P.J.

Scotty still looks damn good. Better than HB any damn day of the week.

I didn't mean to make it sound like you couldn't appreciate it---just that I know the monk's robes and spooky castle seem slightly more camp without the entire context. LOL...maybe I should watch it ---it seems appropriate for Halloween.

I think it's hard to watch an episode or clips here and there and appreciate the true impact of a reveal like that. Do you have the Barbara/James dvd? I still curse the day I decided to wait and order it for Xmas.

It's too bad Scott was completely derailed by Doug's death and JB's HIV. Had he continued as the brother with a chip on his shoulder (instead of the clown he became with Doug Wert---which wasn't even DW's fault, the writing did a 180) I think it really would have revitalized Tom and Lisa.

Think of how daytime would have been different had Marland stayed HW at GL---no Reva Shayne? The mind boggles.

The story I've heard is that P&G brought him on as a consultant, then gave him the choice of ATWT or GL. He chose GL, (I think) because he considered it a stronger show at the time.

"Aunt Mary" was Hutch and Linc's biological mother. Played by Lisby Larsen who was also Calla Matthews on GL. I don't know if you can really "train" someone that way. There are very few writers that honestly seemed as committed to each and every character as Marland was. You can show them how to outline, plot, develop a character---but the way he was able to weave characters in and out of stories--that was a gift.

^^that's why all of John's caterwauling re: Lucinda's schemes was so much BS. The only difference between John and Lucinda's obsession with their kids was Lily wasn't Lucinda's by blood. John's manipulations re: Andy were legion and before Lucinda knew him.

Susan was Dan's first wife. Dan didn't marry Liz until after Paul's (his brother's) death. Emily was born before Andy.

^^^yeah, Lisa especially seemed to be only used as a plot point. "Oh, Casey needs to turn bad---he might as well steal from Grandma Lisa."

They did bring Grant back for a handful of episodes around the time Earl died. Or they were solving who killed Earl and Glenn was gaslighting Lisa maybe? IMDB doesn't have anything listed for him after 1987 though. Maybe he retired. He's still alive and turns 80 in Dec.

Yeah...see, I don't think Kim had really been "forgiven" for going after her sister's husband either. Thus she was forced into a loveless marriage, and then a triangle from hell. It's just because everything moved slower in those days that we think "geez, six years after the fact, why didn't they just hook Bob and Kim up?" They were shown developing their friendship---and I think DH and KH always underplayed that "if only" vibe. And this is before the "supercouple". I think EPs/HWs were less inclined to keep revisiting a couple once they were done.

Well, I do think part of the reason was Bob and Kim were tentpole characters in completely separate stories. Kim and Dan were very popular...it's the old axiom---you never want to be the rebound girl/guy, 'cause they never last. And I don't think Nick even lasted two years, did he? I don't know if he was meant to be a short term character, but it sure seems like it. And new HW always want to bring their own characters in. It really is a credit to Marland that he sought to understand what the fans of the show already liked, and worked with a lot of cast that was already here.

I think they were mentioned as running a charity in Montega occasionally, but whether that was something Goutman originated or simply continued, I don't know. Andy was rarely, if ever mentioned, and he was actually on during Goutman's run. I tend to think the actors simply adlibbed things about family when Bob was sick, or some other family emergency was going on.

Yeah, I think Forsythe lost a lot of interest in ATWT after his run in The Best Little Whorehouse in Texas.

Well, I think they started out not getting along too well. I think they'd both mellowed by 2003(?) when Ben won the emmy. The only thing I've really ever read about Jennifer that suggests to me she wasn't some woe-is-me character is that she wanted to return to nursing after giving birth to Frannie, while Bob wanted her to stay home. I wonder if the youth movement watered down female characters. You can't write an interesting 30-ish character mooning over the first stable boy she meets, kwim?

I'd never thought about it that way...but when you realize Lisa was the face of ATWT in the '60's, (along with Penny), it doesn't seem to fit the mold, does it? Kim, Susan and Joyce were all fan favorites, and they certainly weren't the girl next door mold. I would love to be able to see Jennifer as a comparison to Kim.

Well, if you think about it, they were the only stable couple left at the time---Bob and Kim were off marrying newbies, Nancy and Chris went on hiatus in '81 or so...wow, it's kind of weird to think about it---a time before Bob and Kim were Oakdale's bastion couple.

I think it's the white hair. Henderson was about 63 then so, he's pretty age appropriate for four grown children. But nowadays, we don't see that gray hair anymore.

*thumps head* The sister of my sister is not necessarily my sister. Now that I can't believe I typed that, of course I remember Babs was having issues with "the living proof" her mother was cheated on. It is so hard keeping track of such twisted family trees. What strikes me about the costumes is there's no sense of anyone having a personal style. Poor Betsy was wearing the same clothes her aunts were. I kind of spaced that Kim was raising Betsy and Andy at the same time. And even though I know Kim was married to Dan---I never remember thinking of her as Ellen's daughter in law even when Ellen was still on the show.

Young Peter Simon with his Bee-Gee hair cracks me up. The Stewart women as sluts seems to have started WAY before Emily---both Dee and Annie are/were involved with married men. Tom, Annie and Dee seem so old. Right now, Tom looks 45, FCOL. I watched the next episode, with a Babs/Melinda scene. It's weird seeing Babs have a sister to talk to. It's only a few years later that she hates Sabrina who's popped up as her half-sister, and then there's the whole Frannie/Darryl/Babs thing that soured their relationship.

But soap operas are about relationships. I don't think Annie or Dee was any more or less focused on their romances than say Kim or Barbara were. We just see Kim and Barbara in a more rounded way because they grew and evolved over time whereas Annie and Dee (in the scheme of things) were short term characters. I think the writers tried to make Annie and Dee ATWT's version of Y&R's Laurie and Leslie Brooks---and it failed miserably, imo.

Of course Betsy needed to be a romantic lead, she's a legacy child with a troubled, tangled childhood RIPE with issues. And I don't think you could have recast Davidson earlier, since a major part of the '70's dealt with her paternity secret.

No, I haven't seen Frannie in these episodes (or even heard her mentioned). I don't really think she had any stories until she was SOARSed in 83/84.

I know at some point some of Betsy's inheritance was used to establish a shelter for teens/some kind of youth center (on what later became McKechnie Island if I'm not mistaken). And I do think Betsy did get some kind of "experiments with drugs" kind of story, briefly. I remember something about a party where something bad happened, but it may have also been Frannie.