successful again they have got to concentrate on the whole show and quit worrying about the fanbases. Just look around at the positive talk from the general fans of the show. And please general fans don't do like we have done in the past. Don't just sit back and not let your voices heard. Make sure that Pratt and ABC know how much we love this AMC. Please don't let it go back to the sextette from Hell. If it does AMC will never ever get me back again.

I need to second Kyle's Amen to this!

Maybe this is a stupid question, don't know. I asked this question before but I was hoping someone here could maybe expand on it. If DVR watchers are not important to advertisers, why are they included in the ratings reported. Press releases by CBS, NBC, and ABC all seem to include DVR numbers as part of their ratings. Just curious.

Also looking at these number agian CBS is now in deep sh*t! Every soap has lost viewers from last year and look at Y&R numbers!

Bloom needs to be fired ASAP!

Is CBS actually running any promos on their sweeps? I haven't seen any but that doesn't mean a thing. I have actually been enjoying Y&R for the first time in ages and I am shocked at the bump down which makes me think they haven't promo'd their sweeps stories.

Also looking at these number agian CBS is now in deep sh*t! Every soap has lost viewers from last year and look at Y&R numbers!

Bloom needs to be fired ASAP!

No, no, no! CBS Broadcast is in deep sh*t...kinda/sorta.

But put the facts of the last weeks together:

- Soapnet at an all time high, with Y&R blowing all other shows out of the water in raw numbers. I think we said this adds 15% or so to the audience?

- Sara Bibel reporting that the 7-day DVR numbers (which advertisers don't care about) adding about 25% to the audience

- Unknown numbers at cbs.com, hulu, fancast, msn tv, legal Youtube...unknown, BUT think of this: EVERY WEEK, on their home page, CBS lists Y&R as one of their "top" streamed shows (no other soaps)

I have been as noisy as the rest of us about the "decline of soaps" and "the end is near" and all that jazz. But it is easy to look at these broadcast Neilsen trends and think all is lost. But when you ADD IN the numbers from these different venues, you suddenly realize that it is not out of the question that Y&R reaches 8-10 million people a day.

8-10 MILLION!

A DAY!

What it says (and I can't speak to the rest of the daytime lineup) is that Y&R is still pulling numbers that aren't so far off from its' glory days!

It also says that if the chief revenue model still relies on same-day ad rates on CBS broadcast...well, then we're all f*cked.

If almost half your viewers are watching your show in other ways....they need to count...and you need to get the revenues from those other venues.

For me, meanwhile, I'm retreating from the doom and gloom a bit. These combined Y&R numbers are AMAZING...and they rival some of primetime viewership. The future is HERE. The audience is still HERE. Let's catch up with the business model!

No, no, no! CBS Broadcast is in deep sh*t...kinda/sorta.

But put the facts of the last weeks together:

- Soapnet at an all time high, with Y&R blowing all other shows out of the water in raw numbers. I think we said this adds 15% or so to the audience?

- Sara Bibel reporting that the 7-day DVR numbers (which advertisers don't care about) adding about 25% to the audience

- Unknown numbers at cbs.com, hulu, fancast, msn tv, legal Youtube...unknown, BUT think of this: EVERY WEEK, on their home page, CBS lists Y&R as one of their "top" streamed shows (no other soaps)

I have been as noisy as the rest of us about the "decline of soaps" and "the end is near" and all that jazz. But it is easy to look at these broadcast Neilsen trends and think all is lost. But when you ADD IN the numbers from these different venues, you suddenly realize that it is not out of the question that Y&R reaches 8-10 million people a day.

8-10 MILLION!

A DAY!

What it says (and I can't speak to the rest of the daytime lineup) is that Y&R is still pulling numbers that aren't so far off from its' glory days!

It also says that if the chief revenue model still relies on same-day ad rates on CBS broadcast...well, then we're all f*cked.

If almost half your viewers are watching your show in other ways....they need to count...and you need to get the revenues from those other venues.

For me, meanwhile, I'm retreating from the doom and gloom a bit. These combined Y&R numbers are AMAZING...and they rival some of primetime viewership. The future is HERE. The audience is still HERE. Let's catch up with the business model!

I thought Y&R had authorized their show now to be available(authorized) on Youtube and that the clips available there will have something like 10 second commercial clips included. It's maybe a tiny step in the right direction.

I thought Y&R had authorized their show now to be available(authorized) on Youtube and that the clips available there will have something like 10 second commercial clips included. It's maybe a tiny step in the right direction.

CBS has been remarkably aggressive with the online stuff...which is why calls for Barbie Bloom's ouster seem premature to me. I assume she is either behind, or in front, of this aggressive online push.

You are correct...all of the legal online streams (Youtube, hulu, fancast, msn tv, etc) have embedded (and non-skippable commercials). There aren't many commercials (3-4/38 minute episode, usually, the same one each time), so many people don't get annoyed. The low clutter/high repetition of the ads (and often an 'envelope surround' that carries the brand logo throughout the entire episode) seems to me like it would be a much more effective, high-value form of advertising. (Not to mention more online viewers are likely to be in that 18-49 'sweet spot' Madison Avenue craves).

I dont' think the financials have caught up with the shifting market...but they will.

I'd also like to see these broadcast networks ABANDON their traditional over-the-air local affiliates. If they'd shift to an all-cable/all-satellite, they could supplement their advertiser revenues with basic cable licensing fees. Getting a stable revenue source that is not sooooo dependent on advertisers would seem to be an other important part of the formula.

The local affiliates can fill their dance cards with cheap schlocky syndicated judge shows, talk shows, and endlessly schlocky crime-filled local news. They'd probably be happier about that anyway.

No, no, no! CBS Broadcast is in deep sh*t...kinda/sorta.

But put the facts of the last weeks together:

- Soapnet at an all time high, with Y&R blowing all other shows out of the water in raw numbers. I think we said this adds 15% or so to the audience?

- Sara Bibel reporting that the 7-day DVR numbers (which advertisers don't care about) adding about 25% to the audience

- Unknown numbers at cbs.com, hulu, fancast, msn tv, legal Youtube...unknown, BUT think of this: EVERY WEEK, on their home page, CBS lists Y&R as one of their "top" streamed shows (no other soaps)

I have been as noisy as the rest of us about the "decline of soaps" and "the end is near" and all that jazz. But it is easy to look at these broadcast Neilsen trends and think all is lost. But when you ADD IN the numbers from these different venues, you suddenly realize that it is not out of the question that Y&R reaches 8-10 million people a day.

8-10 MILLION!

A DAY!

This could be a little higher than reality but ca. 4.75 million (+ca 1.25 BELATED) viewers plus 0.7 mil. SoapNet watchers and good chunk of online streaming your at least between 7 - 8 million a day... Putting this is in perspective with far more costly primetime series which on average pull in the same numbers at best, I don't think Y&R is doing any bad in such a shape...

I fear however that those other shows which aren't feautured on such a multi-plattform basis aren't doing that well.

Edited November 8, 200817 yr by sheilaforever

Damn, GH moved back up. I don't get why people keep watching that [!@#$%^&*]. I only Tivo it and Fastforward almost the entire show and only watch scenes that interest me from the SOD recaps.

This could be a little higher than reality but ca. 4.75 million (+ca 1.25 BELATED) viewers plus 0.7 mil. SoapNet watchers and good chunk of online streaming your at least between 7 - 8 million a day... Putting this is in perspective with far more costly primetime series which on average pull in the same numbers at best, I don't think Y&R is doing any bad in such a shape...

I fear however that those other shows which aren't feautured on such a multi-plattform basis aren't doing that well.

Not to mention CBS offers their daytime shows online- so I don't imagine they're losing much sleep when their ratings aren't soaring.

Not to mention CBS offers their daytime shows online- so I don't imagine they're losing much sleep when their ratings aren't soaring.

And aren't Y&R and B&B shown internationally? When you add it all up those shows have million more promotional options available to them. If they were to REALLY exploit them I think we'd see some interesting results. IMO, the closest they came was with "Sudden Impact" but they need to develop a more long term strategy. The downside is that advertisers are stuck on the Nielsens and Y&R lurches around in the Nielsens like a housewife loaded on Ambien and box wine.

Coversely, ABC is stuck in prehistoric era in so many ways. I really don't know how Frons keeps his job. The only explanation I can think of is that his superiors are equally narrow-minded. I console myself with the thought that there's some hot shot business student working behind the scenes to sabotage him. In my mind she's a minority lesbian, a Donna Brazile type. It adds to the justice factor.

Edited November 9, 200817 yr by marceline

Damn, GH moved back up. I don't get why people keep watching that [!@#$%^&*]. I only Tivo it and Fastforward almost the entire show and only watch scenes that interest me from the SOD recaps.

Yet, you still Tivo it....