14 minutes ago, Vee said:

Not if they're very different men with different people, IMO. But then I'd still not have Jason around lol.

Yeah, you are right.  I don't even think Drew is that similar to Jason.  I just know the show completely ignored BM's Drew the minute SBu came back.  If anything, I find this Drew to be closer to Jax.   He doesn't have the Sonny hate, but CM's Drew has become just a nice, attractive business man.   Honestly, if you put aside the Australian thing, CM actually probably would have been better as a Jax recast.    

2 minutes ago, carolineg said:

Yeah, you are right.  I don't even think Drew is that similar to Jason.  I just know the show completely ignored BM's Drew the minute SBu came back.  If anything, I find this Drew to be closer to Jax.   He doesn't have the Sonny hate, but CM's Drew has become just a nice, attractive business man.   Honestly, if you put aside the Australian thing, CM actually probably would have been better as a Jax recast.    

I would allow Drew to have some semblance of a company on the side but put him back with the WSB/PCPD - he was a Marine/Special Forces/whatever. Which is what they should've done with bearded CM at the outset but here we are.

Edited January 4, 20241 yr by Vee

Well, they supposedly played on that angle of Drew during Greenville but the character was said to have saved everyone when he really did nothing. 

I did not like Cameron on AMC but I was determined to give him a try here & I did try, hard & long, and it's just not there. 

At Portia's wedding every time he'd take the mic, to make a toast or whatever, he just looked like a product spokesperson! Bring on the Infomercial for ... something! 

11 minutes ago, Vee said:

I would allow Drew to have some semblance of a company on the side but put him back with the WSB/PCPD - he was a Marine/Special Forces/whatever. Which is what they should've done with bearded CM at the outset but here we are.

Bearded CM at the outset was an actual character.  That's really the only acting CM did as Drew.  Once he shaved, he shaved all characterization, and became the spokesmodel/coach.
 

5 minutes ago, Donna L. Bridges said:

Well, they supposedly played on that angle of Drew during Greenville but the character was said to have saved everyone when he really did nothing. 

You meant Greenland and yeah he did nothing!

Edited January 4, 20241 yr by janea4old

1 hour ago, Vee said:

Am I wrong to want Drew recast again after all this? 

Yes.  They created Drew only because Steve Burton had returned (yet again!) and they didn't want to let go of Billy Miller just yet.  Otherwise, he is a pointless character.

(No offense?)

58 minutes ago, carolineg said:

Drew becomes pretty redundant when you have Jason around.

Exactly.

32 minutes ago, carolineg said:

If anything, I find this Drew to be closer to Jax.   He doesn't have the Sonny hate, but CM's Drew has become just a nice, attractive business man.

I agree.

32 minutes ago, carolineg said:

Honestly, if you put aside the Australian thing, CM actually probably would have been better as a Jax recast.    

Well....?

29 minutes ago, Vee said:

I would allow Drew to have some semblance of a company on the side but put him back with the WSB/PCPD - he was a Marine/Special Forces/whatever. 

Then you definitely would need to recast!

Edited January 4, 20241 yr by Khan

1 hour ago, titan1978 said:

I actually found the scenes between Carly and Drew to be very superficial. The dialogue is terrible and very cliched. Laura Wright is doing a fine job acting what has been given to her, as she always does. But the words she had to say lack character.

I appreciate what they are doing. It doesn’t help that I have been watching tons of older Bobbie stuff and what is discussed in the classic thread. I almost wish we would be left with Laura Wright in silence, feeling her emotions while they showed a couple of flashbacks. Because her acting is great, it’s just the lines that are failing them. But letting something breathe is not Frank’s style.

This is my problem with most of the soaps these days. The dialogue is generic, bland, and dreadful. Agreed on those scenes, especially the relentless ADHD pacing. Why can’t they make exceptions when necessary, even if their “research” shows that modern audiences reach for the remote after so many seconds/minutes? Isn’t this a special enough occasion to break the rule? Frank and team have zero confidence in their viewers.

3 minutes ago, Khan said:

Yes.  They created Drew only because Steve Burton had returned (yet again!) and they didn't want to let go of Billy Miller just yet.  Otherwise, he is a pointless character.

He definitely was when they created him - they were just marking time to get rid of Billy Miller once they had Steve back. But to me Jason is the one played out, especially as Steve increasingly resembles corned beef hash onscreen. There's nothing left and fans will never accept another recast, so I would be done with him. Whereas Drew is a blank slate you can mold into any type of romantic leading man you want. I'd take that opportunity.

These scenes with Joshua James (Adam) are hard to watch. His work has been fine to this point, but this stuff today....yikes.

Just now, Faulkner said:

Agreed on those scenes, especially the relentless ADHD pacing. Why can’t they make exceptions when necessary, even if their “research” shows that modern audiences reach for the remote after so many seconds/minutes? Isn’t this a special enough occasion to break the rule? Frank and team have zero confidence in their viewers.

They actually did break it a bit for some of the wonderful scenes with the vets processing Ryan's death last year, IIRC - fairly well-scripted, paced time spent with Lindstrom, Kristina Wagner, JJY, etc reaching into that deep history. But I also always wondered if it was happening because they needed to fill out the episode runtime.

And yeah, Frank has long been a proponent of 90 second or less scenes because he's been obsessed with the teen/youth demo since OLTL and thinks they'll change the channel if he lets it linger. I'm just so tired of it.

1 minute ago, Vee said:

But to me Jason is the one played out, especially as Steve increasingly resembles corned beef hash onscreen. There's nothing left and fans will never accept another recast, so I would be done with him.

I would be done with him, too.

2 minutes ago, Vee said:

He definitely was when they created him - they were just marking time to get rid of Billy Miller once they had Steve back. But to me Jason is the one played out, especially as Steve increasingly resembles corned beef hash onscreen. There's nothing left and fans will never accept another recast, so I would be done with him. Whereas Drew is a blank slate you can mold into any type of romantic leading man you want. I'd take that opportunity.

I wouldn't.  I would give Drew a Mitch Leery-like send-off and be done with him.

2 minutes ago, Vee said:

Frank has long been a proponent of 90 second or less scenes because he's been obsessed with the teen/youth demo since OLTL and thinks they'll change the channel if he lets it linger.

Which is just bullshit, because whether a scene runs for 10 seconds or 10 minutes, viewers will tune out if it ain't written well, directed well or acted well, regardless of age.

4 minutes ago, Khan said:

Which is just bullshit, because whether a scene runs for 10 seconds or 10 minutes, viewers will tune out if it ain't written well, directed well or acted well, regardless of age.

The reason GH ruled afterschool in the mid-late '90s was because of the characters and writing IMO, and those scenes ran long and were impeccably written. I always said you could've put some of the Labine and early Guza years on at night without compromising ABC's primetime pedigree, and I stand by it.

What cracks me up about the pacing is virtually all well regarded and watched drama on network and streaming pace things out almost painfully. We have a genre that traditionally shows the audience every step, but not Valentini. We have an EP obsessed with speed, and yet also not moving things forward. Doesn’t he watch anything else on tv? He makes almost a clip show and is seemingly embarrassed of anything truly dramatic happening. 

3 minutes ago, titan1978 said:

We have an EP obsessed with speed, and yet also not moving things forward. Doesn’t he watch anything else on tv? He makes almost a clip show and is seemingly embarrassed of anything truly dramatic happening. 

His taste and mindset have not really evolved past 2007-2008 IMO. Hence the many attempts at remaking Starr and Cole from OLTL on GH with Joss and [White Guy Here]. I don't think the show is as drama-averse as Y&R, but I do think it often avoids a lot of things for fear of rocking the boat with what it believes is a sedentary, senior or white audience. Which is part of why IMO we see Nina routinely humiliated for being with Sonny in Carly's place, not that I care about Nina. And part of why Spencer and Trina have had such an up and down build.

Edited January 4, 20241 yr by Vee

5 minutes ago, Vee said:

The reason GH ruled afterschool in the mid-late '90s was because of the characters and writing IMO, and those scenes ran long and were impeccably written. I always said you could've put some of the Labine and early Guza years on at night without compromising ABC's primetime pedigree, and I stand by it.

And they were long because Labine used the hour format to let things breathe more, not cram more into it. It was an experiment to her. And Guza inherited a strong writing team that was used to writing those long scenes and filling each episode with depth. Every character had a personality and a point of view, even if they were not explored as well as other characters were.

 

Just now, titan1978 said:

And they were long because Labine used the hour format to let things breathe more, not cram more into it. It was an experiment to her. And Guza inherited a strong writing team that was used to writing those long scenes and filling each episode with depth. Every character had a personality and a point of view, even if they were not explored as well as other characters were.

The Guza I scenes with Luke, Lucky, Bobbie, Carly, Sonny, etc. could've very easily aired in primetime. I'm thinking especially about Luke and Bobbie's confrontation over him knowing about Carly, when they went deep into their past. But yes, it was all often very good. And a lot of those quality writers lingered, and still put out assorted quality dialogue or scenes despite increasing systemic rot, all the way until 2011. Then they were almost all flushed by Frank and Ron.